Forces struggling to recruit...

[elminister]

why then can't the CF offer a way for those who are in the CF already a chance to go be officer, by getting a university degree. Like a Sgt, MCpl. They are in for a long time they ain't going anywhere send them to school so we can get the doctors or nurses. I think

 

[canadianblue]

It's the technical and skilled trades that are in short supply; somehow we need to make a convincing pitch to young graduates in these areas that the CF offers an exciting career alternative.

Here's the problem though, in the past five months I have done nothing very exciting. Would I go to the shooting range and practice my marksmanship if I could, of course, but the CF doesn't give me that option unless its on the agenda. As well for the past few months it seems like all the CF is learning your trade like at a school as well as doing janitorial work part time. To be honest my life was more exciting before I joined the military. Maybe if the military could offer some more excitement and maybe some more freedom then it would be better, but then again I'm still only a no hook private.

 

[Canadian Psyco]

I don't really think its the ads, or the method of recruitment, I think its the armys image. every single kid I talk to at school says that the military wouldn't be a good job, no matter how kool the fringe benifits are(aka, blowing sh!t up) they think that the cdn military has stuff from WW2, and has zero good equitment. to get more people to join, we need to start updateing all our equitment(starting with that tac-vest) and getting modern high-quality stuff. that would change the image to that as opposed to being an outdated and useless group of psychos, to a modern fighting force offering secure, and self fullfilling carrers for people.

 

[kincanucks]

why then can't the CF offer a way for those who are in the CF already a chance to go be officer, by getting a university degree. Like a Sgt, MCpl. They are in for a long time they ain't going anywhere send them to school so we can get the doctors or nurses. I think

It is called University Training Plan for NCMs (UTPNCM) and Military Medical Training Plan (MMTP).

HH and DA

 

[Steve 1 RNFLDR]

Futuretrooper,
Not so long ago, I found myself in a similar dilemma, being a sig op at PRETC (SuperPAT, PAT battalion, etc).  I'm assuming that you're still in Borden.  I was stuck there back in 2003-2004.  I found it absolutely maddening sitting around and doing nothing, waiting for a course.  Find a way to keep occupied.  Write memoranda requesting OJT/EWAT. 
Believe it or not, things do get better.  The trade course in Kingston is a good time, and you've got a decent change of getting a tour in sometime before your first contract is up, what with the current operational tempo.  Going overseas makes it all worth while.  Gives a fellow a terriffic sense of purpose, even if he's stuck on camp most of the time.
I guess I'm in no position to lecture you, given that I decided to go reserve infantry at the end of my first contract, but keep an open mind.  You'll find that you can get a lot out of the sig op trade if you're willing to put enough into it.
Cheers

Steve
1 RNFLDR
Former sig op with 2CMBG HQ & Sig Sqn

 

[Navy_Blue]

How can the military offer you more excitement when your barely trained??  My first six months was great, a paid trip to Victoria I was a pat for a month and then on my QL3.  Wasn't in Halifax a three months and I hitched a ride to the middle east on the Montreal.  Back another 3 months and I was on my QL4, than a trip north, a NATO and back at school for my QL5.  I got my boarding party course and when I go back to a ship I expect a dive course shortly after.  My first four years has been a none stop whirl wind tour.  You get as much excitement as you can beg borrow and steal your way into.  Its all in what trade you get con'd into my friend.  We're not in the middle of a real big conflict, really you should be happy your getting paid decent and really don't have to work all that hard for your pay 95% of the time.  I worked on civi street for two years and as an ET I have never made easier money than I do when my ship is tied up or I'm on course.

I think if you want trades people we should be calling the schools and courting them like industry does.  Show them what they can be where they can go and pay there schooling if we don't need to train them.  It then comes down to a medical and backround check.  No need for testing if they have a diploma for Electronics.  Basic training and off to a unit.  I don't like the Idea of giving them there Cpl's or LS but max out Pte pay for them and advance them if they get there training done quickly.

It may not be bad to confidentially offer/force trades training to young offenders and offer/enforce a short contract.  In some cases it might give a kid a chance he may otherwise never consider or even get.  A segregated BMQ with extra time with social workers and then extra time with the course staff getting there butts kicked.   2 years in jail vs 5 yrs in the CF.  Its been done in the past with the CF and I have personally worked with some of the people who were forced into a career in the forces (WO's and CWO's now).

