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Traditions. Bottom up or top down

By the time the generation in primary school today gets into the military cursive writing will be at the level of Assyrian hyroglifics in comprehension to them.

This christmas I gave books to my 3 grand nephews and niece. I wrote a little preamble to them in the cover. They all looked at me and said "what is that squiggly line stuff Uncle?"

angry give up GIF
 
By the time the generation in primary school today gets into the military cursive writing will be at the level of Assyrian hyroglifics in comprehension to them.

This christmas I gave books to my 3 grand nephews and niece. I wrote a little preamble to them in the cover. They all looked at me and said "what is that squiggly line stuff Uncle?"

angry give up GIF
Not going to lie, find all caps messages hard to read as well. Had thought we were past that as well, but no, still getting yelled at by OPDEFs.
 
Like hell it isn't. I've seen more then one Adjt flash out their green pen with relish on more then one occation. It may have gone by the wayside but I have seen it over the years.


Msg's require an approved and signed paper copy before they go out electronically. As well as a bunch of other paperwork still requires actual paper before the electronic ones are sent out.

As for signature block there is only one signature block on Msg's the CO's. So everyone else who has to be in the info chain needs to sign the paper copy.


This is why Engineers are the best OOD's. We know when they all are without having to check the msg traffic. That's also a bad EO. Should have briefed the team that it was coming.

Which reminds me of a quote ;)

“Time waste differs from material waste in that there can be no salvage. The easiest of all wastes and the hardest to correct is the waste of time, because wasted time does not litter the floor like wasted material.”—Henry Ford
 
By the time the generation in primary school today gets into the military cursive writing will be at the level of Assyrian hyroglifics in comprehension to them.
So...what you're saying is we'll be the Windwriters? :sneaky:
 
When I was a junior officer in the Regiment pen colours were reserved for certain appointments. I recall that only the CO could use a red pen and the Adjt would use green pen. It could vary, though, by regiment. There were only a handful of computers for word processing in the lines at this time and the primary users were junior officers who had used them at university. Corrections for letters, memos and orders etc would be done on the hard copy draft and passed up and down the chain. So having pen colours for each appointment made it clear who was saying what with each correction/question etc for the person making the corrections at the end of the line if they had questions.

Track comments does that now, of course, but this was a different time. Getting copies made was a big deal, so drafts could be passed along with comments/corrections for everyone in the chain and then sent back down. So there was a functionality to the pen colours at the time but that requirement has since disappeared, leaving the memory of a tradition in the collective memory fossil record of our traditions. So some in an army unit may still use a green pen as a the Adjt or CO but that is because they had heard about it and thinks its a thing. So it is a thing for them.

At least that is how I remember it.
 
By the time the generation in primary school today gets into the military cursive writing will be at the level of Assyrian hyroglifics in comprehension to them.

This christmas I gave books to my 3 grand nephews and niece. I wrote a little preamble to them in the cover. They all looked at me and said "what is that squiggly line stuff Uncle?"

angry give up GIF
Bright side: one day you might need to be able to communicate with your age peers in a manner indecipherable to younger people.
 
Bright side: one day you might need to be able to communicate with your age peers in a manner indecipherable to younger people.
I was asked to print my instructor notes for recruits instead of using cursive which is way faster. The fact that my cursive is so bad that I could forge prescriptions could be a contributing factor.
 
Not necessary but I wouldn't call it ridiculous. It gives instant feedback to the CO on who has signed what when paperwork arrives on his desk. He can see orange for the CSEO, Blue for OPS, Green for XP and know that it's gone through all the different people it needs to without trying to figure out who signed what.

There is no difference in that the XO signs in green for this exact reason, and in the army I believe there is a green pen used somewhere as well (Adjt? Majors? OC?) not sure which position/rank.
Auditors used green in the past.
 
When I was a junior officer in the Regiment pen colours were reserved for certain appointments. I recall that only the CO could use a red pen and the Adjt would use green pen. It could vary, though, by regiment. There were only a handful of computers for word processing in the lines at this time and the primary users were junior officers who had used them at university. Corrections for letters, memos and orders etc would be done on the hard copy draft and passed up and down the chain. So having pen colours for each appointment made it clear who was saying what with each correction/question etc for the person making the corrections at the end of the line if they had questions.

