Merged Child Custody in CF thread (joint custody, etc.)

[Lil_T]

Congratulations!  I hope the little man has a name soon.

 

[JBoyd]

We hope so too , getting a little harder though to name our children, we haven't found that one name that just stands out and suits him yet.

He also is currently on an IV (antibiotics) and oxygen, apparently he still has some fluid in his lungs that is causing shallow breathing. Apparently this is common and will fix it self within the first 24-36 hours, however try explaining that to a woman who carried a baby for 9 months, gave birth, and now cannot hold it for the first day or two. needless to say she is not happy.. however on the bright side she can get some much needed sleep.

 

[BlueJingo]

Wow a wife and new baby you must be very happy right now! Hope everything goes okay with the wee one (Mine was born 1 mo early and she was at NICU she pulled through (I agree seems to be a common practice) I am sure yours will too) Best Wishes

And your wife she should enjoy the sleep (I don't think i've slept for a couple months now....i'm like a ZOMBIE) Send her well wishes with her recovery too.

 

[Raye]

Does baby boy have a name yet?

 

[Scratch_043]

Wow, I can't believe how similar this is to my situation right now.....

My GF has been separated from her (soon to be ex) husband for 8 months now, and is going through legal aid and the courts to gain full custody of their daughter, followed by divorce.

Problem is, that she tells me that she can't move out here with me (to AB from ON) because (a) she does not yet have full custody, and (b) even when she gets full custody (he's not going to fight for dual custody) she will have to stay in Ontario in order to allow access for him to see her daughter.

He has been abusive to her son (not his) twice in the past, and children's aid has a dossier on him, and I really do not want him around. This in addition to the fact that I know he does not have the child's best interests at heart, but instead is trying to keep her from being happy. He has in the past sent her emails, texts, etc. stating that he wants nothing to do with her or the kids, calling her derogatory names, the whole bit. It just makes me sick.

He has another child with another woman, who he also never sees, and makes no effort to see, and since being separated, he has knocked up another woman, which he broke up with as soon as he found out she was pregnant and it was his, and now wants nothing to do with her too.

Is there any advise that the more legal savvy members can provide for my particular situation? I know that he will not sign anything saying that she can move, because he is a spiteful SOB, is there anything that she can do to persuade the courts to allow her to move with the kids (son isn't a problem, she had full custody, no visitation) between provinces? I know that one suggestion would be to allow him to take the child for a couple weeks in the summer or whatever, but I do not trust him with her, given his history (granted, it is with the other child, not her)

A little bit more content than I originally intended on providing, but I wanted to give a little background to the situation as well.

It's driving me nuts, and I would appreciate any advice anyone can provide.

Nic

 

[mseop 935]

I'm not sure you'd want to, and if you could, it probably wouldn't be admissible since once it's on your PC, it's able to be edited.  If you want the text messages to be of any use, check with the police and/or Rogers to see the best way to preserve the messages in a manner in which you can't be accused of tampering with them. 

Talk with the police if he is using threatening language in the texts.  They have the ability to remove texts from a cellphone for use in court.

Hope this helps,

Mse Op 935

 

[armyvern]

Problem is, that she tells me that she can't move out here with me (to AB from ON) because (a) she does not yet have full custody, and (b) even when she gets full custody (he's not going to fight for dual custody) she will have to stay in Ontario in order to allow access for him to see her daughter.

Not quite. In her filing she has to make sure that she states that she wishes to remove the child from the province for employment/education/future marital purposes etc and that she requests that provision be granted in the custody order.

Most (if not all) provinces have the automatic provision against removing a minor child from provincial jusrisdiction UNLESS you request otherwise.

The custody agreement that we are awaiting clearly states that our children can move from province to province with either parent, but that access will still occur and costs of arranging for travel and such will be divided equally between both parents. (he has kids during school year, I have them summers, march breaks, and either of Christmas/New Years.)

It's not an impossible situation, but she has to make the court aware of why and what she wants.

