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Islam and Western Society

Colin P said:
All done legally by people speaking of the Public good and Public Safety, supported no doubt by the "soccer moms" of the day. It is a good lesson that society should be reminded of on a regular basis so as not to repeat again.

Is that not the great thing about Common Law nations, how we can come together and make laws to vilify our fellow Canadians, laws to make ownership of property illegal without any real recourse and all in the name of the Public Safety.  Irish settlers, Native Reserves, Chinese Head Tax, Ukrainians in WW1, Japanese in WW2, and, yes, even firearms owners today.  We do the same Public Safety Warning over and over again and get away with.  We never learn, even our own constitution puts limits on every right we hold so dear. 
 
Lightguns said:
Is that not the great thing about Common Law nations, how we can come together and make laws to vilify our fellow Canadians, laws to make ownership of property illegal without any real recourse and all in the name of the Public Safety.  Irish settlers, Native Reserves, Chinese Head Tax, Ukrainians in WW1, Japanese in WW2, and, yes, even firearms owners today.  We do the same Public Safety Warning over and over again and get away with.  We never learn, even our own constitution puts limits on every right we hold so dear. 

I'm ready for the list of places in the world that do it better then.


....and did you even pay attention to the 70+ year gap in your examples?
 
The enemy of my enemy is my friend?  Has worked for us very well in the last few decades. 
 
Bruce Monkhouse said:
I'm ready for the list of places in the world that do it better then.


....and did you even pay attention to the 70+ year gap in your examples?

We do better than most, but it's a good reminder to the people who like to say; "That would never happen here", well it did and it can happen again. Let's not forget the War Measure Act for the FLQ crisis and calling out the army for Oka for what was pretty much a fight over a golf course. Democracy requires vigilance of those who exercise power. 
 
I think if ISIS enters into Russia ISIS may have some education handed to them and no other country will say boo about how Russia handles them in their own country.
 
Colin P said:
We do better than most, but it's a good reminder to the people who like to say; "That would never happen here", well it did and it can happen again. Let's not forget the War Measure Act for the FLQ crisis and calling out the army for Oka for what was pretty much a fight over a golf course. Democracy requires vigilance of those who exercise power. 

Of course it could..........democracy also requires vigilance of those who would try and subvert it or attempt to take it by force.  See what I did there?
 
 
I prefer the avenue the UK is exploring.  Making the sh1ts who leave for jihaid stateless. 

I like the thought of a one-way door for these dubious citizens regardless of where they were born.  You leave as a radical as some have, you don't come back.  Ever.  If by some chance you do make it back, if and when you're caught you get jugged until such time as you're not able to or going to be a threat to the rest of us.

Better still, treat them as we did this snake. 

Kanao Inouye (1916 – August 27, 1947) was a Canadian citizen convicted of high treason and war crimes for his actions during World War II. Known as the "Kamloops Kid," he served as an interpreter and prison camp guard for the Imperial Japanese Army and the political police, or Kempeitai.
 
>I like the thought of a one-way door...

I like the thought of it being the exit from a fuselage at 3,000 metres.
 
The US for decades had a law that you could be arrested is you served as a mercenary soldier.

It obviously has gone by the wayside, but I know it was in place when I got back as I was considering it....
 
With all the PMC's nowadays that issue could get muddy unless the law stipulated that the marks fought against the USA (which would make sense).
 
What the crackheads in ISIS and similar groups don't seem to have considered is that the US, at least, has a very volatile and polarized electorate. At some time the outrages will cause a tipping point, and the Americans will change from passive spectators wringing their hands to an avenging army wielding the Jacksonian "Terrible Swift Sword". You can ask the Japanese and Germans how that went for them.

And the radicals should also consider that while they strive to make small quantities of nuclear weapons, the United States and the Western Powers made these things on an assembly line. Yes, war material is much more complex and expensive now, but the "Willow Run" assembly plant is still a possibility once people get pushed far enough. Even in our degraded state *we* command far more military, material, economic and intellectual resources than the entire Islamic world (or the Russians, or even the Chinese).

