Combat Support Company?

[Scoobie Newbie]

Um wouldn't you know? 
P.S.  I have a pic I should send you PNR related.

 

[HItorMiss]

PPCLI Guy,

I was discussing this issue with a senior NCO's and they have alluded to the return of the elements you're talking about  ;D

 

[PPCLI Guy]

PPCLI Guy,

I was discussing this issue with a senior NCO's and they have alluded to the return of the elements you're talking about  ;D

So it must be true then...

 

[HItorMiss]

As true as any rumor that crosses Regiment lines yeah I guess, but I will look further into it next time I'm at Bn.

 

[PPCLI Guy]

The CLS has been heard to say it - and you know what he is like!

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

cheques in the mail

 

[McG]

I heard that 1 VP is going to run a Basic Pnr crse during this PCF Cycle. 

I hope 1 VP also plans to designate one of its rifle platoons as the defacto pnr pl.  That would ensure a mechanism to provide qualified supervision for all the new pnr (to develop and sustain the capability) & avoid skill fade that might come if guys just go back to thier old jobs.

 

[warrickdll]

Just a quick note regarding the dispersement mortar topic.  According to several TO&E's that I've seen, British mortar platoons are organized with three sections of two mortars rather than the Canadian TO&E or two groups of four mortars.  This allows each section to operate in support of a rifle company.  The British platoons have two mortar vehicles and a section command vehicle for fire direction.

This site agrees http://www.armedforces.co.uk/army/listings/l0098.html

And this one has 2 groups of 3 http://www.army.mod.uk/royalanglian/vikings/viking_trades/mortars.htm

I don't know the UK system, maybe they use both?

But, for Canada, splitting the old infantry mortar platoon groups into sections would require either more NCOs or using Group Recce (survey) as Control Posts, or some other option.

If Combat Support Company is coming back, or parts of it, Assault Pioneer Platoon would probably be easier to revive than Mortar Platoon.

 

[big bad john]

In the UK there is no hard and fast rule regarding the dispersement.  In fact right now it is in a state of change.

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Gents my current CF's:

 

[Danjanou]

Geez Quag you got more fricken shoes than my wife does and she used to work for Imelda Marcos ;D

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Not all mine.

 

[Danjanou]

Not all mine.

yeah that's what the wife says too ;D

 

[Michael OLeary]

But, for Canada, splitting the old infantry mortar platoon groups into sections would require either more NCOs or using Group Recce (survey) as Control Posts, or some other option.

If Combat Support Company is coming back, or parts of it, Assault Pioneer Platoon would probably be easier to revive than Mortar Platoon.

Reconfiguring the 2/52 man organization of the Canadian (infantry) Mortar Platoon to operate as 4 two-mortar sections would not take a great increase in manning.  There was enough redundancy to deploy that way if needed, accepting that there was less flexibility for sustained operations in four separate fire units.  Working on a principal of a 4-mortar group as the basic fire unit, with the capability to deploy 2-mortar sections in support of company operations was always, and could again be, feasible.  (Any proposed increase to manning would most likely be best justified by the requirement to survive the attrition of leave and other LOB during operations.)

The recce/survey dets were an anamolous configuration that was (in the end) not justified by either doctrinal requirement or technical necessity.  That particular structure grew out of a proposal for a 120-mm platoon organization which never came close to fruition.  The fact that it was left in the laps of the 81 mm mortar platoon was a grevious error in that it made the platoons awkward and generated an obsessive amount of attention to technical gunnery vice effective skills to react quickly to developing situations and provide effective fire support as soon as posible.  Anyway, the recce det pers were 'stolen' from the FC dets and mortar line to begin with.

The infantry mortar capability could be rebuilt.  One essential requirement, IMHO, would be to remove it from the technical world of the artillery.  They have their drills and approaches, infantry mortars (before the 120 rumours and trials influence of the mid-80s) had their own.  If shooting guns is is compared to the precision and focus of sniping, shooting mortars is close and dirty sub-machinegun work.  As with anything, it would take the will to make it happen and the right people tasked to the execution.  First we need to believe in their usefulness as confidently as the British and Americans do, which is a requirement we seldom achieved on any scale.

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

PPCLI Guy those pics are for you. ;D

 

[Centurian1985]

Geez Quag you got more fricken shoes than my wife does and she used to work for Imelda Marcos ;D

Reminds me of my closet when I was still in...I must have had over a dozen pairs of whatever in there.

To the point, Amajoor made a comment about int with recce.  Its a great idea, one that I believe should be in practice, but you dont need the whole cell, only a single liaison; despite the sense it makes it has yet to gain enough approval to become SOP.

Also, Journeyman noted "on one Kosovo roto, the snipers belonged within the Int Sect, with the IO having direct tasking (and care, cleaning, and feeding) authority/responsibility. I suspect that was a one-off based on personalities and the IO's background." That's part of it.  Most of it is very dependent on the primary mission of the team(s).

 

[vonGarvin]

Quagmire: I didn't know you were a dirty neck! 

Glad to see the axes crossed on sleeves!

Also, to amplify what M O'L said, there is redundancy for the 8 mortars to split into 4 sections of 2.  So long as the pers have the proper qualifications (eg: adv mor), the line NCO can survey, plot data and apply corrections.  He doesn't even need a plotter board or computer.  All he needs is a copy of the firing tables, a protractor and a map.  When the groups split, the Gp Comds and the Pl 2IC can recce BPs (if possible), leaving one section.  The CPOs can do it (two of them) and as mentioned, the Line NCOs (two of them).  LOTS of redundancy for the "close in SMG work" (Nice analogy, Mike!)

Cheers

 

[Mortar guy]

Reminds me of my closet when I was still in...

You were in your closet? Are you out now?

>

MG

 

[Centurian1985]

You were in your closet? Are you out now?

YOU, my friend, are a very bad person!  :tsktsk:

 

[Journeyman]

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