MND on The National

[The_Falcon]

Watching The National tonight, Peter McKay was on and spoke on a wide variety of topics, pretty interesting.  A few times its seemed pretty obvious that the Ministers advisors (maybe even McKay himself) surfed this site, particularly when the subject about medals was brought up (ie a medal for those who go outside the wire, and one for inside).  Anyone else watch?

 

[Canadian Sig]

My wife (Who is in the service as well) was dissapointed in his answer to the concerned mother about her son's multiple tours. She asked "what soldiers got besides their nightmares in recognition of mulitiple tours". His reply was that we got medals and numerals on those medals when we did more than one tour. I was expecting him to be better informed about our awards system.

I'm not bashing him by any stretch. I think he does a good job on a tough portfolio.

 

[armyvern]

My wife (Who is in the service as well) was dissapointed in his answer to the concerned mother about her son's multiple tours. She asked "what soldiers got besides their nightmares in recognition of mulitiple tours". His reply was that we got medals and numerals on those medals when we did more than one tour. I was expecting him to be better informed about our awards system.

I'm not bashing him by any stretch. I think he does a good job on a tough portfolio.

Well, he did forget to mention the increase in dollars they receive as their tour numbers go up too. 

:-\

He is well informed as to our Awards System. People do different tours (operations) -- they do get different medals, UN tours under the blue beret and some NATO tour being those that are awarded numerals for the second and subsequent tour on that operation.

Current operations in Afghanistan, are all of the same operation. Ergo, the same mandate = no numerals and no new medal. But, as was evidenced when the operation mandate changed, those pers who are deployed into the area and who switch from one mission to another under it's mandate DO get two medals.

THAT is the way the Canadian Honours system works.

Nothing he said was not factual. Troops may not like the fact that they don't get numerals for 2nd and subsequent rotos into Afghanistan, but that's the way it works.

HELL, we've STILL got soldiers who deployed to Haiti in 2004 with NO medal or anything else to recognize them for that. Four (4!!) years later!! Yet, we've got troops complaining because they don't get a numeral?? Come on now.

Her son has a medal, he HAS been recognized.

 

[Canadian Sig]

While I dont give a damn if they give me a numeral or not for my subsequent tours (hell I dont even really neeed the medal in the first place), the way he phrashed his answer sounded as though he was telling the woman that her son was awarded a numeral for his susequent tours in Afghanistan.

None of us are there for the medals or the money....and if we are then we're in the wrong job IMO.

 

[armyvern]

While I dont give a damn if they give me a numeral or not for my subsequent tours (hell I dont even really neeed the medal in the first place), the way he phrashed his answer sounded as though he was telling the woman that her son was awarded a numeral for his susequent tours in Afghanistan.

None of us are there for the medals or the money....and if we are then we're in the wrong job IMO.

Did the woman specify that she was speaking about her son like this:

"Besides nightmares, what recognition does my son get for subsequent tours in Afghanistan?"

Troops have nightmares from many tours, not just there.

Was she specific?? I don't know I didn't see the episode. Or are we expecting his ESP to be on all the time. Or should the CDS just explained all the intracticies of the Honours & Arwards system to her -- on second thought ... why didn't her SON explain this to her when he was obviously informing her of his heartache with not receiving any recognition for subsequent tours (after all, he must have done so for her to be bringing it up ...).

 

[scoutfinch]

I don't mean to be picky but as any good Pictou county Scot will tell you... it's MacKay, not McKay.

(... and yes, it's a big deal to Scots!)

 

[George Wallace]

Just a point, and one that most have not noticed:  It is a misconception that the MND is responsible for our Troops in Afghanistan.  He is responsible for DND and the CF within the dominions of Canada, not outside; that falls on the shoulders of the Minister of Foreign Affairs. 

Just a little point that seems to be overlooked all the time.

 

[geo]

Very good point George.
But it seems that Mr Bernier was busy talking to the media about Mr Kadr in Guantamo & his having been a child soldier in 2001

 

[time expired]

Ministry of Foreign Affairs,no wonder there are problems.Having
personal experience with this collection of Trudeau-era hangers-on
I can just bet that their priorities are not soldiers in a war zone.
                                          Regards

 

[Teddy Ruxpin]

Just a point, and one that most have not noticed:  It is a misconception that the MND is responsible for our Troops in Afghanistan.  He is responsible for DND and the CF within the dominions of Canada, not outside; that falls on the shoulders of the Minister of Foreign Affairs. 

Just a little point that seems to be overlooked all the time.

I'm not tracking.  Foreign Affairs is hardly responsible for the conduct of military operations outside Canada.  That remains a military/DND responsibility.  At no time does a commander - of any sort - report directly to Foreign Affairs (although the "senior Canadian" - Canada's voice - on the ground could well be an FA diplomat).  The CDS commands all operations and reports to Cabinet either directly or through the MND. 

Foreign Affairs is responsible for the development and conduct of foreign policy on Cabinet direction.  DND provides one of the tools to put the policy into action.

Am I missing a nuance here?

 

[MG34]

While I dont give a damn if they give me a numeral or not for my subsequent tours (hell I dont even really neeed the medal in the first place), the way he phrashed his answer sounded as though he was telling the woman that her son was awarded a numeral for his susequent tours in Afghanistan.

None of us are there for the medals or the money....and if we are then we're in the wrong job IMO.

Well I can tell you I couldn't give a rat's anus about Afghanistan or it's population, I go to look out for my fellow troops and of course the cash. It has a great deal with the motivation to go over there, over $36,000.00 for 6 months , no income tax,a chance to kill terrorists and get some payback for my dead friends,hell yes sign me up again..and again...and again.
  Medals are a fact of military life, they instill a sense of pride and acheivement in our younger soldiers and allow our old dawgs  bragging rights, they place the CV of the soldier on his chest for all to see and seperate those who have done their duty from those who have not, that is far more important than you may think.

Anyhow back on to the topic at hand

 

[George Wallace]

A little crude, but effective...... ;D

 

[MG34]

Much like myself. 

 

[OldSolduer]

I agree with MG34 on this, with the following exception:

I do think we need to be in Afghanistan to stabilize the place. Also, I think its my duty to at least volunteer for a tour there. ITs not right that all my Cpls and Ptes are going and no WOs from our Regiment are there. I like the idead of tax free money too. Killing psychopathic terrorists is also a good reason.