And of course, as alluded, the "Terrible Swift Sword" is also going to be deployed in the homeland. We may not like it, and we may even "know" that it isn't very effective, but if the tipping point comes then all the terrible things that were done to our own citizens in the Great War and WWII will come back in spades as well. All it needs is for the electorate to move from fear to anger.
 
The Burn ISIS Flag Challenge: Outraged Muslims flood web with their version of the Ice Bucket Challenge in protest against Islamic State barbarism

- Pictures and videos showing protesters torching black standard go viral
- Video posted on YouTube nominates the rest of the world to follow suit
-Comes after beheadings of two U.S. journalists and a Lebanese soldier
- Even hate cleric Abu Qatada has denounced beheadings as un-Islamic


BySimon Tomlinson for MailOnline  Published: 10:11 GMT, 8 September 2014

Furious Muslims are flooding the internet with their own version of the Ice Bucket Challenge in protest against the Islamic State - by burning the terror group's flag.  Dozens of pictures and videos are trending on Twitter and YouTube showing campaigners from America to Lebanon setting fire to the black jihadist standard.  The groundswell of disgust comes after the sickening beheadings of two U.S. journalists which were even denounced by hate cleric Abu Qatada.

One image posted on Twitter shows demonstrators in London torching an IS flag with the message: 'Arab World's version of the Ice Bucket Challenge.'  Another shows a middle-aged woman holding a burning flag with the defiant tweet: 'Burn that flag! Kill the flagwavers!'  A video uploaded to YouTube which has more than 100,000 views also urged everyone else to follow suit.  It said: 'I nominate the whole world to the #BurnISISFlagChallenge. You have 24 hours. GO!!'  The movement, which uses the hastags #BurnISISFlagChallenge and #BurnISIS, started in Lebanon with a group of students disgusted by the beheading of one of their soldiers last month.

Yesterday, even Qatada, who was recently extradited from Britain to Jordan on terror charges, condemned the barbaric tactics employed by the Islamic State.  Qatada was once described by a Spanish judge as the right-hand man in Europe of Al Qaeda terror network founder Osama bin Laden.  Speaking to reporters from the dock at a Amman courthouse about the beheadings of U.S. journalists James Foley and Steven Sotloff, he said: 'Journalists should not be killed because they are messengers of the truth.' 
He also branded IS 'a killing and demolition machine' and likened its fighters to 'dogs of hellfire'.

Meanwhile, U.S. warplanes have wiped out Islamic State insurgents menacing Iraq's Haditha Dam with five air strikes that widened what Barack Obama called a campaign to ultimately defeat the jihadist movement.  The aerial assault drove Islamic State fighters away from the dam, according to a police intelligence officer in the vast western province of Anbar, a hotbed of Islamist insurgency.
The U.S. military said in a statement that the strikes destroyed four IS Humvees, four IS armed vehicles, two of which were carrying anti-aircraft artillery, an IS fighting position, one IS command post and an IS defensive fighting position.

U.S. Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel said the strikes on the Sunni Muslim insurgents had been carried out at the request of the Shi'ite Muslim-led central government in Baghdad.  'If that dam would fall into (Islamic State's) hands or if that dam would be destroyed, the damage that would cause would be very significant and it would put a significant, additional and big risk into the mix in Iraq,' Hagel told reporters during a trip to Georgia's capital, Tbilisi.

Obama said on the weekend he would explain to Americans this week his plan to 'start going on some offense' against Islamic State.
'We are going to be a part of an international coalition, carrying out air strikes in support of work on the ground by Iraqi troops, Kurdish troops,' he said in an NBC TV interview.  'We are going to systematically degrade their capabilities. We're going to shrink the territory that they control. And ultimately we're going to defeat 'em.'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2747644/The-Burn-ISIS-Flag-Challenge-Outraged-Muslims-flood-web-version-Ice-Bucket-Challenge-protest-against-Islamic-State-barbarism.html#ixzz3CjAeZ4aQ
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

Nice to see some reaction at last that is meaningful.  Lots of photos and a video at story link.
 
Islam-fascism
https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=G03ddcUs1zQ

Also 3 members of the Muslium Brotherhood in top levels of the White House.
 