 

[startbutton]

I agree with Army Vern here.  My wife has Sole custody of my Step Daughter, and all we require to move is his permission in writing, we dont have to go back to court if he consents.  We just have to give him a reasonable access plan (he gets March Break, a week during Christmas Break, and a month of Summer Vacation to total the number of days he would otherwise have with his Bi-weekly access IF we are posted to another Province)

If she and her ex can come to an agreement she Is allowed to move the child.  If they cannot come to an agreement, your wife can take him to court to have a Judge decide, and so long as she offers a reasonable access plan, offer to cover the long distance charges of weekly phone calls and such; its not likely she would be denied.

 

[Scratch_043]

thanks a lot for your replies. My concerns stem from the fact that the father has made no effort to even so much as call his daughter in 8 months, when he left; took the minivan that was in both their names, forcing her to get a 18 year old compact car in which to drive the kids around, the television, etc. etc. which shows me that he has nobodys interests in mind but his own.

Since he will not be filing for, or even if he did request it, not receiving, joint custody, because of the children's aid reports, I don't think an agreement like that would be possible.

He will still be filing for visitation, she tells me that he will be granted at least supervised access, for which she can't move, because she would be acting to deny access to him (even though he probably wouldn't even notice if she moved across the city, across the country, or across the universe).

 

[Celticgirl]

Custody issues seem common with those in the military. In my early weeks of basic training, my ex applied for custody of our daughter (one of two personal crises I ended up having to deal with on top of my training). I've heard about several similar cases since then...this is not a rare thing to happen to those joining the CF. I thought leaving my daughter with her father while I went away on training was the 'right' thing to do, but he is using my career in the military as an excuse to take her away from me. I left the reg force in March and am in the process of joining the reserves so that postings every few years won't be an issue after my fiance retires. However, as I am joining the air reserve, I still have to do reg force training and will be away for almost 7 months over the next year. I'm pretty sure that is not going to help my case in court. I am considering making a deal with my ex wherein our daughter stays with him for the next school year (spending summer, Christmas, and other holidays with me) and then she will come to live with me next summer. The main condition will be that her father does not further contest custody after that point. If he doesn't go for that, I may need to delay my enrollment, which I don't really want to do. However, I also don't want to spend the next 9 years without the daughter I have raised from infancy.

Is there no legal 'clause' that allows some protection to parents who join the military? We shouldn't have to choose between our children and our career in the CF. 

 

[Scratch_043]

I know that in my posts I'm making it sound like I don't want him to have access at all, but that isn't the case, I have no problem with *daughter* getting to know her biological father, and vice versa. If he can prove to me; the courts; and my partner, beyond a doubt, that he has improved, gets a friggin job, takes parenting courses, and can provide a safe, positive environment for *daughter* I would have no problem with allowing him to have time with her, I am just afraid that he will be, well, himself, and either refuse to follow the agreement, not hold up his part of the bargain, and generally cause heartbreak.

*daughter* is now 2 years old, and has forgotten all about her bio father, except for the fact that her last name is *********, I can't help believing that it would be in her best interests, to keep it that way, as bad a person as that makes me sound. My partner has given him plenty of opportunity in the past to come see *daughter* and he has never taken her up on it. When she had a bunch of boxes of his stuff that he wanted back, he sent his mother to her apartment to collect it, and every time he had something of hers to give back, or needed copies of paperwork, etc. he would arrange to meet her somewhere without kids, or show up at her work.

 

[armyvern]

thanks a lot for your replies. My concerns stem from the fact that the father has made no effort to even so much as call his daughter in 8 months, when he left; took the minivan that was in both their names, forcing her to get a 18 year old compact car in which to drive the kids around, the television, etc. etc. which shows me that he has nobodys interests in mind but his own.

Since he will not be filing for, or even if he did request it, not receiving, joint custody, because of the children's aid reports, I don't think an agreement like that would be possible.

