Your home FAK (First Aid Kit)

[X Royal]

Can't speak for all provinces but some of the equipment & supplies listed in some of the above kits require a medical directive to use in Ontario for non family members (ie: casualties found on roadside or disaster scene's).
-Although changes to using "publically accessible AED's" allow anyone to use them, if you own it you need training & a medical directive . Not easy to get if you just want to carry it for possible use.
-Most med's listed above also require a medical directive to supply. Assist them with their own med's = OK. Supply med's = No.
Just went through this recently with the flood evacuations from northern Ontario. Although I hold a medical directive to use the St. John Ambulance AED's, special medical directives were issued by a MD at the District Health Unit to cover the supply of certain over the counter drugs. If their was no medical directive for the over the counter drug you were not covered to supply.

Pro Patria: Rick

 

[Armymedic]

SMMT,

I agree whole heartedly with your comments. In my case I often travel more then 4 hours from the closest ambulance (Yellowknife- Hay River- Ft Simpson NWT) and currently I am on a SAR / disaster response team as a medic. However, all my kit fits into 1 small bag.

I see your need. That makes sense.

 

[ArmyGuy99]

Home Kit

Costco Special, Has everything you need:

Cold Packs,
Burn Relief Gel
Insect Sting Relief
Antiseptic Wipes
Alcohol Wipes
Iodine
2x2
4x4
2x3 non-adherent
8x10 Trauma
4" Pressure Bandage
Tons of Band Aids
Cotton tip Applicators
Safety Pin
Scissors
Tongue Depressors,
Elastic Bandage
Conforming Gauze
Triangular Bandage
Gloves
Tape
CPR Mask

First Aid Book


Wow, that's a lot of stuff.  I only use the band aids and alcohol swabs.

For the car:

Basically the same thing, although I have lots of gauze, and bandages, and pressure bandages, triangulars, Stethoscope, Adult Regular BP Cuff.  That's it.  I don't carry anything that might temp me to go into PCP Protocol with drugs or IV's.  That way there I know that I'm covered by the Good Samaritan Acts etc..

Oh and the most important thing I carry for emergencies.  My cell phone so that I can call the people who are licensed in this great province of Ontario and they can risk the law suit.  For me, I'll stick with First Aid until I finally qualify to challange the AEMCA.  Besides First Aid is the most important thing you can do, next to calling for help.

 

[NL_engineer]

Mike, this will give you an idea of what should be in a FAK

 

[Mike Baker]

Mike, this will give you an idea of what should be in a FAK

Thanks for the link, never see that one before.


Baker

 

[mudgunner49]

That's exactly the 2 considerations you should have.

As for the rest: AED? Sure, if you got a family member who has a cardiac condition...
O2?  BP cuff? You running an ambulance? Hard collar? Got a spine board for that.

Unless you in the wilderness or way off the beaten path for your 911 service, all this extra crap looks nice, cost plenty and really does not add any value.

I do not carry O2 or a hard C-collar. BP cuff is great for monitoring, but I don't carry it in my "little" med bag (got a radial pulse...got a decent BP).

I teach, and much of the stuff is required by the program.  I did not list the SR meds that are carried as they do not fit in the FAK list (OK, the AED doesn't either, but I spend a lot of time around folks who are high cardiac risks... ), and I do carry StifNeck Selects because our doc says we will (Yes, I have medical direction/authorization/oversight 8)).  My "trunk" is the back of a Chev Avalanche (company wheels - very cool when you don't pay for gas) and it's not nearly full.  I do have a backboard but seldom pack it unless specifically teaching board routines - it's hard to do one up on your own which I frequently am.

WRT the AED - In March 2005 the Ontario College of Physicians de-regulated the act of defibrillation for members of the public but left in place the need for certification and training for anyone classified as a "targeted responder" (1st responders, paramedics, FF, etc).  As a result you don't need medical direction to defibrillate in a public setting.  This makes a lot of sense as by the time you dig out the box of "Dr. Edison's Medicine" your patient is clinically dead and you really can't harm them any more (i.e. - you can't make them "more dead").  Defibrillation is still the "definitive clinical intervention in the pre-hospital environment" for persons in cardiac arrest and time is critical - 70+% of SCA's have a shockable rhythm for about the 1st 4 minutes.

