Ontario Election
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Talk your urban/rural : North/south divides .
Does anyone know when the nextgerrymandering : electoral reapportionment is scheduled
Does anyone know when the next
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Time to move back to NFLD.
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Excellent. Meze, with tzatziki, calamari, souvlaki......
I mean, if we have several more years of the Ontario economy being driven into the ground like the Greeks, we should be able to eat like them, right?
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I mean, if we have several more years of the Ontario economy being driven into the ground like the Greeks, we should be able to eat like them, right?
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I'm sure most of you know: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ontariovotes2011/story/2011/10/06/ontario-election-results.html
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He's not moving forward anywhere, with anything, or anwhere with anyone. He doesn't have a majority. We'll be back to the polls in a year.
It's not that the liebrals are that good, it's that the PC party is full of useless boobs that can't communicate.
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Looking over to Ontario from New Brunswick, is it possible that Ontario is going through, politically, what Canada did over the past few years? First the Liberal Majority became a Liberal Minority, with the NDP having the balance of power?
I'll be in Ontario from time to time to enjoy some excellent Greek food! :nod:Journeyman said:Excellent. Meze, with tzatziki, calamari, souvlaki......
I mean, if we have several more years of the Ontario economy being driven into the ground like the Greeks, we should be able to eat like them, right?
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recceguy said:
I think many people believe the Conservative party has been hijacked by corporate interests. Basically welfare for the richest and nothing for the rest. NDP almost doubled their seats, that is the mood on the street. Liberals were just seen as better than Hudak, not like they were a good option.
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Nemo888 said:
I think you are partially right. The big winners, in percentage terms, are the NDP (70% gain in seats vs 50% for the PCs). But the highjack, which I agreed occurred, was not - nor do I believe it was perceived to be - by Bay Street; rather the highjack was by perceived to be by something akin to the Tea Party. Liberal propaganda worked.
The real highjack took place during the PC leadership campaign. Tim Hudak convinced Tory loyalists that he was a new Mike Harris: clearly he isn't, he can neither connect with voters, as Harris did, nor did he (or his team or the party) have a compelling new idea.
Absent a good idea - which are rare things - Ontarians want moderation, risk reduction. They are, actually, remarkably sophisticated voters. They are willing to elect right wingers nationally and municipally when they understand that the fiscal situation finally requires it or when they perceive that the natural governing party needs a long time out or, sometimes, when they understand the division of powers in our system. But the PC Party rejected the moderate, electable leader and chose, as federal Liberals tried to do, a savior. This situation, wherein party loyalists - who select leaders - are, broadly, father to the right or left (recognizing how little utility those words have) than the general public who speak at general elections bedevils politics in Canada and the USA (and Australia, too, I think): the loyalists select the people they want, not, necessarily, the people who the people want.
:facepalm:
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One more thought on the PC campaign:
Libs PCs
Seats: 53 37
% of the vote: 37.6 35.4
The PC vote was very inefficient - they won big in too many ridings, where they expected to win, and finished second in too many 905 belt ridings. The campaign was popular in rural and small town Ontario, the Tory's traditional (and necessary) base but it wasn't popular enough in the suburbs.
It is clear that Ontarians shifted their votes towards the PCs, to the right; it ought to be a clear message to McGuinty and it ought to bode well for the PCs. But: If McGuinty is honest and smart he will propose policies that the real conservatives will be unable to oppose: that's what Ontarians said they wanted and that will, likely drive Hudak et al father to the right, to a position McGuinty can characterize as extreme, thus giving McGuinty a better hold on the moderate middle - which is where power lies in Ontario.
Libs PCs
Seats: 53 37
% of the vote: 37.6 35.4
The PC vote was very inefficient - they won big in too many ridings, where they expected to win, and finished second in too many 905 belt ridings. The campaign was popular in rural and small town Ontario, the Tory's traditional (and necessary) base but it wasn't popular enough in the suburbs.
It is clear that Ontarians shifted their votes towards the PCs, to the right; it ought to be a clear message to McGuinty and it ought to bode well for the PCs. But: If McGuinty is honest and smart he will propose policies that the real conservatives will be unable to oppose: that's what Ontarians said they wanted and that will, likely drive Hudak et al father to the right, to a position McGuinty can characterize as extreme, thus giving McGuinty a better hold on the moderate middle - which is where power lies in Ontario.