Personally I think the country as a whole would see untold benefits by conscripting.  We could pick and choose all our people and the ones who have no intrest in the CF will leave with some good values and a different look at how the world works.

Just my thoughts

Cheers

 

[Nemo888]

So what do you consider a Checker Board Past, and why should your attendance for the last 4 years at Oxford (U.K) or Harvard (U.S) be a detriment in your processing.

Maybe a youth with a colored past but wants to turn his life around (the Services would be just the place) should be exclued from the roster.

It appears you favour "Guilt by Association", I know many a fine Police Officer who has come from a Family , that some might think less than desirable, through no fault of theirs. Then why don't we take it a step further, lets disqualify any one who knows someone who has used a illegal substance and not reported them to the authorities.

Also, if your so vocal about CF's recruitment standards, you can do us the courtesy of where its coming from and fill in you profile.

I have one of those checkered pasts. Wrote that I smoked pot on my application forms, signed a paper admitting to that fact in front of an officer. They asked me a few questions, problem solved. The standards for Enhanced are extremely low, if you can't get that,... But yes I see the other side too. I know some old timers from the days when it was prison or the Army and they did turn their life around. But for every one of those you get a few like those reserves who beat that homeless guy to death in front of the Armoury in Toronto.

 

[TCBF]

So, howcome THEIR regiment doesn't get disbanded?

 

[canadianblue]

I'm in Kingston right now, but in all honesty for the most part it still is boring, its a good group for the most part that I am with. But in the end I'd still prefer a civie job, and perhaps doing some time in the reserves as I would have gotten the same oppurtunities for deployment, as well while the military would have been a part of my life, its not my whole life. If you want to get more people into the military allow them the chance to live more independantly once their done their Basic, and SQ, if a person wants to live off base and pay for their food, why not as long as they are still operating at a good measure as well as meeting all timings. Also recruits while in training should still have the same discipline, [defaulters], and if they screw up they must realize the consequences. As well I still don't see the need for open locker inspections at this stage, personally cleanliness inspections should be good enough as long as a recruit is able to keep up with the maintenance of kit as well as not damage a room, etc.

Thats my own personal opinion of it though.

 

[TCBF]

On the old TQ 6A Tank Commander's Course - a 13 week course that qualified 011 Crewmen to Sgt - the Drill/Mil Law phase had daily room inspections: Open lockers, plate/cup/kfs/mask/webbing/Rifles or SMGs stripped on the beds, drawers stepped, socks rolled, etc.  Not to mention floors highly waxed.  This was for course candidates who were MCpls. 

 

[big bad john]

Suck it up!  This is not a job.  You're not 9 to 5ing it in the civie world.  It is part of the sacrifice that you make to be a soldier.  I had to "Live In" during a Staff Officers course, all of us were Captains no less.  You get your orders and you deal with it.  Things will change when you get to a unit, you are still in training.  All in all it is what YOU make of it, not what it makes of you!

 

[canadianblue]

Well, I'm just making the best of my time in, as well as looking at what post secondary I can do on my own time if I get sent to Petawawa or Edmonton. As for being a soldier, I loved my time while I was in the field in Basic as well as for the short SQ I did in Gagetown but the thing is though its not much part of the job and I haven't done anything close to learning about that for quite a few months, more or less I find the negatives outweigh the positives of military life. As for getting the military to pay for college, not likely, from what I've been told the only way to get the military to give any funding for schooling is if it is related to your trade, if not too bad you have to pay on your own dime.

 

[Enzo]

FutureTroop...

Honestly, I don't mean to offend; but shut up and suck it up! Buddy, I'd practically give a nut to be where you are currently. Do I emphathize with your routine of Borden, sure. Been there, as have many. Hell, I was stuck in Meaford bored out of my mind, Borden seemed like Vegas. But you need to see that there is a light at the end of the tunnel. You're stuck on base collecting pay and finding yourself with too much time to think and access to the net, c'mon. Try being one of us who are stuck awaiting for the bureaucracy to allow them their chance to return to the fun. Hell, justice has nothing to do with it, such is life. I have to redo SQ (as it's now called) and instead of bleating about, "how I have to take the c**k again" my mindset is more along the lines of, "cool, new tactics and a C7A2 to play with".

You should spend more time reading buds. Books are cheap, readily available and only require light to operate. The point there is that you have an imagination; instead of wishing for what may one day be, accept that you made a committment (like a marriage) and for better or for worse, you've have an obligation to fulfill. If you need to continue to vent, then focus on what's really pissing you off and maybe someone can figure a way to sort you out.

