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Voluntary Occupational Transfer ( VOT )

BushyCentaur

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Hey guys, I'm currently in Esquimalt on the new Mar Tech course. I originally joined as an Etech and was not made aware of the trade amalgamation until I arrived here on PAT. I'm only a few weeks in to my course right now and I'm considering attempting a VOT - is this still possible or is it to late?

I've received a lot of comforting information about the course but the amalgamation (as well as changes in my life since originally submitting my paperwork) have just changed a lot of things for me. I'm wanting to try for vehicle tech.

Any thoughts?
 

Eye In The Sky

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VOT (Occupation Transfer) isn't what you'd be looking for, you are looking for a VOR or Occupation Reassignment (Transfer is for folks who've served in a trade before, qualified and have usually 48 months of service.

I am not sure if the Basic Training Admin Guide is still in play or if it has changed much since the last version I have (I am not at work right now so can't verify if it's still in use).  However...from the BTAG:

Occupation Reassignment

214. Overview Occupation reassignment is roughly equivalent to occupation transfer (OT), except that it applies to personnel on the SUTL or BTL who are not yet occupation qualified in their current occupation. This includes personnel who were previously qualified in another occupation (eg OTs, CFRs, component transfers, etc). While the basic process is very similar to that for OT, there are some specific policies affecting reassignment which are quite different.  Reassignment, like OT, is an integral part of CF retention initiatives and seeks to balance the career choices and aspirations of individual CF personnel with the legitimate needs of the service.

216. Eligibility – Voluntary Reassignment

Personnel on the BTL/SUTL may request voluntary reassignment as indicated below:

a. BTL NCMs – after BMQ. May apply at any time after completion of BMQ and before completion of occupation training. May only request from voluntary list and may be limited out of under-strength occupations;

e. The trainee shall submit a written request through his chain of command clearly indicating the new MOSID(s) to which he/she is requesting VOR or, if the trainee has no new MOSID in mind and wishes to investigate what other MOSIDs for which he/she may be qualified. In the written request the trainee will clearly indicate what his/her career intentions (release or remain in current MOSID) should the trainee be deemed not suitable for VOR or the trainees decide that the MOSIDs offered are not personally acceptable. Personnel requesting a VOR will not normally be permitted to cease training. However, the Basic Training Manager, in consultation with the Training Establishment, may decide that the trainee will be removed from training if capacity issues and/or administrative or disciplinary problems prove that the trainee is a disruptive influence or otherwise unacceptable presence on the a course.

If this policy isn't in place anymore, there should be one similar to replace it.  Best place for that info (IMO) is the Base Personnel Selection Office.  They usually have a page on the Base IntraNet site and usually have links to the various programs and policies.  If you go onto the DWAN as well and look in the CFAOs, find CFAO 11-12 and see what it says about  MOC Reassignment.  AFAIK, the CFAO has still not been superseded by a DAOD so is still applic policy.

 

da1root

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RADOPSIGOPACISSOP said:
Pilot down as #1
Inf O as #2

Please note that contrary to popular belief this does not mean that Pilot is your #1 pick and InfO is your #2 pick (i.e. you want to be processed for Pilot BEFORE InfO). 

If the CAF needs InfO and you have put InfO down, you will be processed for InfO.  There are cases where the occupations that people list as #2 or #3 are what they receive offers for.  If you want to be processed for Pilot and REALLY only want pilot, leave Pilot as your only selection.  If you then fail the selection process, there is a reorientation process that occurs and that is when you would state that you're interested in InfO.
 

RADOPSIGOPACCISOP

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Buck_HRA said:
Please note that contrary to popular belief this does not mean that Pilot is your #1 pick and InfO is your #2 pick (i.e. you want to be processed for Pilot BEFORE InfO). 

If the CAF needs InfO and you have put InfO down, you will be processed for InfO.  There are cases where the occupations that people list as #2 or #3 are what they receive offers for.  If you want to be processed for Pilot and REALLY only want pilot, leave Pilot as your only selection.  If you then fail the selection process, there is a reorientation process that occurs and that is when you would state that you're interested in InfO.

Based on my experience going through this process, and having worked in recuriting, this is bad advice.

Typically you apply under different entry plans. The occupations within the plan generally all report the same time, so if you are accepted for your #1 choice, it will be given to you first in most cases. Either way, offers are usually open for 21 days, so it's unlikely that you'll be in a position where you have to accept the #2 choice with the #1 not having already ruled you out.

Secondly, if you go through the pilot recruitng i means you have to go through the Air Crew Medical (toronto) and Air Crew Selection courses (trenton) prior to offers being issued. I can guarentee you, if you make it through selection course and the medical, and the pilot selection board chooses you, there's no chance that someone in recuiting goes "no, we're going to make him Infantry Officer".

Finally if you didn't get selected for Pilot but didn't put Inf Officer as a preference, don't expect to be given another trade. Expect that no to your only choice means try again next year.
 

da1root

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Just a follow up, the timing it takes for someone to make it through Air Crew Medical/Selection, an offer for Infantry Officer could already be made.

While the system is set up as "choice #1", "choice #2", "choice #3"; the realistic way to look at it is "choice #1", "choice #1", "choice #1".  I've seen plenty of times where people have picked either Pilot, Military Police, or Military Police Officer - all of which require extra testing - as their #1 pick; and another occupation as their #2 pick be given their #2 pick as an offer. 

