US Army officer won’t accept Obama as chief

[Michael OLeary]

Army officer won’t accept Obama as chief
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36478557/ns/us_news-military/

Sources: Doctor who refused to deploy could face court-martial

NBC News and news services
updated 6:30 p.m. ET, Tues., April 13, 2010

WASHINGTON - The Army may be forced to court-martial a lieutenant colonel who refused to deploy to Afghanistan because he considers orders from President Barack Obama to be illegal, military officials told NBC News on Tuesday.

Army doctor Lt. Col. Terry Lakin believes Obama does not meet the constitutional requirements to be president and commander-in-chief because Lakin believes the president was not born in the United States. A video with statements from Lakin on the subject was released by the right-wing American Patriot Foundation.

Lakin refused to report to Fort Campbell, Ky., for deployment to Afghanistan, but instead went to the Pentagon. There on Monday he was confronted by his brigade commander, Col. Gordon Roberts, and informed he could face court martial, and his Pentagon building pass and government laptop computer were seized.

Roberts is the commander of the medical brigade out of Walter Reed. He is the only active-duty Medal of Honor winner in the military. He received the honor for action in Vietnam.

According to Lakin, he was read the military equivalent of his Miranda rights. No charges have been filed, but military officials believe they could include "missing a movement" or failure to report for duty, and "conduct unbecoming an officer."

One military official complained that Lakin, whom the Army describes as a "birther" because he's challenging Obama's birthplace, is being so persistent in his protest that the Army may have no choice but to order a court martial.

The Constitution states that a person must be a "natural-born citizen" to be eligible for the presidency. Birthers have contended that Obama's birth certificate is a fake, and many of them say he was actually born in Kenya, his father's homeland. They challenged his citizenship in court, and the issue became a staple of radio talk shows and conservative blogs.

Obama was born in Hawaii, and Hawaii Health Director Dr. Chiyome Fukino issued statements last year and in October 2008 saying that she's seen vital records that prove Obama is a natural-born American citizen.

The state registrar of vital statistics also has verified that the Health Department holds Obama's original birth certificate, copies of which were released by the Obama presidential campaign in 2008.

But that hasn't stopped the birther movement.

Last summer, an Army Reserve major volunteered to serve in Afghanistan, then filed suit to keep from being deployed, arguing that Obama was not a natural-born citizen. But a federal judge rejected the case, saying it was moot because the Army had already said that under rules for reserve volunteers, he didn't have to go.

 

[The Bread Guy]

LCOL Laikin:

Hope that helps!  ;D

 

[vonGarvin]

:rofl:

 

[DexOlesa]

Don't you know that document is a fake because that font was only used between 1919 and 1930 and the colour is slightly of etc. etc. etc. ;D
note this is not my actual view

 

[a_majoor]

Both sides are full of it in this matter.

The "Birthers" say the only valid proof is the actual "long form", no photocopies, .jpeg images, "short forms" etc., and will accept nothing less. As time goes on I'm inclined to believe they will say the long form is a fake (especially after the mid-terms).

The only way to shut them up is to release the "long form", but for whatever reason, this COA is activly fought against (including court action to prevent the releqase of the "long form". Why this veil of silence over birth certificates, school transcripts and thesis manuscripts is beyond my pay grade, it really does nothing to enhance credibility, especially when others in the same position like former President George W Bush freely released everything to the public domain.

For heaven's sake, pay the $15 admin fee and release the form so we can all get on with our lives.

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

??? what ever happened to the idea of being politically impartial

It really irks me when I see stuff like this as I believe the military; much like the court, should stay the heck out of partisan politics which this clearly is a case of. 

Anyways this guy is a total joke and his argument is pretty funny, the best part about people like this is they always come off looking like huge idiots in the end and they eventually realize it and smarten up.

 

[George Wallace]

The form above is a paid for transcript reproduced on a form from Nov 2001 (if I read the code correctly - Rev 11/01) It is a "Laser" copy.  They did not have that form or technology in 1961.

 

[mariomike]

For heaven's sake, pay the $15 admin fee and release the form so we can all get on with our lives.

I agree.

"Lt. Col. Terry Lakin: The selfless courage of an American hero":
http://www.newswithviews.com/Graham/cj124.htm

 

[karl28]

          I am not sure what to think of the story but the term " alrighty  than " comes to mind .

 

[vonGarvin]

Though I am of the opinion that there is something rotten in the state of Denmark with regards to a whole slew of things, the facts are this:
US Presidents MUST be born in the US or on its territory, such as an armed forces base in Germany, or wherever.
"Birthers" claim that since Obama has no "proof" that he fulfills that first fact, his presidency is invalid
The long form, as Thucydides points has, hasn't been produced.


All that does is cause both sides to look like fools. 


BUT

Imagine if tomorrow, evidence (conclusive at that) came out that President Barack Obama were born in say Kenya, or whereever, eg: not fulfilling the requirement for US President?  I have no idea of what would happen, but I don't think it would be pretty.

 

[ekpiper]

That would be very interesting indeed.  I suppose that he would not only be stripped of his presidency, but also charged with some kind of fraud and holding an office illegitimately.  WRT the LCol, I suppose that he would technically be disobeying a legal order, since it was passed down likely from someone other than the CinC,  so their order would be valid, and his refusal invalid.

ekpiper

 

[mariomike]

The form above is a paid for transcript reproduced on a form from Nov 2001 (if I read the code correctly - Rev 11/01) It is a "Laser" copy.  They did not have that form or technology in 1961.

