TASER OPINIONS?

[Bruce Monkhouse]

Ref the Vancouver airport authorities, from the first time I heard of this incident my thinking has been these people let down the mother and her son. They were both in the airport and in spite of the mothers repeated inquires for information she could not get together with her son.

Yup, I convicted anyone in authority from the first time I heard of this. :

One day last month I was supposed to hook up with my daughters and her friends at the Stone Road Mall food court but our timings didn't jive and they had to phone me later......................guess I should blame the mall administration because of the sheer size of the building and number of people whom were there at the time.
Holy get-a-grip, Batman.

 

[Thompson_JM]

Yup, I convicted anyone in authority from the first time I heard of this. :

One day last month I was supposed to hook up with my daughters and her friends at the Stone Road Mall food court but our timings didn't jive and they had to phone me later......................guess I should blame the mall administration because of the sheer size of the building and number of people whom were there at the time.
Holy get-a-grip, Batman.

I dunno Bruce.... Stone Road Mall is pretty massive.. its like the west edmonton mall of guelph! wait.. isnt it the only mall in guelph? (unless you count that weird little shopping center downtown...)  ;D  The real question is, did you start throwing tables and chairs because you couldnt find them?

 

[jimb]

Did anyone besides me see the CBC news story that was shot in this guys' home town in Poland the other night ?

It seems that he has  been out of work for the past two years ( he was a coal miner  before that ) . His neighbours said that he is an alcoholic, who has had mental problems for  many years. He is know to be irrational at times and  physically abusive to wards others when he drinks. The CBC reporter found at least 4 people who  would speak about him on camera, and the translation showed that he was a person who was feared for his temper .The local police said that he has a minor criminal record for theft and assault.

My question is.........Why would someone like this be approved to come to Canada, as an immigrant ?  Are there no background checks being done on anyone anymore ?  Was he able to pass a medical examination in Poland, by Canadian authorised  Doctors ?

A final bit of interesting information, he had recently stopped smoking tobacco.

If any one can find that CBC tv report, feel free to post it here. I couldn't  find it, but I know I saw it here in Toronto in the past few days on the 6 oclock report.

Jim B Toronto.

 

[KevinB]

Anyone see the Chris Rock video - how not to get your ass beat by police? 

Funny it would have worked here...


FYI -- they are Less Lethal options -- not Non-Lethal. 

 

[Greymatters]

Anyone see the Chris Rock video - how not to get your *** beat by police?  

Found it here:

http://www.ifilm.com/video/2458063

You're right, hilarious!  Such basic common dog...

 

[zipperhead_cop]

My question is.........Why would someone like this be approved to come to Canada, as an immigrant ?  Are there no background checks being done on anyone anymore ?  Was he able to pass a medical examination in Poland, by Canadian authorised  Doctors ?

There is nothing saying that he was.  I have yet to see any info from Immigration Canada that indicates that he was approved to immigrate here.  Sometimes people come here as visitors, but then it becomes apparent that they intend to live here.  In that case, they would be held and in this guys case, possibly be being deported.  If he has a criminal record he definitely wouldn't have good odds of getting in.  From the various media outlets though, it seems as though he had cleared the CBSA area, and was just spinning his wheels because his mommy wasn't there to lead him by the hand out of the area. 
The more I hear about this, the more I'm glad he didn't end up in Canada.  Don't think he needed to be dead, but I'm also glad he didn't end up circulating in the general public. 

 

[xena]

FYI -- they are Less Lethal options -- not Non-Lethal.   

Exactly.  If you get shot with a Taser you have a small chance of dying.  If you get shot with a 9mm, you have a small chance of living.  It should be a no-brainer.

 

[The_Falcon]

Wow, just watched tonights CTV news (no link yet it just aired), this is just getting ridiculous.  A little blurb from Stockwell Day saying the mounties involved could face criminal charges, the head of RCMP public complaints commision, saying he has never really bought into the use of TASERS, and that there needs to be more reviews done, and the head of the RCMP in BC saying they might just stop using the things altogether.  Plus assorted other soundbites from the reporter saying how other forces across the country are looking at reviewing, and/or yanking tasers.  The ONE clip in favour of the device came from Fantino, and I think they gave him about 5 seconds of airtime.  Seriously this spinelessness at the top, is getting nauseating.

