C6 ejection system

[2ndChoiceName]

From what I've read about on the FN MAG, in any of it's incarnations, C6, GPMG, M240, everyone loves them. But one question. Can anyone tell me why FN designed it to eject out the bottom? Even if it was designed from the start as a vehicle weapon, it still doesn't make sense to me. Why didn't FN just go with a side ejecting system?

-2ndChoice

EDIT: Could someone maybe move this to the weapons and ammo forum?

 

[RCR Grunt]

Is there something wrong with ejecting out of the bottom?  Would ejecting out of the side make any kind of real difference?

Personally I don't see what the issue is.  Belt in the left, link out the right, brass out the bottom, bullets out the front... seems legit.

 

[George Wallace]

From what I've read about on the FN MAG, in any of it's incarnations, C6, GPMG, M240, everyone loves them. But one question. Can anyone tell me why FN designed it to eject out the bottom? Even if it was designed from the start as a vehicle weapon, it still doesn't make sense to me. Why didn't FN just go with a side ejecting system?

-2ndChoice

EDIT: Could someone maybe move this to the weapons and ammo forum?

Let me see now.  I am not sure what you are really trying to ask.  Are you at all familiar with how the C6 really operates and how it is designed?  I mean, do you really know how the operation of the machinegun works?

The "belted ammo" is fed in from the side.  The belt's "links are stripped" and ejected out the other side of the machinegun as the "rounds (bullets) are picked up" by the bolt and carried downward and forward into the chamber.  As the round is fired, forcing the bolt back, the casing is ejected downward as another round is being pulled from the belt links. 

I have no idea of what you are thinking, if you understand the operation of the machinegun.

As for where the links and casings go when machineguns, and even cannons, are mounted in vehicle turrets, there are chutes and sometimes bags to collect the spent casings and links.

 

[aesop081]

Personally I don't see what the issue is. 

I don't see the problem either, and i have fired the C6 plenty.

Maybe the OP would like to share with us the experience that has led him to think there is a problem ?

 

[2ndChoiceName]

I don't mean to say that the C6 is not a good weapon, or that I have any personal experience with them, it just occurred to me that it seemed unorthodox, since most automatic weapons eject out the side. The only problem I could see with the downwards ejection is just that it would be difficult to fire it from the shoulder in a standing position because the natural place for your hand to go is where hot brass is coming out. Again, I don't really see it as an issue, I was just curious as to why it was like that and if it offered any advantages or disadvantages.

 

[Nfld Sapper]

If I am not mistaken even the .50cal ejects the casings to the bottom.....

 

[Jarnhamar]

I don't mean to say that the C6 is not a good weapon, or that I have any personal experience with them, it just occurred to me that it seemed unorthodox, since most automatic weapons eject out the side. The only problem I could see with the downwards ejection is just that it would be difficult to fire it from the shoulder in a standing position because the natural place for your hand to go is where hot brass is coming out. Again, I don't really see it as an issue, I was just curious as to why it was like that and if it offered any advantages or disadvantages.

If you're strong enough to fire the 26 pound C6 machinegun from the standing position you're probably tough enough to shoot it from the standing position one handed, so having your other hand in the way is a moot point. AMIRITE?

 

[Sythen]

it would be difficult to fire it from the shoulder in a standing position because the natural place for your hand to go is where hot brass is coming out.

The natural place to hold it when firing from the shoulder (extremely rarely done in any case) is the bipod. Have you ever seen or held a C6 before, because I have no idea why you'd think it would be natural to hold it there?

I do agree with him though that I think it would be better for it to eject from the side, like the C9. Sucks after you've put a few boxes through the C6 having to shove a pile of brass away as its built up too high, and it gets in the way. Not a huge issue, but still inconvenient.

EDIT: Actually, thinking about it more, I am way off.. Been forever since I fired a C9, so not even sure if I am right about it coming out the side.. Just ignore me.

 

[cupper]

since most automatic weapons eject out the side.