On a different note:


http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/north/inuvik-mosque-to-stock-new-food-bank-with-country-food-1.2766377

Inuvik mosque to stock new food bank with country food

CBC News Posted: Sep 15, 2014 7:10 AM CT Last Updated: Sep 15, 2014 7:54 AM CT

They've built Canada's northernmost mosque. Now the Islamic community in Inuvik, N.W.T., is building a food bank in the arctic community.

“Any society where food and cost of living is very expensive, that community needs help," says Imam Abdul Azim. "As a Muslim community it is incumbent on us to extend this help to all the people that live in the North.”

In addition to canned and dry goods, the food bank is working with elders to stock their freezers with country food, such as fish, Arctic char and caribou.

Like any other people they have traditional foods, so we have our system set up where we can access the fish and the caribou — not only seasonally, but the year long.”

The new food bank is being built behind the Midnight Sun Mosque. It will include freezers to store the meat and fish, and is expected to open by December.

“There's a lot of people who cannot afford to go hunting,” says Ruth Wright, who volunteers in the community’s homeless shelter.

“There's a lot of people who have not had kidneys or heart since their grandparents died because they just can't afford to go get it.”

For Imam Azim, the project is something he hopes to see elsewhere in the Arctic.

“Inuvik is just the first stop. It is just the beginning.”
 
I hope they have the sense to imbed the freezers into the permafrost, where they are not susceptible to thawing in the event of a power failures. I does happen, but they have a work around in the event it happens....
 
How can they ask us 'non-believers' to be tolerant, when they do stupid things like this to demonstrate their beliefs:

NYC Muslim Day Parade 2014 Pro-Terror March

One of these days, people will awake to a world their forefathers fought to protect us from.  Tolerance does have a breaking point.  When that day does come, it may likely be very encompassing of all barbarian Muslim Sects, as well as the innocent moderates who did nothing to deny them.
 
that's terrible. I checked out that link...
It's as if some part of certain Muslims refuses to evolve with time.
Weapons and tactics evolved but the mentality hasn't.
Israel isn't going anywhere, women play an equal role in society, education is vital. Wake up!
But I don't blame the moderate Muslims for doing nothing (or not enough) to curb the doings of the psycho/fanatic/extremist clowns. It's not up to me as a christian to denounce an evil act by a christian somewhere else in the world (or even in my back yard). It's up to me as a human to denounce it.
 
Brilliant article from The Telegraph by Kate Maltby
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/katemaltby/100286595/to-understand-isil-europe-must-remember-its-own-religious-history/

Kate Maltby
Kate Maltby is a writer and academic. She has written for most major British publications on politics, foreign policy, culture and theatre; she is also completing a PhD on the intellectual life of Elizabeth I. She is on the Executive Team for Bright Blue, and has recently co-edited Bright Blue's Modernisers' Manifesto, with Ryan Shorthouse and James Brenton, released on April 30th, but she writes in her own capacity.


To understand Isil, Europe must remember its own religious history

How do we win the battle of hearts and minds against Isil, Boris Johnson asked on these pages yesterday?  Well, comes one obvious answer, by pointing out that they do nasty things to anyone they perceive as their enemy. This is the tack taken by the US State Department’s latest video, aimed at US Muslims at risk of radicalisation. The 70-second video points out that anyone who signs up with Isil is likely to find himself complicit in the deaths of fellow Muslims, and then provides a gory show reel of Isil inflicting atrocities amongst anyone they consider an enemy.  “Are you really capable of this?” That’s the implicit message. “Do you really want to go to Iraq, to do horrific things to our fellow human beings?”

Except, as we all know, many of us are secretly thrilled by the idea of doing horrific things to our enemies. That’s the first problem with using atrocity footage to put young men or women off violent Jihad. Particularly – and I write this, shamefacedly, as a doubting-but-pretty-much-believing Christian – especially where religion is involved. The horrors of the French Wars of Religion, just one example, have rather drifted from our school curricula, but my own work as a literary historian involves reading pamphlet after pamphlet detailing atrocities inflicted by Catholics upon Protestants, and vice versa, on European soil. You might not think of it on your next holiday to Lyon, but only four hundred and fifty years ago, the Rhone ran red with Protestant blood.