He will still be filing for visitation, she tells me that he will be granted at least supervised access, for which she can't move, because she would be acting to deny access to him (even though he probably wouldn't even notice if she moved across the city, across the country, or across the universe).

Sure it would still be possible; just think outside of the box.

Surely the child also has grandparents and/or aunts/uncles? Especially for grandparents - this is also their grandchild ... and for some reason they seem to get left behind or neglected in custody cases.

If his parents are in the same province as he is, she could arrange to have the child spend March break, a month during summer etc with them. That would allow "bio dad" to have access to his child in a controlled and supervised manner (if he wants to, and by doing so - she is allowing for that access even if he doesn't "use" it - he'd never have a leg to stand on in court against her in the future if he didn't use his access during those visits with his parents). Likewise - I guarantee it'd make the grandparents day!

If she wants to move, it can happen. She just has to make it happen. As well, she should get this in her filing NOW. Waiting until the hearing is done and the decision made ... means it takes a whole lot more time to sort out afterwards and will have to go all the way back through the Family Court system again ... with a whole new series of full legal costs.

I've had my share of troops use this "provincial custody" clause as an excuse to try to get out of postings ... all of which is moot. The standard response to that around here is "Only, because you didn't ask for that clause to be removed; you're military. Why didn't you? Get a lawyer and get your admin sorted out NOW." NO judge will hold back a military member with custody from moving as long as they have a plan for allowable access for the other parent in place. Military members who fail to bring this clause up as soon as they see it in their custody hearings need to give their head a shake. You're military. You move. The clause will be lifted if you ask it to be BUT you need to ask. It doesn't happen by itself.

Celtic Girl ... and many a custody hearing where one tried to take away custody from the other parent due to them being military has failed. They might try it, but they sure as heck don't succeed very often.

 

[Celticgirl]

Celtic Girl ... and many a custody hearing where one tried to take away custody from the other parent due to them being military has failed. They might try it, but they sure as heck don't succeed very often.

Well, I'm about to find out.  :-\

 

[Wookilar]

Ok, I've been through the DAODs, CFAOs and even the CBIs for this.

I found one ref in DAOD 5001-2:
"Shared Custody - If a member shares custody of a child with another person, the member is entitled to parental leave only while the member has actual care and custody of the child."

Nothing anywhere else.

There is not really a spot in Peoplesoft to track dependants that do not live with the member except in the address tab.

I'm trying to find references that I can go to the Career Manglers with and get proper posting messages cut that include the children that, through their custyody agreements, live with the parent for the summer. I've got 1 mangler playing ball and one not. Brookfield has been less than helpful for my guys in this area and, of course, they will not speak to me due to "privacy issues."

Anyone got any suggestions on places to look for more directives before I bump it up?

Wook

 

[PMedMoe]

What in particular are they looking for?  Posting allowance?  LTA? 

FWIW, my daughter (who resides in NB) is listed on my MPRR as a dependent and she was on my posting message as well.  And I don't even have joint custody.

 

[PO2FinClk]

Push come to shove, some of these could be used to elicit consideration.

CFIRP 2009 Policy: http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/dgcb-dgras/pd/rel-rei/aps-paa-2009/chapter-chapitre-01-eng.asp

Number of dependants When a posting message does not include all dependants, CF members must provide their Military Personal Records Resume (MPRR) to the service provider to show the number of dependants.
NOTE 1. In cases of joint/shared custody, when the dependant is residing with the CF member at the time of the relocation, expenses as outlined in the CF IRP Policy may be reimbursed. As per art 3.4.03 the DAE portion of the posting allowance is payable to CF members whose dependants are relocated at public expense.

