ROTP as a 2lt?

[Hodr]

Then please, GO TO EUROPE !!!!!!

Leave now before it is too late............

Very mature.

 

[aesop081]

Very mature.

Thank you.

 

[Hodr]

Thank you.

You are welcome.

 

[Journeyman]

I understand, it's just sad that I have 5 years experience in the Electrical and Mechanical
Engineering field, and it is going to count for nothing since I don't have a degree, I had to
work hard to get the position without one... :-/

Perhaps consider joining as an enlisted soldier. With your experience and bonus-worthy aptitude you should get promoted into the big money well ahead of your peers.

Another option you may wish to consider is having your wife work; I know it's crazy, but they can even vote now!

 

[PuckChaser]

I understand, it's just sad that I have 5 years experience in the Electrical and Mechanical
Engineering field, and it is going to count for nothing since I don't have a degree, I had to
work hard to get the position without one... :-/

You're assuming it counts for nothing. Unless you have a degree already, it will count for nothing as an officer entry plan. If you want to be eligible for semi-skilled or skilled entry, pick a NCM trade that aligns closely with your experience, if that trade is understrength and you have the requisite experience, you'll be getting a nice cheque and a higher starting salary than an officer cadet.

You're digging yourself a hole here, the CF isn't in massive need of people, and we're not throwing money at everyone who thinks they have "good experience" (I'm not knocking yours here). If you're just joining thinking to get an awesome salary right off the bat and free education so you can leave when your obligatory service is up, I think you need to strongly examine why you're joining in the first place, or just not do it altogether. That being said, I'd recommend you ask for a lock, you're going to get piled on by experienced members who don't like what you're saying so far (I'm starting to lean in their direction too). Your question was asked and answered, and your best bet is to find a recruiter and discuss entry plans with them based on your civilian experience.

 

[RCDtpr]

A lot of other countries have the recruiting incentives because they can't fill spots.  We do not have that problem here in Canada.  Furthermore, as an officer cadet in school you are useless to the CF and therefore you are paid accordingly.  As you become more useful to the CF, your pay increases.  Sorry if that offends you...but that's the reality of it.

 

[Hodr]

I will be speaking more with a recruiter.

I mentioned the commitment thing just to counter the "Free" argument, but I am
planning on a long term of service, I was just trying to find a way to make the transition
into the military a little easier.

My Wife is my Grandfather's care taker, so if she works we would have to put him in
a home (thought about it but I can't bring myself to do it), I will be looking into all the
options laid out so far, and hopefully the recruiter will have a few more.

I'm not trying to be disrespectful on purpose, but it have been my experience, there is
always a way to get around an issue or a guideline if you really look hard enough.

P.S.

RCDcpl, that was a fine answer, I only take offence to rude answers, and yours of course was not.

 

[Journeyman]

....there is always a way to get around an issue or a guideline if you really look hard enough.

Ahh, now that's the kind of leadership the CF is looking for.  :

 

[Hodr]

lol, I mean in legitimate ways, not by breaking rules.

I'm referring to loopholes put into place on purpose. 

 

[ballz]

Furthermore, as an officer cadet in school you are useless to the CF and therefore you are paid accordingly.

Actually we're way overpaid ;D

Hodr:

Consider a student line of credit from a bank. That will get you an additional 15,000 per year. Your OCdts salary will be approximentally 20,000 a year, so the line of credit is a nice chunk of change. Yes, obviously you will have to pay it all back, with interest, but hey, that's life. I am sure you can manage to do that when you get your commission and start making the big bucks, considering how many arts students manage to pay it back working at entry-level jobs.

Also, perhaps you may have to consider that with a wife, kids, and ailing grandfather, that joining the Canadian Forces might not be a wise decision right now...

 

[Hodr]

Actually we're way overpaid ;D

Hodr:

Consider a student line of credit from a bank. That will get you an additional 15,000 per year. Your OCdts salary will be approximentally 20,000 a year, so the line of credit is a nice chunk of change. Yes, obviously you will have to pay it all back, with interest, but hey, that's life. I am sure you can manage to do that when you get your commission and start making the big bucks, considering how many arts students manage to pay it back working at entry-level jobs.

Also, perhaps you may have to consider that with a wife, kids, and ailing grandfather, that joining the Canadian Forces might not be a wise decision right now...

I will look into it, thank you.

 

[Ayrsayle]

lol, I mean in legitimate ways, not by breaking rules.

I'm referring to loopholes put into place on purpose.

There are plenty of "loopholes" (as you call them - most of us refer to them as Entry Plans) - but the military has already identified how it accepts applicants and under what terms. If you don't like the terms, or are seeking ways around them - I think everyone's comments speak better then I could.

