Role of Armour on the new front

[Recce41]

We have been hearing about the possible War. What would be the role of Armour, would Recce or Tanks be used. Or would we be Inf. like WW1. Our small Army is one of the best trained in the world. i‘ve been on American sights and all they do is laugh. Yes we have been flocked, but we can put up
a good fight. So what do you think.
Sgt J. CD, CDS com

 

[John Nayduk]

I think that we‘ll do what we did in the Gulf War. Token forces used for security tasks. We may have to keep troops on the home front as the new enemy has demonstrated the ability to hit targets here. Given that, the Cayotees and LAV25 will be the armour that we‘ll commit and leave out Leopards at home.

 

[Yard Ape]

I think reserve style recce units would have a large role they could fill . . . if Canada is willing to deploy reservist.

Yard Ape

 

[John Nayduk]

I don‘t think the government has the resolve to deloy reserve troops in a shooting war. There would be a long work up period to get us ready. It kind of makes you wonder if the courses the reserve take really mean much if we need to have long work up training to prepare to do the job we are suppose be trained to do. There will always be ice stroms for us to deploy to.

 

[centurion]

A.R.G.,
Judging from the cornucopia of verbal scatology that was flying around Washington yesterday, the liberal milquetoast puppets and the petite puppetmaster de shawinigan don‘t have the cohones to send our reg force guys into a shooting war either. While the rest of the free world ( and some that aren‘t) are getting on the band wagon to combat global terrorism, Prime Minister Cretin (not mispelled!) has got his head buried in the sand (or someone‘s butt). Wants to be all touchy feely with the world, giving out hugs and blow j‘s to make everyone feel good. Telling Canadians there is no sign of ben lauden activity in Canada. Again, treating us like stupid children. Ol‘ Mangle the Language is the biggest friend to global terrorism the west has seen in years. Our gov‘t make me feel ashamed, embarassed and selfishly angry, all at the same time. He is the ultimate lying politician. Only he could stand there, tell the world "We‘re with you 100%" and do nothing but let more terrorist into the country to raise funds (and votes for the liberals!).AAAARRRRGGGGGHHHHH!!!!!!! Oh, there‘s the doorbell. No it‘s not, it‘s my blood pressure causing a ringing in my ears! I think I‘ll go have a stroke now. :rage:

 

[Recce41]

Maybe we might get some new equipment.
Sgt J. CD,CDS com :tank:

 

[John Nayduk]

Maybe. But if this evolves into a shooting war, everybody that makes tanks will need them for themselves. It would be nice but I guess I‘m a little too sceptical to believe it. Sort of "like hope for the best but expect the worst".

 

[Alfreda]

Centurion:

Touche!

 

[TOW2B]

The Armor‘s role will always be the same to support the Infantry in taking the objective!!!! .
Seriously in a theatre like Afgahanistan the role of any "heavy" armor would be very limited the terrain does not lend itself to manouvre warfare.Using what is currently going on tanks would be used primarily as mobile pillboxes and direct/indirect fire weapons platforms.Further to that there are simply no real tanks to fight the few T-55s that are in working order would be pulled back and used in limited engagements.There will be no large "Desert Storm" style offensives.Vehicles such as Coyote would be useful as their surveilence capabilities would be an asset but the radars would be of limited use.Basically the whole country is one big defile with no really good areas for an armored thrust except for the central plains which are heavily mined with plenty of small wooded areas once again DEFILE!!!
Will the ‘War on Terrorism" get us more toys ,I doubt it,it‘s bad data to have Leopards through cities.This new war will be won with Intel and small unit actions.Strangely enough the only vehicles we have that are designed for this type of close in urban style fighting are the Grizzlies which are being phase out or converted to Ambs and Ammo Carriers.

 

[Coniar]

I have heard many different things in different places and I cant seem to get it straight. Where is the Canadian Army and the Armour in general headed say 10 years down the road? up, down, not moving?
I know no one knows for sure but what do you think a new MBT or all wheeled more attention and funding from the goverment? or is it just going down from here and theres no way to fix it?

A curious Coniar :tank:

 

[Zoomie]

My two cents worth say that the MBT is a thing of the past. Once the Leo C2 outlives its operational lifetime (say the year 2090) that will be the end of the any tracked vehicles in the CF. Take the M-109 (SPG) for example, once the artillery has used and abused them to their max, that‘s it for them.
I see the future of the Corps going all wheeled. The concept of ACVs and battlefield survivabilty ethos should <hopefully> eliminate the need of 60 ton behemoths.
Since the politicians are ultimately the purse holders, and they ALL believe that the CF is a peacekeeping force foremost, these is NO way that they will pass an expenditure for a war monging machine such as a Main Battle Tank.
Technology, not brute strength, will be the edge over future mechanized battlefields. So you better get that engineering degree, because you will need it to be able to run the complex systems that you will discover.