Using the local CF Coord to obtain clarifications from, or through, IRP is available and sometimes the best recourse.

http://www.cfgb-cgfc.gc.ca/documents/Perspectives_June09-e.pdf

Conflict between the DCBA Aide-Memoire and CBIs
The Board has recently reviewed several compensation and benefits cases where the grievance has arisen as a result of the application of certain provisions found in the DCBA Aide-Memoire. Through the review of these grievances, the Board has identified significant conflicts between the provisions of the applicable CBI, still in effect at this time, and those of the Aide-Memoire. Of particular concern, the Board noted that the Aide-Memoire places additional restrictions on member’s eligibility for benefits such as the FCA and SE, without the proper regulatory amendment to the applicable CBI.
5
The following are a few examples:
The grievor’s ex-spouse lived in the same geographic area and shared custody of his children. Upon deployment to an operational theatre, the grievor requested the FCA for his children to be cared for by their mother. His request was denied because the Aide-Memoire stipulated that the dependants had to be living with the grievor on a full-time basis and the biological parent had to be residing in a different geographical area from the member.

The Board observed that the grievor met all of the eligibility requirements stipulated by the applicable CBI 209.335 – FCA. In particular, his children met the definition of dependant provided under the CBI and he did not have a spouse to take care of his children while he was away.

http://www.cfgb-cgfc.gc.ca/English/2009-045.html
20 Oct 2009

Systemic recommendations
The Board recommended that the CDS direct an in-depth policy review that clearly addresses SE entitlement and eligibility through appropriate regulations. The Board also recommended that the review consider the unique situation of posted members who have shared custody.
The Board recommended that the CDS ensure that the practice of making changes to TB authorized benefits before formal approval is received be discontinued.
The Board recommended that the CDS ensure that clear direction is issued to the DCBA and the IR approval authorities regarding the circumstances under which IR and associated SE benefits may be approved.
CDS Decision
CDS Decision Pending

 

[Wookilar]

Excellent thanks. That is exactly what we needed.

I was in the '09 agreement this morning, must have been before my pepsi hit my bloodstream ;D

Wook

 

[Eye In The Sky]

What in particular are they looking for?  Posting allowance?  LTA? 

FWIW, my daughter (who resides in NB) is listed on my MPRR as a dependent and she was on my posting message as well.  And I don't even have joint custody.

Ok this is one of my present peeves with the CF.  Maybe a SME resident clerk can shed some light.

I have a daughter who lives in PEI with her mom.  I am not allowed to have her on my MPRR because she doesn't live with me.

I also have 2 step daughters, who ALSO live in PEI with their grandparents while they are finishing high school.  They ARE allowed to be on my MPRR as dependents. 

This is from the Wing OR and it makes NO sense to me ???  I have my 2 step daughters on my MPRR presently but not my daughter..and they all live in PEI while I am posted to NS.

:stars:

 

[PMedMoe]

EITS, is it possible that because your daughter lives with a biological parent, she is not considered your dependent?  (FYI, mine lives with her father).  Technically, my daughter is not a dependent, but since the ex is now out of the military, I have no issues listing her as such.  That being said, my status for dependent health care is "non-participant".  And of course, no one ever asked if I had shared or joint custody, either.

I only listed her for the sole purpose that if something ever happened to her father, I'm not trying to add a dependent who never "existed" before.  Of course, maybe then it would be like an adoption and I'd get parental leave. 

 

[CountDC]

It should depend on your current relationship with her.  If you have not surroundered all rights to and responsibilities for your daughter , or had them taken away by a court order, then you should be able to list her in peoplesoft with a different address indicated.  In fact sometimes the divorce/seperation agreement states that along with child support the member must maintain the dental and health coverage for the children.  In order to do that you have to keep them listed in Peoplesoft as dependants.

If you show me documentation that you have joint custody and/or pay child support then I will enter them into the system with the different address indicated.  The different address should be a flag to the CM when they go to do your posting message to confirm if you have dependants involved in the move to be listed in your message.

Until I see a regulation stating otherwise I will continue to operate that way.  If your clerks are refusing to do the entry ask them for the regulation they are basing it on.

Can never stress it enough - when a clerk says "this is the way" and it is not in your favour then ask for the regulation.  Little secret - shhhh - we are not always ri ri ri rig current on every policy.