London attacks underscore Canada's need to be in Afghanistan: Hillier

[48Highlander]

Really cause I was under the impression that, that line of thinking was what enabled past governments into brainwashing the majority of the public into thinking we are "peacekeepers" and which allowed them to cut military spending. :

No, that was "walk softly and never use your stick".  I can see his point.  We don't need to show people how macho we are....but we DO need to let others know that if they mess with us, they'll get stomped.  It's a fine line.

 

[karl28]

I'm a Civy and I am glad that Gen Hiller is in charge of the CF. He seems to now what he is talking about . On another note even with the attacks in London I personally believe that we need to stay the course in Afghan yes it will probably be dangerous but Afghan's needs are help to rebuild . In my Opinion The CF personal are the best ones for that job  . 


Just my two cents worth

 

[Pencil Tech]

I see that CP - in the standard journalistic gambit to create conflict - managed to find that intellectual giant Steven Staples to weigh in with these incisive observations.   Personally I think we should "clarify" if the Polaris Institute receives public money - and cut if off.

My own little rant over.

cheers, mdh

mdh, I noted your very perceptive comment about CP and googled Polaris Institute and Steven Staples. Two things I noticed in interviews with him published there: he says they get no public funding and he complains that he wasn't invited to participate in the Defence Policy Review (awww). I believe that the government knew what they were getting when they appointed Rick Hillier CDS, I'm sure he would have told them anyway if they didn't know!   So the high level of morale that people in the CF are feeling today about the CDS and the defence policy that he and the government are implementing is truly justified. The Polaris Institute is not worth even thinking about. Go Rick!

 

[Second Chance]

Now that's a boss I would be proud to work for.

 

[Horse_Soldier]

In the new reality, Staples and the Polaris Institute are has-beens, and the esteemed aforementioned gentleman knows it - if he doesn't, he's a lot dumber than I give him credit for.  Three cheers for our CDS - and take note, if our government didn't want him to speak the plain truth, he would have been muzzled by now.  Words said cannot be unsaid and a change of tack now by the Martinis would discredit our PM before the country and the world.  The bureaucratic gnomes in the Privy Council Office may not be happy with General Hillier's stance, but from my experience of the bureaucracy, they have been given their marching orders and the General's cogent and direct enunciation of the situation is what the government wants - without the politicians needing to speak non-PC language themselves.  It's pure genius  ;D

Edit: And maybe now we can strike that asinine word "Peacekeeper" from our vocabulary.  We are soldiers, sailors and airmen - period.

 

[Gunner98]

PC'ness indicates - Airmen and Airwomen.   Perhaps another thread could or already has discussed how we set an all encompassing name for Air Force personnel without resorting to Olive Drab, Navy Blue, Light Blue and Purple People.

We could quickly become confused with that cool Blue Man Group.

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

I sure hope he stays his full tenure without softening but he definately has an uphill battle.

 

[KevinB]

TEAM CANADA - FUCK EH!

 

[Teddy Ruxpin]

Is anyone surprised that this was CBC's "Letter of the Day" yesterday...?

LETTER OF THE DAY | July 15, 2005
"Obviously, the bombing and murder that the United States has committed in Afghanistan has not defeated the enemy nor fixed Afghanistan. And now Hillier wants us to join America's failed policy there?"

I am very angry that Canada's General Rick Hillier is spouting the same general ignorance about foreign affairs as the White House.

I do not agree with the premise that Hillier uses to lead to the conclusion that Canadians should accept military casualties in Afghanistan.

His first premise is that the characterization of enemy in Afghanistan as "detestable murderers and scumbags".

This is dangerously misleading and it makes us think of them as expendable trash who we can easily kill and murder.

Furthermore, misunderstanding the enemy prevents us from coming up with strategies and policies that are effective in dealing with the complex problem in Afghanistan.

Obviously, the bombing and murder that the United States has committed in Afghanistan has not defeated the enemy nor fixed Afghanistan. And now Hillier wants us to join America's failed policy there?

Secondly, Hillier suggests that Canada will only be attacked because it's a free country. What nonsense! If Canada gets attacked it's because we are meddling in someone else's business.

General Hillier should be re-educated in the ways of the world or be removed from his post. He has been promoted beyond his level of competence.

He should be protecting his soldiers, not sending them into useless and ill-advised war zones.

Robin Westin | Calgary, AB

If anyone needs a "lesson" in foreign relations, it's the genius that wrote this and, just as bad, the editorial board that saw fit to highlight it as a "letter of the day"....  Perhaps he/she works for the Polaris Institute... :

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

TR your a smart cookie, perhaps you can send an intelligent rebuttal.

 

[Gunner]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/viewpoint/yourspace/hillier_afghans.html

I felt very discouraged after reading the left wing whining of the cbc drones...  Hopefully some of us will write in!

 

[Britney Spears]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/viewpoint/yourspace/hillier_afghans.html

I felt very discouraged after reading the left wing whining of the cbc drones...  Hopefully some of us will write in!

You and me both. Robin Westin sounds like my mother. 