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I think the Liberals did shed some core support - most to the NDP but rather a lot to the PCs. The Liberals went down from 42.25% to (about) 37.6% - a drop of nearly 5%; the PCs went from 31.62% to (about) 35.4% - gain of nearly 3%; and the NDP went from 16.77% to (about) 22.7% - a gain of 6%.
But I think that the Ontario NDP received the benefits of the last vestiges of Jack Layton's death and the preceding Orange Crush. I continue to believe that Ontarians sent a message to McGuinty: change your ways. I also believe that they want him to spend less in order to reduce the deficit, but I admit that the percentages can be read as showing that Ontario slid down the leftward slope.
But I think that the Ontario NDP received the benefits of the last vestiges of Jack Layton's death and the preceding Orange Crush. I continue to believe that Ontarians sent a message to McGuinty: change your ways. I also believe that they want him to spend less in order to reduce the deficit, but I admit that the percentages can be read as showing that Ontario slid down the leftward slope.
Behind the brave face, the Liberals must be more than a little concerned. They went from land slide territory last time around to minority status. Can you say Paul Martin? They were very fortunate that their vote was well-distributed across the province, which saved their bacon. It wouldn't have taken much of a shift to put their seat count in the mid to upper forties, which would have made an election next year quite probable. The NDP had a nice bounce, but no breakthrough, which was the same as the results in Ontario on 2 May. Ms Horvath and her band are in a good position to haggle; it remains to be seen how the Grits will react. Admittedly McGuinty said there would be no formal deals, but that was before the polls closed.
As for the scary Tories, almost a 50% increase in seats is nothing to be sniffed at. Agreed that their vote is too concentrated, the candidate here in Leeds-Grenville, which has been conservative territory since 1919, got 60% of the vote and was about 12,000 ahead of the second place finisher.
As for the scary Tories, almost a 50% increase in seats is nothing to be sniffed at. Agreed that their vote is too concentrated, the candidate here in Leeds-Grenville, which has been conservative territory since 1919, got 60% of the vote and was about 12,000 ahead of the second place finisher.
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Fascinating to again watch the incompentent Ontario PC Party snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. Last election they should have been able to run a cardboard cutout against against McGuinty, and the made their stand on religious schools among other things, and that cost them. I didn't watch closely enough to see what Hudak did wrong in detail, although I'm definitely not a fan of him, but I was pretty sure that the election was his to lose. And he managed to.
What I did like, since my CBCHD is from Ontario, is that the only McGuinty ad I saw was a fairly simple "here's my record" add. No negativity, no slagging other parties, just a list of achievements delivered by a guy who comfortably comes off as a Man of the People. That would have probably won a lot of undecided support.
What I did like, since my CBCHD is from Ontario, is that the only McGuinty ad I saw was a fairly simple "here's my record" add. No negativity, no slagging other parties, just a list of achievements delivered by a guy who comfortably comes off as a Man of the People. That would have probably won a lot of undecided support.
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But, like the Greeks, you'll be hoping the Germans alsoTechnoviking said:
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My take on the election is that it continues to demonstrate the trend found in Federal and BC elections that effectively equates Liberals with power suits and university educated drones. The Tories continue to hold support amongst the Settlers.
The NDP may be the one to watch as they continue with their harvesting of the "Victim" vote. Although they have lost their previous clientele on the prairies as poor farmers became prosperous business owners and land Lords, they are garnering support elsewhere: not just amongst Franco Social Democrats but also, and perhaps more importantly, amongst Natives.
Along with strongly religious families, natives have one of the highest birth rates in Canada and likely will continue to increase in importance as an electoral constituency. They are already a major player in prairie politics (defined as CBG 38 and 41 territory) and apparently are moving that way in Newfoundland and Labrador.
Ontario as 3 provinces: Kenora, Peterborough and Toronto (and Toronto actually needs to become its own province so it can start raising its own taxes).
The NDP may be the one to watch as they continue with their harvesting of the "Victim" vote. Although they have lost their previous clientele on the prairies as poor farmers became prosperous business owners and land Lords, they are garnering support elsewhere: not just amongst Franco Social Democrats but also, and perhaps more importantly, amongst Natives.
Along with strongly religious families, natives have one of the highest birth rates in Canada and likely will continue to increase in importance as an electoral constituency. They are already a major player in prairie politics (defined as CBG 38 and 41 territory) and apparently are moving that way in Newfoundland and Labrador.
Ontario as 3 provinces: Kenora, Peterborough and Toronto (and Toronto actually needs to become its own province so it can start raising its own taxes).
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