I'm a new applicant leaving in a few weeks for Basic - and even with a degree I'll be a OCdt until the end of Basic. 4 years of schooling paid for out of my own pocket. I realize your financial/personal situation might be rough but if you want it, you need to earn it. Earn not in your own mind, but in a way the Military recognizes. All the entry plans are laid out on the website and a recruiter is usually available to answer your questions.

Honestly - think long and hard about why you "deserve" what so many of us worked (or are working) for. There is a huge gap between "Deserve" and "Need".

 

[Zoomie]

Also, perhaps you may have to consider that with a wife, kids, and ailing grandfather, that joining the Canadian Forces might not be a wise decision right now...

There's a piece of good advice.  You can probably expect upwards of 6 years of low end salary - 4 in school + at least 2 in training.

You will also find that ROTP is geared towards high school graduates entering school the next year - not married, older, wiser people.

 

[Pusser]

Awesome, thank you, this is what I will have to do.

I'm not so much asking for a huge starting pay and nothing in return, I would just like
something similar to OCTP, they make More as a Cadet, but less than ROTP and 2LT and LT.
an OCTP pay rate would be perfect for me, and in the long run they make to same as ROTP.


I really was hoping we had something similar to a few other countries, which
gives a "bonus" for people with very high aptitude ratings. :-(

You should note that OCTP is no longer offered.  The closest thing to it would be CEOTP, where you are required to pursue a degree on your own time while serving full time.  It's not the rosiest of options, particularly (at least in my opinion) when compared to going to school full time with no other commitments while receiving a salary (albeit a lesser one for a little while).  Once you graduate though, your pay rises pretty rapidly and beyond that of the CEOTP candidates.

 

[CFR FCS]

Hodr,
You did get the briefing on your pay and benefits under ROTP? The one that explains that as a married with dependants soldier you will be exempt from paying rations and quarters while in school. That is the only benefit you are entitled to as is everyone else who is enrolled. It's a little more money in your pocket plus remember your personal living expenses such as transport to and from work ( march or military tpt) and clothing (uniforms are issued) are included in the package. 

 

[Good2Golf]

I understand, it's just sad that I have 5 years experience in the Electrical and Mechanical
Engineering field, and it is going to count for nothing since I don't have a degree, I had to
work hard to get the position without one... :-/

A quick scan of the CF Recruiting site filtering for technologist/engineering background and HighSchool grad/partial College, shows "Marine Engineering Mechanic" as an "In Demand" trade.

http://www.forces.ca/en/job/marineengineeringmechanic-31#info-1

This would certainly make use of the experience you have in the mechanical and electrical engineering technologist fields.  It also notes the potential to qualify within this trade under the "Canadian Forces Subsidized Education Program":

http://cdn.forces.ca/_PDF2010/NCM-SEP_all_en.pdf

Consider ME Mech for a few years, then you could apply for your degree under the UTPNCM.

What others have tried to say, is that your experience only counts when the organizational framework you're looking to join gives such experience preferential consideration.  ROTP does not....nothing personal, just the way that particular plan is.

Interestingly, my son, currently studying at RMC, looks at the "2 for 1" obligatory service after graduation and commissioning as a guaranteed well-paying job (career) that he's looking forward to pursuing.  I guess if people use terms such as "locked in for X years", they are going to be unhappy for those X years.  I have friends still working off student loans nearly a quarter-century after they got their degrees...it's a personal choice to decide how to look at such commitments associated with the ROTP.

Talk to the recruiting centre and check things out.


Regards
G2G

 

[ballz]

Interestingly, my son, currently studying at RMC, looks at the "2 for 1" obligatory service after graduation and commissioning as a guaranteed well-paying job (career) that he's looking forward to pursuing.  I guess if people use terms such as "locked in for X years", they are going to be unhappy for those X years.  I have friends still working off student loans nearly a quarter-century after they got their degrees...it's a personal choice to decide how to look at such commitments associated with the ROTP.

Damn right, I know a lot of people now graduating from BBA and BComm, or in their 4th year of their programs, that would love to sign a 5 year contract that guarantees them to start at 50,000 a year, within 3 years be at 70,000+, etc., and that's without getting their school paid for / salary to boot.

But when it's with the military, apparently that part of the contract is one of the downsides :facepalm: Well, if that's a downside, it sounds like a pretty huge win to me.

 

[Hodr]

Hodr,
You did get the briefing on your pay and benefits under ROTP? The one that explains that as a married with dependants soldier you will be exempt from paying rations and quarters while in school. That is the only benefit you are entitled to as is everyone else who is enrolled. It's a little more money in your pocket plus remember your personal living expenses such as transport to and from work ( march or military tpt) and clothing (uniforms are issued) are included in the package.

That would be a major improvement to the situation, I have also gotten some other information today which would allow me
a few more allowances that would make the ROTP option do-able for me,

Sorry for those who I made angry today, but over all I have gotten the answers out of it I need to make ROTP work for me.

 

[RCDtpr]

Out of curiosity.....what would these allowances be?

 

[Hodr]

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