Those with more experience or knowledge can correct me if I'm wrong, but what you are describing is applicable to a magazine fed weapon, not a belt fed weapon.

For weapons which the ammo is fed from a magazine, only the spent casing needs to be ejected, so typically it is ejected up and out to the side as the bolt moves back, then picks up a new round from mag and pushes it into the chamber and locks into position.

As described previously, with belt fed weapons, you need to deal with both the spent casing and the belt clips.

 

[aesop081]

or that I have any personal experience with them,

The only problem I could see with the downwards ejection is just that it would be difficult to fire it from the shoulder in a standing position because the natural place for your hand to go is where hot brass is coming out.

:

Thanks for coming out.......

 

[2ndChoiceName]

Yes, I have held a C6, albeit briefly, at a CF exhibit at the Sportsman's show. That's where the idea for this thread started, I picked it up and put my hand on the bottom and the guy there immediately corrected me and told me that that's where the shells came out, and I thought that it was kind of odd. I'm pretty sure weapons like the C9 eject both the links and the shells out the side, but from different "ports". Again, it's not really the ergonomics of the bottom ejecting system that I'm contesting, but just why it was chosen over having it eject sideways. The standing while shooting this was just a little extra thing that I thought of while I was typing.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

It was based on a long used and successful John Browning design. It is one of the most widely used machine guns in the world.

John Browing was one of the most prolific firearms designers in the world. He was a master of design and invention.

That's the way it was designed.  You've had the action and reason explained to you a couple of times, by people that have extensive time on the gun.

That's the way it is. Let it go.

Or dig John Browing up and ask him.

Milnet.ca Staff

 

[brihard]

I don't mean to say that the C6 is not a good weapon, or that I have any personal experience with them, it just occurred to me that it seemed unorthodox, since most automatic weapons eject out the side. The only problem I could see with the downwards ejection is just that it would be difficult to fire it from the shoulder in a standing position because the natural place for your hand to go is where hot brass is coming out. Again, I don't really see it as an issue, I was just curious as to why it was like that and if it offered any advantages or disadvantages.

There are some rare individuals - call them vikings, if you will, or arguably warrior poets - who can manhandle a C6 fired from the shoulder. These men lay waste to all before them, and make our foes tremble. You won't read of their deeds, because no journalist has witnessed their prowess and maintained his sanity.

Since these men don't feel pain, it's utterly irrelevant that the hot casings eject downwards onto their hands and wrists- in fact that's part of their hardening process from the earliest years of infancy. They are accustomed to it as you or I will never be.

Us mere mortals, though - namely, almost every soldier I've ever met - recognizes that shooting the C6 from the shoulder is generally to be considered silly and ineffective. Save for those who suffers from fantasies of being beowulf, most just plonk it down on its bipod, tripod, or vehicle mount as it's designed to be used. We, unfortunately, must substitute raw muscular awesomeness with proper employment of the weapon and knowledge in the art of machine-gunnery.

 

[2ndChoiceName]

Okay, I can accept that that is the way it is. I was never arguing that it was a bad system or anything of the sort. It just struck me as odd that it ejects out the bottom, and I thought the people who shoot C6s for a living could maybe tell me why. That's all.

 

[brihard]

Okay, I can accept that that is the way it is. I was never arguing that it was a bad system or anything of the sort. It just struck me as odd that it ejects out the bottom, and I thought the people who shoot C6s for a living could maybe tell me why. That's all.

'Cause that's how the weapon was designed and functioned, and it works very effectively that way.

 

[2ndChoiceName]

All right then.

 

[aesop081]

Ok, let's talk about why the bullets come out the front.......

>

 

[brihard]

Ok, let's talk about why the bullets come out the front.......

>

Because they're insolent.

 

[2ndChoiceName]

I'm more partial to the discussion as to why grenades explode 

 

[medicineman]

I'm more partial to the discussion as to why grenades explode 

They have short fuses.

MM