The Khadr Thread

[larry Strong]

Everyone needs to get used to the ideas that:

1. Our, Canadian, legal system is different from the one in the USA and it, broadly the Canadian legal system, is "offended" by the whole Guantanamo episode in the US and will, most likely, treat Khadr as a young man who has been, at best, improperly tried and punished; and

2. Omar Khard will, soon, be on our streets as, at worst, a man who has "paid his debt to society" and he will be entitled to the full protection that our society offers - including the protection the CF provides for all Canadians.

As well as the million/s of dollars he will collect when he sues the Government.......

 

[Edward Campbell]

As well as the million/s of dollars he will collect when he sues the Government.......

Yep, I'm sure of it ...

 

[tomahawk6]

I was referring to revocation due to fraud.

Revoked for fraud means that a person’s Canadian citizenship status was taken away by the Canadian government. Canadian citizenship law provides for the revocation of citizenship of persons who have obtained their citizenship or permanent residence status through false representation, fraud or knowingly concealing material circumstances. If your citizenship was taken away for other reasons, answer “No” to this question.

Having your citizenship revoked for fraud is not the same thing as automatically losing your citizenship. For example, under previous legislation, Canadian citizens who left Canada for many years could automatically lose their Canadian citizenship. This is not a revocation of citizenship.

 

[jollyjacktar]

As much as it makes me want to puke buckets, this vile thing will come back to the country of his birth but not his heart.  He will be feted by the hoards of misguided, even if well meaning (in their eyes especially) liberal minded Canadians who have watched the west run roughshod over those oppressed brown skinned masses in SWA.  He has his supporters and I am sure he will take the Canadian Government to task legally and ultimately financially.  Unlike Mr. Arrar, Omar is a convicted terrorist who's guilt is without question.  But that won't matter one bit in the long run.

I expect that he will not serve his full time for if he does, he will be able to be released back into the bosom of his family compact without conditions.  On parole, the State will at least have some nominal overwatch on his reintegration into Canadian society.  While we at this time cannot revoke his citizenship as he was born here, I do hope they can prevent his obtaining a passport and at least keep him where he can be watched.  Keep your friends close and your enemies closer. 

 

[OldSolduer]

:ditto: :ditto: :goodpost:

 

[Jarnhamar]

  Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.

mmmm, marriage.

No really. In the greater scheme of assholes Canada has produced this kid really isn't on top. The more we shout how much of a jerk he is the more his supporters are inclined to raise him up on their shoulders like a hero.  Canadians only have themselves to blame for the justice system.

 

[captloadie]

Since WWII, enemy combatants or the bad guys, have been coming to Canada to live. Most of them were never tried for their "crimes", and until very recently, a blind eye was turned. Omar at least has served time, hard time, and paid his debt to society. What is the harm of letting him return and trying to move on with his life? If he sues the government for millions, and wins, doesn't that say that maybe he was wronged somehow? If he returns and starts spewing Taliban propaganda, then we deal with him like anyone else involved in hate crimes.

The more we put him in the spotlight, the greater martyr he becomes for others.

 

[larry Strong]

Talk about being spineless and passing the buck! This is an abdication of power.

Posted with the usual caveats
Treason charge for Khadr not up to feds

OTTAWA -- Federal Justice Minister and Attorney General Rob Nicholson says the question of laying charges of treason against Omar Khadr is a provincial and police matter.
The issue was raised after Public Safety Minister Vic Toews announced last week that he had received an American request to transfer the Canadian-born convicted terrorist and murderer to Canadian custody.

"We cannot comment on specific cases," said Julie Di Mambro, spokeswoman for Nicholson. "In Canada, the decision to lay and pursue Criminal Code charges rests with police and provincial Crown attorneys."

The shifting of responsibility is a change of tune for the Tories compared to their policy convention last year.

Last spring they debated a proposal dubbed the "Khadr resolution" that stated: "The Conservative Party of Canada believes that any Canadian citizen ... who commits treason by taking up arms against the Canadian Forces or the
Forces of Canada's Allies automatically invalidates his or her Canadian citizenship or claim to Canadian citizenship and, if and when returned to the jurisdiction of the Canadian Legal System, should be tried for high
treason under the Canadian Criminal Code."

The charge of treason and high treason is an ancient law, dating back to 1351.

The Criminal Code states that a person can be charged with high treason if he or she "assists an enemy at war with Canada, or any armed forces against whom Canadian Forces are engaged in hostilities, whether or not a state of war exists between Canada and the country whose forces they are."

Khadr, 25, who fought on the side of al-Qaida in Afghanistan, was sentenced to eight years for murdering American soldier Christopher Speer in 2002. He also admitted to building improvised explosive devices to kill allied soldiers.

Khadr was born in Toronto and is a Canadian citizen.
He has been held in Guantanamo Bay since he was captured in battle.