P.S.

If you're pissy and it shows, might explain why it feels as if you're in the doghouse.

 

[big bad john]

Now that's two of us in two different threads that have told you essentially the same thing.  Please get the message and get with the program lad.  SUCK IT UP and grow a pair.   Thank you rant over.  You never have a Cpl or a Sgt when you need one.  Someone counsel this lad or have I just.

 

[S McKee]

You just did, and yes how much excitement do you expect to get as an untrained Pte. Give it a few years get your training and learn about the military first, what did you expect man? They were going to sign you up, hand you a gun, a box of grenades... have at 'er?  A lot of this has to do with the attitude of the "I want/need it now/instant gratification generation." As you were.....

 

[FastEddy]

I'm in Kingston right now, but in all honesty for the most part it still is boring, its a good group for the most part that I am with. But in the end I'd still prefer a civie job, and perhaps doing some time in the reserves as I would have gotten the same oppurtunities for deployment, as well while the military would have been a part of my life, its not my whole life. If you want to get more people into the military allow them the chance to live more independantly once their done their Basic, and SQ, if a person wants to live off base and pay for their food, why not as long as they are still operating at a good measure as well as meeting all timings. Also recruits while in training should still have the same discipline, [defaulters], and if they screw up they must realize the consequences. As well I still don't see the need for open locker inspections at this stage, personally cleanliness inspections should be good enough as long as a recruit is able to keep up with the maintenance of kit as well as not damage a room, etc.



That's my own personal opinion of it though.

Well Futuretrooper, at least your honest about your disenchantment with the Military. You emphasize on your boredom. IMO you then have far to much time on your hands and not knowing the Syllabus of your Training or Trade, I can't comment on why that is so. As far as open locker inspections, you have no idea what Chicken Sh?t is (but I regress).

Individuality, forget that term, its not applicable to you. You're in the Army and that encompasses all the Good, Bad, Boring and Terrifying Days that might lay ahead of you.

You still haven't mentioned what prompted you to seek a Military Career or what you expected. Or what is so different.

Life is considerate, it usually offers you several choices in a matter, in your case its stay in the Army and enjoy what ever it brings, or get out at the end of your time.

But I can assure you Civi Street in not all its cracked up to be. I can attest to that, I'd give anything to go back and undue a BIG mistake, getting out !.

Cheers.

 

[FastEddy]

I have one of those checkered pasts. Wrote that I smoked pot on my application forms, signed a paper admitting to that fact in front of an officer. They asked me a few questions, problem solved. The standards for Enhanced are extremely low, if you can't get that,... But yes I see the other side too. I know some old timers from the days when it was prison or the Army and they did turn their life around. But for every one of those you get a few like those reserves who beat that homeless guy to death in front of the Armoury in Toronto.

That seems a bit of a weak reason to sort and categorize a standard for rejection. By your reckoning I presume you have statistics to that effect.

Are you aware of those Idiots social background. They could be very well from a good environment.

Just like the young man who drag races his BMW and crashes killing Innocent Vitim's. Or the Drunken College Students driving home from the Frat House who hit and run, killing a Cyclist.

 

[canadianblue]

You never have a Cpl or a Sgt when you need one.  Someone counsel this lad or have I just.

No thanks, the last ones that did counselled me for following another NCO's orders, and then proceeded to give me the appropriate punishment for themselves screwing up. Usually I try to stay clear of trouble, and just finish my contract and get out. As well, I'm just going to make the best of the situation and get some part time studies in as well as hopefully volunteer work with a police service to make the next few years worthwhile.

 

[George Wallace]

Just a quick note to tempest77

You may want to try harder with your spelling........."Forces stuggling to recruit..." has garnered a lot of attention so far on what I hoped you meant......"Struggling".  I fixed it for you.  All posts, except quotes, should have the correct spelling now.....  ;D



....Or is stuggling a new term for something completely different, and we all missed it?

 

[wookie11]

What about the drug policies?
I knew a guy who could not join when he told the interviewer that he has done 'magic mushrooms' in the past during the interview.
Citing the reasons of flashback, his file was closed, and he was told not to apply again.
I knew the guy, all around a good guy with decent life.
I don't know if shrooms would give you flashbacks or not, but it was done in the past, and should not prevent recruits from joining.
My thoughts, CF lost a good recruit because of this policy.