I do carry a full diagnostic kit, but agree wholeheartedly that unless you are monitoring for extended periods they are really a non-value added piece of the whole kit.  "Radial pulse = good BP" is usually good enough for me.

As far as training and need go I also agree.  Could I get by with less?  Sure I could - the more you have in the toolbox between your ears the less you need in the toolbox in your hand.  But s I stated before I am directed to have this stuff (and more) on hand.  When I worked SAR I had everything that I really needed in the PSP Rescue Pack.  Much of the extra, aside from being mandated, is "nice to have" as opposed to "need to have".  On the other hand, I've never yet been found wanting for something at a scene...

Both my travel and home location frequently put me in locations where EMS response times are "less than optimal" and as a result I use this stuff fairly frequently... ;D


blake

 

[Armymedic]

I teach, and much of the stuff is required by the program.  I did not list the SR meds that are carried as they do not fit in the FAK list (OK, the AED doesn't either, but I spend a lot of time around folks who are high cardiac risks... ), and I do carry StifNeck Selects because our doc says we will (Yes, I have medical direction/authorization/oversight 8)). 

Ok, seen.

You should state that at the begining of your post that you have this stuff because it is part of your company madated equipment, and that you are taught and tested on the equipment you carry. Without that people read your list and think, "hey thats cool, I want to have it too." Of course they don't realize that unlike cool looking army gear, not knowing what your doing with cool medical gear will help people become just as dead.

But your are absolutely right about this:

the more you have in the toolbox between your ears the less you need in the toolbox in your hand.

BTW to all,
I might be addressing mudgunner49 above, but this is a statement to all: Improper and/or ignorant use of any equipment can cause harm.

 

[mudgunner49]

Ok, seen.

You should state that at the begining of your post that you have this stuff because it is part of your company madated equipment, and that you are taught and tested on the equipment you carry. Without that people read your list and think, "hey thats cool, I want to have it too."

But your are absolutely right about this:
BTW to all,
I might be addressing mudgunner49 above, but this is a statement to all: Improper and/or ignorant use of any equipment can cause harm.

Yeah, I should have made the disclaimer.  Then again, maybe I just like to lead people on - big tease that I am... ;D

 

[X Royal]

WRT the AED - In March 2005 the Ontario College of Physicians de-regulated the act of defibrillation for members of the public but left in place the need for certification and training for anyone classified as a "targeted responder" (1st responders, paramedics, FF, etc).  As a result you don't need medical direction to defibrillate in a public setting.  This makes a lot of sense as by the time you dig out the box of "Dr. Edison's Medicine" your patient is clinically dead and you really can't harm them any more (i.e. - you can't make them "more dead").  Defibrillation is still the "definitive clinical intervention in the pre-hospital environment" for persons in cardiac arrest and time is critical - 70+% of SCA's have a shockable rhythm for about the 1st 4 minutes.
blake

Yes the use of AED's in a public setting has been deregulated. The key point is that the AED must be accessible to the general public. If you bring your own AED (personally owned or owned by a company / organization) this deregulation will not apply to you. You are now a "targeted responder" and training & a medical directive is required. It is common in Ontario for companies "targeted responders" to have a medical directive to limit them for use on company property only. 

 

[R933ex]

Yeah, I should have made the disclaimer.  Then again, maybe I just like to lead people on - big tease that I am... ;D

MudGunner.. Yes you are  ;D

 

[mudgunner49]

Yes the use of AED's in a public setting has been deregulated. The key point is that the AED must be accessible to the general public. If you bring your own AED (personally owned or owned by a company / organization) this deregulation will not apply to you. You are now a "targeted responder" and training & a medical directive is required. It is common in Ontario for companies "targeted responders" to have a medical directive to limit them for use on company property only. 