Incidentally, my <a href=http://www.politicalcompass.org/>Political Compass</a> results(-2.10, -1.50 I believe) place me ideologically far to the left of the Liberal Party of Canada, and close to the NDP, and yet, here I am. Now I'm all confused and  need to go sit down and engage in some self reflection.....

 

[scm77]

"These are detestable murderers and scumbags. I'll tell you that right up front," said Hillier.

I would like to apologize to the terrorists on behalf of the rest of Canada and ask that Mr. Hillier please forward his home address to al-Qaeda if they wish to respond to his comments.

Fraser James | Vancouver

 

[bossi]

Ya know what ... I'd like to buy General Rick a drink for this quote:

"We're not the public service of Canada, we're not just another department. We are the Canadian Forces, and our job is to be able to kill people."

 

[The_Falcon]

I need a shower after reading those comments.   Jeez, bush this and anti-american that.   I don't think us right in would do much good, they (the CBC) does read these first, so they would probably screen anything that doesn't jive with their way of thinking.  Some (most) were right out to lunch.  We need to pull troops out and send in doctors, nurses etc.  So when the Taliban comes back who is going to protect them?  The one person who stated we should put our efforts into Africa, like they are going welcome us with open arms?  And the peacekeeper bit, my how quickly people forget history.  It was okay to crush a tyranical dictator in the 1940s, but it is not ok to do the same now. 

 

[The_Falcon]

Ya know what ... I'd like to buy General Rick a drink for this quote:

"We're not the public service of Canada, we're not just another department. We are the Canadian Forces, and our job is to be able to kill people."

Its funny (in a bad way) how most news outlets have omitted that quote from thier articles.

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Is this guy a member here:


I disagree with Robin Weston's ultrasimplified and thoughtless comments criticizing the maintenance of Canada's mission in Afghanistan.

I will destroy each argument presented sequentially.

Re: "His first premise is that the characterization of enemy in Afghanistan as "detestable murderers and scumbags".". What is the problem with this?

The enemy in Afghanistan wishes to defeat the occupying force of Canadian and American soldiers, among others, and reinstitute the Al-Qaeda-friendly Taliban regime.

Instead of the loss of a handful of Canadian and American soldiers in Afghanistan, I believe it would be possible that a reinvigorated Al-Qaeda infrastructure could kill thousands of innocent civilians instead. People who kill and imprison innocents are detestable people.

I don't care what culture they are from; this is an axiom for all humans.

Re: "This is dangerously misleading and it makes us think of them as expendable trash who we can easily kill and murder." The enemy is indeed expendable trash who we ought to disarm or defeat, and yes, it may involve killing.

They will kill our forces and our civilians, and will not listen to soft dimplomacy. They have already crossed the line.

Re: "Obviously, the bombing and murder that the United States has committed in Afghanistan has not defeated the enemy nor fixed Afghanistan. And now Hillier wants us to join America's failed policy there?"

This is a worthless argument. Most people are certainly intelligent enough to understand that Afghanistan is not the only place where Al-Qaeda and other terrorists exist. And it will take a while. Certainly more than 4 years.

But probably less than the time it would take to "understand" the enemy and formulate policies and strategies while the enemy is destroying the social fabric and killing innocent people.

Re: "Secondly, Hillier suggests that Canada will only be attacked because it's a free country. What nonsense! If Canada gets attacked it's because we are meddling in someone else's business."

Perhaps humanity IS our business. Really, it doesn't matter whether or presence in Afghanistan causes attacks on one's country. What does matter is that Canada does not look like a weak kitten that heeds to the demands of people who would kill millions of Canadian citizens if they could.

Re:"General Hillier should be re-educated in the ways of the world or be removed from his post. He has been promoted beyond his level of competence."

How have you decided that General Hillier is not competent? Should we Canadians become isolationist and retract from efforts to put down terror just because YOU say so?

"He should be protecting his soldiers, not sending them into useless and ill-advised war zones." I have not heard any prominent person describe the struggle in Afghanistan as useless or ill-advised.

Why are you angry?

I didn't agree with going into Afghanistan, and I don't think the Americans should be in Iraq. But we made a commitment! Backing down will make us look bad, show the terrorists that we will do whatever they want us to, and allow the fragile nation of Afghanistan to fall under the control of drug warlords and Taliban criminals.

Hillier doesn't want that to happen because he's been there and has seen it happen. Have you been there? Do you want that to happen?

Jeff Imber | Toronto, ON

 

[Allen]

I also submitted my defence of the good Gen. & our presence in Afghanistan to the CBC board - hopefully the editors will see fit to post it.

However, trying to talk sense to these granola-crunching pinko loons is like trying to turn back the tide with your hand.
:

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

I posted as well although admittedly I'm not very eloquent.  The response of the majority on that email reinforces my belief that when we get a bloody nose over there we well be sent packing like the Americans over Black Hawk down, the CDS will be given his gold watch and we as a military will be in the hurt locker with some hippie CDS running the show.

 

[McG]

Ya know what ... I'd like to buy General Rick a drink for this quote:

"We're not the public service of Canada, we're not just another department. We are the Canadian Forces, and our job is to be able to kill people."

It is in the site's quotes now.