 

[a_majoor]

I can only imagine the outcry the next time LEO's have to take down a violent or resisting offender using pepper spray, batons or going hand to hand; since those are the options now that Tasers are frowned upon.

Of course, the other option of using a firearm would make this media storm look like a quiet day in the park...........

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

Didn't see the CTV news last night but watched the CBC side.This on the CTV website this morning.
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20071121/taser_kennedy_071121/20071121?hub=TopStories

RCMP watchdog worries Tasers overused



 
Paul Kennedy, the head of the Commission for Public Complaints Against the RCMP, said he is concerned that at times the Taser is brought out too quickly.

A memorial service was held for Robert Dziekanski, 40, at a Kamloops, B.C., funeral home on Saturday, Nov. 17, 2007. Jeff Bassett / THE CANADIAN PRESS

This amateur photo shows a man being taken away after a violent altercation with police who allegedly beat and Tasered the man.

CTV.ca News Staff
 
Updated: Wed. Nov. 21 2007 9:56 PM ET

The chairman of a Mountie watchdog group looking into Taser use by police in Canada says he's concerned the electronic stun guns may be overused.

Paul Kennedy -- the head of the Commission for Public Complaints Against the RCMP who is investigating the death of Robert Dziekanski -- will try to determine if police need wider guidelines on using Tasers.

"Is it a good tool? If it is a good tool, when do you use it because inappropriate use of a good tool can have a bad outcome," Kennedy told CTV News, outlining some of the questions he will look at during his investigation.

He noted Wednesday that he is concerned that at times the Taser is brought out too quickly.

"I have seen clearly cases that have come to my attention where I thought it was being used earlier than it ought to have," he said.

Kennedy says part of the reason Tasers may be used too often is that they don't generally leave any marks and that may undervalue the pain they inflict.

Kennedy's report for Public Safety Minister Stockwell Day is due by mid-December. He has said the four officers involved in the takedown of Robert Dziekanski could face criminal charges.

The report was ordered following a public outcry over his death. Dziekanski died at Vancouver International Airport in October after arriving from Poland. He was held in a secure area of the airport for about 10 hours and became agitated.

The Mounties were called in, confronted Dziekanski, and Tasered him within 25 seconds of arriving. Dziekanski died shortly afterwards. The incident was video recorded by a witness, who released it to the public earlier this month.

Kennedy is also looking into another incident involving the Mounties and the use of a Taser on a suspect. This one occurred on Monday in Chilliwack, B.C. Police used a Taser, pepper spray and batons in an attempt to subdue the 36-year-old man. He was listed in critical condition in hospital on Wednesday.

CTV British Columbia has learned from sources that the man's organs are failing and that he has been put on kidney dialysis.

Kennedy is currently talking to experts, reading scientific literature, and examining reports about Tasers and their effects.

Day is expected to release a report by Friday about the Canadian Border Service Agency's role in the Dziekanski's detention at Vancouver Airport.

 

[Greymatters]

Too high profile.  Everyone's scrambling to cover their butts...

 

[Drummy]

I don't think that it has been mentioned in this thread, and I'm pretty sure that the media hasn't brought it up.

I was wondering how many people have been tasered since it's inception, and how many of those have been just picked up and carted of to jail, with no ill effects, as opposed to the number who have died.

ps: I didn't google this      Drummy

 

[The_Falcon]

I don't think that it has been mentioned in this thread, and I'm pretty sure that the media hasn't brought it up.

I was wondering how many people have been tasered since it's inception, and how many of those have been just picked up and carted of to jail, with no ill effects, as opposed to the number who have died.

ps: I didn't google this      Drummy

I know Toronto Police keeps stats on their own use, and last time I saw them, the number was pretty high (over 100).  I think if one were to compile stats from every agency that uses tasers in North American, you would see that 1000s of people have been tased and they all lived.