Our doc expects us to respond anywhere, and has supported us in word and deed in this respect...


blake

 

[X Royal]

Our doc expects us to respond anywhere, and has supported us in word and deed in this respect...
blake

blake: Thats great that you have this support. My point generally was that due to the deregulation you can't buy your own AED & carry it for use without a medical directive. Some may have assumed that if they bought their own AED, they could carry it & use it if the need arose without training.
What some people don't realize is it is possible to shock a person who doesn't require it.
Never shock a conscious casualty It is remotely possible for the AED to read ventricular tachycardia(very fast pulse rate) when the casualty is conscious. No shock to be given in this situation.

Rick

 

[mudgunner49]

Rick,

Oh I heat exactly what you're saying.  Shiny kit is no substitute for knowledge and training.  I've never seen or heard of an AED reading VT in a conc cas, however I'm sure it's possible.  You are much more likely to have the device detect external movement and read that as a shockable rhythm.  The bottom line is, as you stated, never shock anyone who is not clinically dead...

 

[NL_engineer]

The bottom line is, as you stated, never shock anyone who is not clinically dead...

That sounds like the first words out of the instructors mouth, when I did my AED training.

 

[cdn031]

+1 on all of the comments regarding "Knowing ones limitations" (As Clint would say) regarding gear & its use

Particularly in regards to AEDs - this is a technology that was DESIGNED to be used by the relatively naive public - and should be. I know of one region, deploying AEDs in hockey arenas, that shifted their targeted training program from "many" hockey coaches to a few zamboni drivers (Makes sense when you think of it). But the public access element vs private - puts AEDs in to a very grey area with regards to individuals - or more realistically groups, like Canoe trips, social orgs, old timer hockey teams. Legaly I get it ,but from an engineering/social policy / real world perspective I dont.

Seems like all of this fits into three neat piles
1) your Public FA kit (Good Sam/roadside)
2) your Group FA kit (your hockey team, Canoe trip, Cadet corps, etc)
3) Your Family / Personal FA kit

There are things that I would not hesitate to stock for my family - over the counter pain killers etc  -that I would not likely offer to a roadside occurance

Different contents, different levels of risk - yet chances are these are NOT different kits in the real world. just what you should be using.
I dont address this to those whose profession is RN, Paramedic, etc. - cause implied knowledge/ expectations is a whole other thing.

Thoughts?

 

[X Royal]

That sounds like the first words out of the instructors mouth, when I did my AED training.

As it should have been. The problem arises when a private company decides who their AED responder will be and doesn't necessarily ask the chosen person if they want or believe they can handle this role.
One training course with no or minimal follow up. 4 - 6 months later a situation occurs. The responder is not prepared to handle the situation but is expected to act. Brain farts happen.
And yes this has occurred on one occasion that I am aware of.

Rick

 

[mudgunner49]

As it should have been. The problem arises when a private company decides who their AED responder will be and doesn't necessarily ask the chosen person if they want or believe they can handle this role.
One training course with no or minimal follow up. 4 - 6 months later a situation occurs. The responder is not prepared to handle the situation but is expected to act. Brain farts happen.
And yes this has occurred on one occasion that I am aware of.

Rick

Rick,

Completely understood, and the reason why we do CE every month, AED and airway management refresher every 6 mos and full AED recert annually as per our docs instruction.  Takes a lot of the guesswork out of things...


blake

 

[X-mo-1979]

I got car key's.When my wife looks at me and says "hunny that looks really bad" I hold onto the missing/mutilated part and drive to the hospital.
Everything else can be solved by weird grunting noises till the pain subsides.

So basically mine is:

Car keys
Grunting

 

[adaminc]

One Bourbon, One Scotch, and One Beer.

 

[mudgunner49]

One Bourbon, One Scotch, and One Beer.

Classic medical response, Mr. Thorogood... ;D