RADOPSIGOPACISSOP said:
Finally if you didn't get selected for Pilot but didn't put Inf Officer as a preference, don't expect to be given another trade. Expect that no to your only choice means try again next year.
Please do not give this advise out.  As someone currently working in the Recruiting system I can tell you that the current process when someone does not qualify for their selected occupation is reorientation and the choice to select a new occupation.  In no way do we force people to wait until the new Fiscal Year to select a new occupation.
 

EADAM

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I have a question for you : Why do you want to change Your trade from Etech to VOT because I m red seal electrician and I like Etech  . Currently you are starting your course at esquimalt bc. Did you find something different from what you have expected? Please explain more in order to help you thanks . :cdn:
 

max021

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I was offer a position this year has MSEOP.I will soon be submitting a PLAR in order to have my QL3 wave .I am crossing my finger .
 

BushyCentaur

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EADAM said:
I have a question for you : Why do you want to change Your trade from Etech to VOT because I m red seal electrician and I like Etech  . Currently you are starting your course at esquimalt bc. Did you find something different from what you have expected? Please explain more in order to help you thanks . :cdn:

Well because I joined as an Etech, showed up here in Esquimalt and was told I'm not longer an Etech and am now a Mar Tech and my new course is a year long. That, and they have no idea about any other courses right now outside of QL3 which is quite annoying for somebody trying to plan his career. I get they have a general idea of the where the trade is going and whatnot but I can't get a single answer about the time for anything after ql3 and though I know this isn't uncommon in the military, it's discouraging. Just overall the lack of answers of any sort of what happens after QL3.

Hell, outside of that, I can't even get a straight answer on how much I'll be sailing. Don't get me wrong, I joined the Navy expecting to sail and I understand it totally depends on what ship you're on. But it would be nice to recieve a straight answer on what the average year of sailing is like. IE: non operation, average length of time gone on each sail and average amount of sails a year and whatnot.
 

Eye In The Sky

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RADOPSIGOPACISSOP said:
00183 Plt

Are you a Sig O now?  If you're ACISS like I think, did you go via UTPNCM?

And..congrats!  The blue side is pretty awesome IMO and flying for a living is a good go.
 

RADOPSIGOPACCISOP

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Eye In The Sky said:
Are you a Sig O now?  If you're ACISS like I think, did you go via UTPNCM?

And..congrats!  The blue side is pretty awesome IMO and flying for a living is a good go.

Did a Business degree a few years back. First applied special commissioning plan as Log O couple of years ago but got rejected  ::) I either got better at writing applications or Log O is more selective than anyone could ever predict.
 

mmj32

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Hello everyone.

I became qualified in my current trade about a year ago. It wasn't my first choice, but I decided to give it a shot regardless - maybe I'd love it. A year later and I'm still not really happy with what I'm doing.

I've been thinking about a VOT to either of my first two choices when I first applied (would NOT require a component or commissioning transfer). I've heard that I am not allowed to even request a transfer within 3 years of completing training. I am really not interested in doing this another 2 years. I really tried to give it a shot and had no interest in failing my training on purpose. I also want to still be beneficial to the CAF. I see my only options as:

1) Wait out the 2 years in a trade I don't want to do anymore.
2) Quit the CAF.

I'm not really interested in doing either and I'm feeling like I got trapped in this job, granted it's my fault for accepting. Again, I didn't want to completely dismiss this trade right off the bat so I wanted to give it a shot. I'm doing what's asked. I enjoy the people I work with. I am positive and don't complain about my position at work.

Really, my question is whether or not I have other options? Is this rule somewhat flexible?

Thank you.

** Admin, please point me in the direction to post this if this topic does not belong here.
 

Eye In The Sky

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First, find the latest CANFORGEN on the AVOTP competition...I haven't looked for this years, if not go to the 2016 ones.  You'll find a handful of info on it that should resemble this years (if the 2017 message isn't out yet).  Included in that will be the pre-req's to apply and the reference regulations/policies.

In quick though, unless CFAO 11-12 has been superseded, as an NCM who has completed QL3 training, you'll need 36 months of service completed (for the LOTP - Land Operations Trade Reassignment Program...aka anyone combat arms) or 48 months for anyone not under LOTP.

Additionally, a VOT is something you apply for and its not a given or guarantee you'll get the trade you want;  it is a competitive process. 

If you haven't yet, you should consider contacting the local PSO (Personnel Selection Office);  they handle all in-service selection stuff at the coal face and will have the latest policy and trade availability information at the finger tips.

Ref releasing...that might not be as easy or quick as you hope.  Might be worth contacting your Release Section to find out what the realities of that would be (6 months, not until you complete your VIE..etc).
 

PuckChaser

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If you release it could be up to a year before you can start the process again. You'd already be 2 years into a 4 year service. To further what EITS said about it being a competitive process, you could be told to pound sand if your trade is red, and the trade you want is green. Sigs has been red for years and our OUTCAP is typically 8. 8 people out of 3300 get to VOT into another NCM trade every year. If your trade is smaller, that OUTCAP could be even less.
 
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