We modern sceptics used to assume that the worst of these Elizabethan reports were superstitious fiction. The work of Professor Natalie Zemon Davis, however, has shown that there’s solid evidence to believe even the most anatomically repulsive records of atrocities committed at the 1572 Massacre of St Bartholomew, when ultra-Catholics massacred several thousand Huguenot Protestants. And we can’t blame everything on poverty any more. The old Marxist historians like Eric Hobsbawm or George Rudé looked at riots over grain, bread and cotton prices, to show that all crowd violence was fundamentally economic in nature. But crucially, Zemon Davis’s painstaking analysis of every detail we have about participants in religious violence shows that “more often, the social composition of the crowds extended upwards to encompass merchants, notaries and lawyers”. Looking at Isil’s recruits, we should know this already. Private school girls like Amira Karroum don’t fly to Raqqa because they’re starving. Wealthy polyglots like Islam Yaken aren’t rioting for bread. They may be deluded, but they believe in ideas. And if today’s Middle East has a lesson for the way we look at history, it’s that ideas, not merely grain prices, have consequences.

To understand Isil, Europe must remember what it was to be a continent where religion mattered. Zemon Davis also demonstrated that religious violence mimics religious ritual: in what she has termed “The Rites of Violence”, Catholics "exorcised" Protestants by ritually drowning them in rivers instead of simply dipping them in Holy Water; a Protestant child was baptised in the blood of her parents; bodies were burned in incense in imitation of Old Testament rules for the purification of the unclean animals. When Protestants fought back, their violence could be just as ritualistic and dehumanising, but they focused on profaning Catholic relics or mocking the Mass.  The parallels are not exact. In history, they rarely are. St Bartholomew’s Massacre was an incident of urban violence; though well-organised, it was the work of crowds, not a highly drilled Middle Eastern army. But the key point is that religious violence speaks a language of its own. To defeat it, we must break its spell.
None of that makes the religious heritage of Europe sound very appealing. But it is essential to remember that in Europe, with the Reformation, Enlightenment, Emancipation, we’ve moved on. Those of us who still practise a faith – Catholic, Protestant, Muslim or Jew – preserve a sense of sanctity without killing each other over it. Crucially, we’re no longer theocrats: the C of E may tell me adultery is sinful, but the state won’t stone me to death over it. But in moving on too fast, we’ve also lost the religious literacy that tells us why people look to priests and saints for guidance in the first place. There will always be those for whom the post-modern world just seems a bit too fractured, a bit too liberal, frankly, in all its dazzling, confusing choices, a bit too frightening. If we want to keep young Muslims from religious violence, the answer is not secularism, but religious alternatives. The violent history of Christianity shouldn’t be a reason to discredit our religious impulse, but to demonstrate the impossibility of repressing it completely.

And to (sic) despite the State Department’s best efforts, we can’t build the moral case against Isil simply by pointing out the cruelties it inflicts upon its enemies. As Professor Ian Robertson points out, that’s not how out-group/in-group dynamics work. Religious fanatics have always slaughtered their enemies – and for radical Sunnis, that includes the Shia. Instead, it is the mundane misery of Isil’s ideal state that should horrify the world. Amira Karroum isn’t scared of being beheaded, because she doesn’t think of herself as an infidel. But once the glamour of war is gone, does she really want to live in an eternal shroud, forbidden from leaving the house, denied an education? Do young British men – one of whom notoriously asked “Do the mujahideen play footy and that?” – understand that a state ruled by blasphemy laws is a state where a wise crack at the local cleric could cost you your life? Many states are forged in war – not all of them then ban music, art and history in peace time.

It is bizarre to imagine that there are people who haven’t made up their minds about the moral toxicity of the so-called Islamic State. It horrifies me that I type this. But clearly, there are – the flow of recruits alone shows that. So don’t imagine that propagating the slaughter of infidels will put them off. We in the media have enjoyed reporting on stories of war crimes. But Isil aren’t just war criminals. Their peace is criminal too.
 
So all we need to do is wait 500 years for them catch up and all will be good?  Whew, good news indeed!
 
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