 

[zipperhead_cop]

Feh, screw it.  Take away all of our less than lethal options.  I'll take my chunk, a 3' hickory stick and a blackjack and go git 'er done.  I never use the spray anyway, and I'm not a supervisor or Tac guy, so I won't be seeing a taser any time soon. 
However, these devices were brought in so that we don't have to go "old school" on idiots, which generally resulted in serious injuries. 
Whatever works for the quail hearted politicians.  :

 

[Thompson_JM]

Feh, screw it.  Take away all of our less than lethal options.  I'll take my chunk, a 3' hickory stick and a blackjack and go git 'er done.  I never use the spray anyway, and I'm not a supervisor or Tac guy, so I won't be seeing a taser any time soon. 
However, these devices were brought in so that we don't have to go "old school" on idiots, which generally resulted in serious injuries. 
Whatever works for the quail hearted politicians.   :

+1

I really am growing more and more convinced that the public really are just a bunch of window licking mouth breathers En masse....

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

+1

I really am growing more and more convinced that the public really are just a bunch of window licking mouth breathers En masse....

That would be the people that you took an oath to defend is it? One of the benefits of living in a democracy is that people who disagree with the police or the army or any of our public institutions have the right to their opinions, and the right not to be brutalized or killed if they hold a contrary opinion.
We also live by the laws that the majority of people have decided are good for the collective. If the collective wisdom of our country decides to get rid of tasers and encourage police to "go old school" that is what we'll do...we serve, we don't decide the rules.

 

[Sub_Guy]

I wouldn't call it collective wisdom. 

Sure the guy at YVR got tasered multiple times, the video only shows a portion of what really happened.  The media plays up this story about the poor immigrant who can barely speak english, and his mother who was no better off.  I guess Kamloops has a big Polish community, and from the quotes in the various newspapers the person picking him up at the airport could speak some pretty good english.  This guy supposedly studied Canada, surely he knew some english, or at least how to use a phone to CALL someone he knew.......I just don't buy the poor him story.  This guy snapped (from what the video showed), snapping at an airport is a bad idea....

I am not saying he deserved it (multiple taser shots), but there is more to this than that stupid video.  From what the video did show he deserved to be taken down, hey I guess next time people will think twice before they throw a computer or a chair at a plane of glass in an airport.

Doesn't everyone who uses the Taser, get Tasered as part of their training?  I don't hear stories of police cadets dying as a result of the Taser.  Before people start jumping, I know the YVR guy got more than one Taser, but there have been other news stories over the past year of guys dying from the Taser after only being shot once. 

It would be nice to know the stats of how many people are actually dying from the Taser, compared to those who just do the funky chicken and get locked up.

 

[axeman]

By Jim Bronskill And Sue Bailey, The Canadian Press
Figures on Taser use based on reports filed by the RCMP


OTTAWA - Number of events reviewed: 606

Dates: March 2002 to March 2005. Majority from 2004.

Number of events by province and territory: B.C. 230; Alberta 95; Saskatchewan 152; Manitoba 21; Ontario 1; New Brunswick 9; Nova Scotia 8; P.E.I. 21; Newfoundland and Labrador 27; Northwest Territories 10; Yukon 11; Nunavut 21.

Number of events in which Taser used: 563

Number of events in which Taser unholstered but not used: 43

Number of events in which suspect unarmed: 445

Number of events in which suspect armed: 118

(Source: Canadian Press analysis of RCMP Taser use reports)

and etc as i will not bring over the entire text     

   
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/071118/national/taser_firings

 

[Jarnhamar]

That would be the people that you took an oath to defend is it?

Well said.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

One of the benefits of living in a democracy is that people who disagree with the police or the army or any of our public institutions have the right to their opinions, and the right not to be brutalized or killed if they hold a contrary opinion.

Well said.

Not really.......he has every right to insult those whom he defends........that 'democracy' thing you speak about.