-out-

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Conair,
There‘s plenty of discussion on this subject in previous threads in the Armoured forum, check there for opinions.

 

[John Nayduk]

I was talking to someone this past weekend who mentioned that the army, during its reorganization, will mass the tanks out west creating a heavy brigade there. In LFCA there will be a medium brigade and a light one in Quebec.

 

[Coniar]

I dug up a few old topics and read through them they certainly clarrified a few things but they all dealt with the same subject overall no money no MBT just LAVW. Any year now there could be a change in Gov. and I didnt find any topics dealing with that side of the story how do we know the CF wont get a decent budget increase to upgrade them to the defence force there supose to be and not the peackeepers that is the side job. I dont want to know what would happen if the Liberals keep everything the same Im not blind I know what will happen but I dont see what will happen if theres space for tanks. Are they till an option for the CF if there is money or is the way of the future the way of the LAVW???

An interested Coniar

 

[Nfld Sapper]

I know that this is an armoured fourm but if armored goes wheeled I guess that would also mean that the engineers would too. But my main concern is that is we go wheeled we will loose our only assualt bridging capability (i.e. the Beaver Bridge layer). I can‘t see a bridge layer being made out of the LAV III chasis.
I know that wheeled is more "environmentally" friendly but tracked can definetly go further in country than wheeled.
:cam:


I think

 

[Harry]

We have bantered about this for some time???

The writing is on the wall, if you didn‘t read the Jeffries release do so.

It is a politicaly correct CYA for the next ten years. In other words, if no new money shows up, they are on the mark and as the kit absolutely rusts out for good, that‘s it.

Pipers up. March out the old. :boring:

 

[rceme_rat]

Not to say that the Beaver would disappear just because the Leopard does. If the capability must be maintained, and if there is only one way of doing it, then there really is no choice but to keep it.

 

[Coniar]

Or spend a few billion on a jumbo jet that can land lay a bridge in minutes and take off, an utterly usless contraption. Sounds almost like the fast ferrys that the Gov. made back hear, spend tons of money on something that supposedly fixes a system that works fine anyhow and then find the new way dosent even fit in the waterways up hear...
Is it just me or do elected officaial have trouble with the concept of "If it aint broke dont fix it"

Coniar

 

[Recce41]

ARG
Yes the Tanks are going West, But the Light Bge will be in Petawawa, Med will be in Valcartier. There will be only two Sqns per Regt, and one HQ Sqn. The third and forth will be gone, 60 is gone, Recce is down from 7 Cars to a 5 Car troop. Tanks are going to a 3 tps of 4 tanks or 4 tps of 3.
The School it growing to fill over maned Regts. Thats why I‘m getting off the ship it‘s sinking and going a lil east, where it real and no, kiddie games happen.
The Armour Corp may soon be as the CAV, gone but not forgotten.
Sgt J CD,CDS com

 

[Coniar]

Yes but cavalry are gone because something better came along, something with a freaking big gun and a whole lot of armour. Tanks are going to be cut out mostly as far as I can see if things continue like this but im fairly sure we havent invented faster than light hover vechles with a force shield to replace tanks with yet. Wich as far as I can see will leave a big gaping whole in the side of the CF. Think about it no tanks no anti-tank weapons for the enemy but we still have to lug around tow‘s and such to blow enemy tanks up with this creates a tactical problem. The gov. is assuming that we will only have to act as a recc. and peace keeping force for the U.N. If we ever get into any kind of war minor or not and no one is along to help us then we are in huge trouble, keeping tanks wont fix everything but it would help and if by 2020 there arnt any tank like vechles around then we could just stick a big sign above the Parliment biuldings saying "invade here!" an army has to be complete with all pices if it is to be a national defense force without MBT‘s where not complete and the hole in the side of our defense network becomes a lot bigger. Its like the aircraft carrier in the navy and the bomber in the Air force we dont have any and its a problem. Not know mabey not in ten years but if we leave it this way there wont be a Canada if where not carefull.

Anyhow I am wondering if we know what regiments/bge will be disbanded or if any will If tanks are being massed out west then I assume that Lord Strathconas Horse will be the the regiment they go to. But are there going to be disbanded regiments as the Bge are formed or will everyone just shuffle veichles around???

Thnx!!!

Coniar