The federal government and Washington agreed that Khadr is allowed to return to Canada after serving one year in U.S. custody.

The last Canadian to be tried and convicted of treason was Kanao Inouye.

He was the soldier born in Kamloops, B.C., who fought on the side of the Japanese in the Second World War.

He tormented and killed Canadian PoWs and eventually hanged for treason in Hong Kong in 1947.

 

[The Bread Guy]

Talk about being spineless and passing the buck! This is an abdication of power.

Posted with the usual caveats
Treason charge for Khadr not up to feds

Anyone up for a private prosecution, then (more from the Criminal Code of Canada)?  Anyone?  Anyone?

 

[jollyjacktar]

What is the harm of letting him return and trying to move on with his life?  If he returns and starts spewing Taliban propaganda (guess it would not have been such a good idea to return him to the nest, eh?  What if he did not stop at being a mouthpiece?), then we deal with him like anyone else involved in hate crimes. (looking at their track record, they'll do SFA or near enough to it to equal it) beige comments mine, jjt

Unlike several German veterans I have met over the years, they were not a risk to try and continue offensive operations against Canada either by voice or deed.  They also were not Canadian born, and therefore traitors.  You can  bet your bottom dollar that if any of the former Wehrmacht/Luftwaffe/Kriegsmarine (can't say on SS as I am not sure if they were welcomed as immigrants) were viewed as a possible danger to Canada they would not have been allowed in, and if they became a threat they would have had their asses on a plane, deported back to the Fatherland faster than you can say Nazi.

If I had any confidence that poor poor Omar, was indeed poor poor Omar and would not be a possible threat, risk, danger, undesirable person by writ of charcter, word, thought or deed and had been done wrong.  I'd keep stumm.  But I don't, and I'm not alone and I may have to put up with what will come with his return to Canada but I f***ing well don't have to like it.  And I won't, nor will I give him the benefit of my doubt.  And if that makes me a bad person, well, I'll wear it with pride.

 

[my72jeep]

Unlike several German veterans I have met over the years, they were not a risk to try and continue offensive operations against Canada either by voice or deed.  They also were not Canadian born, and therefore traitors.  You can  bet your bottom dollar that if any of the former Wehrmacht/Luftwaffe/Kriegsmarine (can't say on SS as I am not sure if they were welcomed as immigrants) were viewed as a possible danger to Canada they would not have been allowed in, and if they became a threat they would have had their asses on a plane, deported back to the Fatherland faster than you can say Nazi.

If I had any confidence that poor poor Omar, was indeed poor poor Omar and would not be a possible threat, risk, danger, undesirable person by writ of charcter, word, thought or deed and had been done wrong.  I'd keep stumm.  But I don't, and I'm not alone and I may have to put up with what will come with his return to Canada but I f***ing well don't have to like it.  And I won't, nor will I give him the benefit of my doubt.  And if that makes me a bad person, well, I'll wear it with pride.

:ditto: :goodpost: Well said

 

[OldSolduer]

I agree with jollyjacktar as well.

I don't beleive for one second that poor misguided Omar has renounced his ways nor will he.

A friend's grandfather was sent to an internment camp because someone heard him speaking German during WW2. He was a farmer in Manitoba.

Now we are willing to let terrorists walk our streets.  :facepalm:

 

[fraserdw]

Unlike several German veterans I have met over the years, they were not a risk to try and continue offensive operations against Canada either by voice or deed.  They also were not Canadian born, and therefore traitors.  You can  bet your bottom dollar that if any of the former Wehrmacht/Luftwaffe/Kriegsmarine (can't say on SS as I am not sure if they were welcomed as immigrants) were viewed as a possible danger to Canada they would not have been allowed in, and if they became a threat they would have had their asses on a plane, deported back to the Fatherland faster than you can say Nazi.

If I had any confidence that poor poor Omar, was indeed poor poor Omar and would not be a possible threat, risk, danger, undesirable person by writ of charcter, word, thought or deed and had been done wrong.  I'd keep stumm.  But I don't, and I'm not alone and I may have to put up with what will come with his return to Canada but I f***ing well don't have to like it.  And I won't, nor will I give him the benefit of my doubt.  And if that makes me a bad person, well, I'll wear it with pride.

Canada did refuse readmission to 4 Canadians who entered Canada in the 20s and 30s and became citizens.  They heeded the call to the Fatherland in the 30s and served in the German Army during WW2.  Of course, that was before the Trudeauite Charter of Irresponsibility.  I have not been able to find the stories (they are online somewhere) but they remained in Germany and were never allowed back to Canada.

 

[jollyjacktar]

Yes, well the problem with dear Omar is that he is native born.  His family origins are Egyptian (IIRC), but he's ours in that regard.  I don't think he could be stripped of his citizenship as a naturalized citizen could possibly be.  Shame, that.