Track comments does that now, of course, but this was a different time. Getting copies made was a big deal, so drafts could be passed along with comments/corrections for everyone in the chain and then sent back down. So there was a functionality to the pen colours at the time but that requirement has since disappeared, leaving the memory of a tradition in the collective memory fossil record of our traditions. So some in an army unit may still use a green pen as a the Adjt or CO but that is because they had heard about it and thinks its a thing. So it is a thing for them.

At least that is how I remember it.
We use to do this thing of initial, posn and date the minutes we entered on the documents. We learned what CO, DCO, ADjt, C Clk, RSM, etc meant. No worry about oh no my red, green, purple, etc pen is gone!!
 
We use to do this thing of initial, posn and date the minutes we entered on the documents. We learned what CO, DCO, ADjt, C Clk, RSM, etc meant. No worry about oh no my red, green, purple, etc pen is gone!!
Minutes are still done that way - the point of colours was so that multiple people could make multiple comments on a document without having to minute each comment. So the CO could tell, for instance, which comments on a given document written in the margins were a Sqn 2IC or the Adjt.

This could apply to a piece of correspondence being drafted and corrected or an external piece of correspondence being sent around for comments.
 
Which reminds me of a quote ;)

“Time waste differs from material waste in that there can be no salvage. The easiest of all wastes and the hardest to correct is the waste of time, because wasted time does not litter the floor like wasted material.”—Henry Ford

I should have been more clear. Non-routine msgs are dealt with this way. Routine ones are PKI signature and email.

I actually save time walking a non-routine msg around. I don't have to hope someone responds to emails quickly, I can just brief who needs to be briefed and get the approval. Also generally those msg's go hand in hand with a plan to rectify the problem in the msg and talking to the team while walking the msg around helps develop a plan. Then when I inevitably have to brief the CO on the issue I have more ammo for questions. Then I can get on with my job fixing the problem that I wrote the Msg about.

This is most common with OPDEF's as its a change to the material and likely operational state of the ship. OPS, XO, and CO all need to know and often I need to have a stop at LOG to ensure we have a plan for parts/people.
 
I should have been more clear. Non-routine msgs are dealt with this way. Routine ones are PKI signature and email.

I actually save time walking a non-routine msg around. I don't have to hope someone responds to emails quickly, I can just brief who needs to be briefed and get the approval. Also generally those msg's go hand in hand with a plan to rectify the problem in the msg and talking to the team while walking the msg around helps develop a plan. Then when I inevitably have to brief the CO on the issue I have more ammo for questions. Then I can get on with my job fixing the problem that I wrote the Msg about.

This is most common with OPDEF's as its a change to the material and likely operational state of the ship. OPS, XO, and CO all need to know and often I need to have a stop at LOG to ensure we have a plan for parts/people.
Ok - yeah that makes sense then.
 
I should have been more clear. Non-routine msgs are dealt with this way. Routine ones are PKI signature and email.

I actually save time walking a non-routine msg around. I don't have to hope someone responds to emails quickly, I can just brief who needs to be briefed and get the approval. Also generally those msg's go hand in hand with a plan to rectify the problem in the msg and talking to the team while walking the msg around helps develop a plan. Then when I inevitably have to brief the CO on the issue I have more ammo for questions. Then I can get on with my job fixing the problem that I wrote the Msg about.

This is most common with OPDEF's as its a change to the material and likely operational state of the ship. OPS, XO, and CO all need to know and often I need to have a stop at LOG to ensure we have a plan for parts/people.

Especially since we're talking CSNI, the chances of someone happening to check their email on a timely basis without being prompted to is nil, so if you're going to have to go bug them about it anyways, you might as well be doing so with paper in hand for approval.
 
Bright side: one day you might need to be able to communicate with your age peers in a manner indecipherable to younger people.
On the plus side fountain pens with catridges are still widely available, and much better than previous ones which tended to randomly explode. I got one for fun and genuinely enjoy the textile feedback of using it compared to computers, and find it sticks better in my head.
 
I've twice been given expensive fountain pens as gifts for being in a wedding party; they're far too nice and far too classy to waste at work ;)
 
We still had colour pens when I retired in 13. The person that had green also used a fountain pen to leave no doubt.
 
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