The Form looks to have been created in Nov 2001. But, the Certificate was apparently not issued until 2007
( another source said June 2008 ):
"The Obama Campaign released a 2007 certified copy of his short form birth certificate (in this instance referred to as a "Certification of Live Birth") that states Obama was born in Honolulu, Hawaii, on August 4, 1961.":
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama_citizenship_conspiracy_theories

Imagine if tomorrow, evidence (conclusive at that) came out that President Barack Obama were born in say Kenya, or whereever, eg: not fulfilling the requirement for US President?  I have no idea of what would happen, but I don't think it would be pretty.

I think that is on a lot of people's minds.

 

[PMedMoe]

Do things like this not get checked before someone is inaugurated as President?  Don't they check eligibility before they even run for President?

I know there was an issue as to whether Obama was actually born in the U.S. but you'd think that would have been verified by this point.

 

[Michael OLeary]

Do things like this not get checked before someone is inaugurated as President?  Don't they check eligibility before they even run for President?

I know there was an issue as to whether Obama was actually born in the U.S. but you'd think that would have been verified by this point.

What, are you going to a let a few facts get in the way of a good conspiracy theory?

 

[Kat Stevens]

I dunno, people with far fewer resources than His Obamaness can access some very convincing forgeries.  I'm just sayin'.

 

[PMedMoe]

What, are you going to a let a few facts get in the way of a good conspiracy theory?

Of course not!  I just didn't want to go searching for my tinfoil hat too soon. 

I dunno, people with far fewer resources than His Obamaness can access some very convincing forgeries.  I'm just sayin'.

I did think about that too.

 

[Retired AF Guy]

Reminds me of a case from the early '90's when U.S. forces first deployed into the Balkans under UN control. There was one young soldier who refused to deploy (or something similar) because it was unconstitutional for U.S. forces to serve under a foreign command. The guy got court martialed and punted.

 

[Loachman]

??? what ever happened to the idea of being politically impartial

It really irks me when I see stuff like this as I believe the military; much like the court, should stay the heck out of partisan politics which this clearly is a case of. 

Anyways this guy is a total joke and his argument is pretty funny, the best part about people like this is they always come off looking like huge idiots in the end and they eventually realize it and smarten up.

What does this have to do with partisan politics?

Nothing.

He is not refusing to go because he does not like Democrats or Obama personally. A whole big bunch of US military personnel did not like Clinton or Carter either, and there are indubitably a few that did not like either Bush, however I have not heard of any refusing to deploy because of that.

The US President is required to follow the US Constitution. It is, after all, the supreme law of the US. Failure to do so renders him illegitimate at best, and a criminal at worst.

There are many Americans who believe that Obama does not meet the constitutional requirement of native birth, and that, therefore, he cannot legally be president and that none of his acts of office have any force of law. As he has repeatedly refused to provide any such proof, and in light of numerous suspicions that he cannot, their beliefs should not simply be dismissed out of hand.

Numerous court challenges have been tossed prior to being heard, and, at least the ones at which I have glimpsed, have generally been tossed on technicalities. If anybody was playing partisan politics, it is quite likely that more than a couple of those judges were.

This may be a method of getting the US Supreme Court to weigh in eventually, and finally examine Obama's legitimacy in order to determine LTC Lakin's guilt or innocence. Should Obama fail or refuse to prove his legitimacy, LTC Lakin can hardly be convicted and the Supreme Court may have, by default, sided with the "birthers". That may not give them quite the legal victory which they seek, but it will give them a huge moral one. Should the Supreme Court demand proof of Obama's legitimacy and be refused, he would then be in contempt of the Supreme Court.

This is, I believe, an exercise in patriotism for LTC Lakin. He is sworn to uphold the US Constitution. If he reasonably and honestly believes that the current occupant of the White House is not legally the president, then he has no legal or moral choice from his point of view.

Americans have a longstanding tradition of standing up against what they perceive to be illegitimate authority. That gave birth to their country, after all, and many of them, including some who wrote their Declaration of Independence, died for that or were otherwise ruined. LTC Lakin most likely views himself as acting in exactly the same way that they would have under similar circumstances, and he is probably right.

He is risking a lot for his beliefs, including his freedom, his career, and his future income. Win or lose, he is facing ruin for those beliefs. I doubt that he took this decision lightly.

 

[SeanNewman]

Very surprised that there isn't some sort of clause stating "A Medal of Honor recipient can do whatever he wants forever".

Also, very weak to time his protest upon deployment.  Sounds like a pretty sketchy excuse since Afghanistan has been an active theatre for the last decade.

Unless you're going to claim GWB wasn't born in the US, which is impossible.

 

[Loachman]

Also, very weak to time his protest upon deployment.  Sounds like a pretty sketchy excuse since Afghanistan has been an active theatre for the last decade.

Nope. It's most likely the very best time, if for no other reason than that it is going to generate attention to his cause and guarantee a court-martial, with the ultimate avenue of an appeal to the US Supreme Court.

Refusing to shave, for example, would not achieve very much.

The order to deploy is given under the authority of the US President, and it is the legitimacy of that order and the holder of that office that he is challenging. Afghanistan's pre-existing state of conflict is immaterial to this case.