 

[Journeyman]

Treason charge for Khadr not up to feds

I can't believe this isn't in the "Dumbest Thing Heard" thread.

He was a traitor to Scarborough? He took up arms against the Victoria Park and Lawrence neighbourhood?  :not-again:

 

[Prariedawg]

I know that according to the letter of the law that we are left holding the bag with this whole khadr situation. Given the fact we have no option but to prove our moral superiority by proving we are a nation of laws what I want to know is

-Did khadr's mothers and siblings know where khadr senior was taking the poor "child soldier" and what his activity's would be, seems they did since they have admitted as much.

-Did they try to stop it to protect the tender lad whom the dew of childhood had barely dried on his brow?

-Did his mother or any sibling over 18 contact CFS once they could confirm khadr seniors plan, If not does this not constitute neglect and child endangerment and leave them liable to prosecution for the tragedy that has befallen "child soldier"omar? I'm fairly certain it does.

-Why has the government not prosecuted the family members for this seeing how we are a nation of laws?

 

[OldSolduer]

I know that according to the letter of the law that we are left holding the bag with this whole khadr situation. Given the fact we have no option but to prove our moral superiority by proving we are a nation of laws what I want to know is

--Why has the government not prosecuted the family members for this seeing how we are a nation of laws?

Sacrilege!! Blasphemer! How dare you suggest that!! Racist and intolerant! OMG I can't beleive you are asking this!!! :sarcasm:

 

[Jarnhamar]

Sacrilege!! Blasphemer! How dare you suggest that!! Racist and intolerant! OMG I can't beleive you are asking this!!! :sarcasm:

Not all families will be afraid Dec 2012.
Most families afraid will be afraid of zombies.
Some families will be afraid of most other families.

 

[The Bread Guy]

A couple of tidbits ....

1)  The neighbours and the petition:

More than 270 Canadians from coast to coast have signed an online petition created by a Scarborough woman to try and stop teen terrorist Omar Khadr from being returned to Canada.

Shobie Kapoor said she lives in Toronto’s east-end where Khadr grew up and is terrified of his return.

“His family lives in my neighbourhood,” Kapoor said. “I am worried about him returning since it can rekindle a Canadian branch of al Qaida.”

Her petition has been online for two weeks and most of the signatures are from Ontario and Quebec, with some from Alberta, B.C., and Manitoba.

She claims Khadr will become a shining star for other potential terrorists.

“Khadr would be a role model for Canadian jihadists if he is released a free man,” Kapoor said. “This is bad news for me and the community.”

Khadr, imprisoned in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, was sentenced to 40 years in 2010 for the 2002 murder of army medic, U.S. Sgt. Christopher Speer, in Afghanistan. Khadr admitted he threw a grenade that killed Speers.

He was slated to complete his sentence in Canada under supervision of the National Parole Board.

“I am pleased with the reaction but we should have thousands of signatures to try and stop him from coming back,” Kapoor said, adding many who signed claimed Khadr was a “Canadian of convenience.”

“Keep the Khadr murderer away from Canada,” Patricia Hennessey wrote on the petition. “Calling him Canadian cheapens Canada.” ....

You can find the petition here

2)  A former CF officer opines:

.... The suggestion is that Khadr should be charged with high treason for "assisting an enemy at war with Canada" or (assisting) those against whom the Canadian Forces are engaged in hostilities. Bafflegab.

To view Khadr as "treasonous," or even as "criminal," is wrong to the point of absurdity. He's done nothing against Canada. His "crime" of murder -- to which he confessed, in order to facilitate return to Canada -- was fighting against an invader. America attacked Afghanistan and al-Qaeda, to whom Khadr had pledged allegiance.

Canada wasn't involved -- had no links nor interest in Afghanistan prior to 9/11.

Killing in a war is not usually considered "murder," and certainly isn't treason. Surely some Ottawa authority can see the difference? While we may not like the Khadr family, Omar has done nothing to warrant criminal charges in Canada.

It's also unfair to compare Khadr with Kanao Inouye, the only Canadian ever convicted of high treason. As an interpreter and guard of Canadian soldiers captured at Hong Kong in WWII, Inouye was known to POWs as the "Kamloops Kid" who consistently beat and abused Canadians.

Sentenced to hang by the British for war crimes, the verdict was overturned on appeal and he was re-tried by Canadians and in 1947 was hanged for high treason.

Ironically, Inouye's father served honourably in the Canadian army in WWI, and won the Military Medal for Bravery in the Field.

Omar Khadr is no Kanao Inouye, and really is an accidental Canadian who has done nothing criminal against this country. Nor has he done anything for Canada.

 

[Rifleman62]

Mark Steyn speaks  http://www.cbc.ca/video/#/News/1221258968/ID=2224390047

April 18, 2012 News

The author and columnist sounds off on Omar Khadr, the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms and the trial of Norwegian Anders Breivik