meaning of accepting a job offer - universality of service

[the_girlfirend]

Hello Everyone!

Some of you might remember me from my first topic « waiting, waiting your personal experience »
Unfortunately I have to tell you that we are still waiting by the phone… and thanks again for your support.

But I also have to let you know that after all those months of searching, reading army.ca, watching war movies, talking to recruiters, watching basic up over and over again…
I am considering joining the CF as well. I guess I would not be the first one to do that.

Anyway to make a long story short, I spent so much time and energy thinking about the CF that I feel like it is part of my life now and I would not see myself doing anything else, I would be missing something.

I think that it is a very important decision and I am left with one question that is probably the most important one, and the recruiting center answered it in a very official way, but I would like some examples from you. Here it is:

I am not sure that I understand the meaning of accepting a job offer.
When you decide to join the CF what ever your occupation is logistic, musician, cook, do you need to be ready to do anything?

The CFRC stated the “universality of service” and they mentioned that as a soldier you have to expect and be ready for everything.

I would like some examples if you have any.

I think I would go for either Logistic officer or Transmission officer, I am finishing my studies specializing in pure and applied maths with as well courses in finance, accountancy, economics, psychology, and education. I know I am not specially qualified for any of these occupations but I have nothing to lose and I know that the CF will teach me what I need to know.

That said, I know being in the CF could be dangerous for anyone,
It is about National Defence after all…
But being a Log Officer could I be asked, if needed, to train for infantry and be deployed as infantry if needed?

I am asking that because I think I can do a great job in a supporting trade and I mean it.
But I don’t think that I am mentally ready for direct combat, are you? Can you be?
Do you know it without a doubt if you are mentally ready for combat?
Do you have doubts sometimes? Am I normal? Or just not the right type for the CF?

That was many questions, but mainly I would like to know if when you accept a job offer you accept any possible job at the same time including combat. And please give me some real life examples. Could I be deployed as infantry if needed?

Thank you very much for taking the time to read me and please help me I am confused, it is such an important decision.

 

[ModlrMike]

The simplest way to define universality of service is to say that the CF has BFORs (Bone-fide Operational Requirements) that every member must be able to perform, regardless of occupation. Some of them are, for example:

- be able to work irregular hours sometimes missing meals;
- be able to complete the CF EXPRES evaluation;
- be able to tolerate extremes of temperature and geograph; etc there are many more, but I don't have the list in front of me.

If you wind up in a situation where you are unable to perform the BFORs, then you are construed to have contravened the universality of service principle.

[rant] BTW, you're not going to be offered a job, you're going to be offered a career. [/rant] 

 

[the_girlfirend]

Thank you for the info,

But should I understand from what you wrote that,
yes I should excpect the worse, but on the other hand the CF would not ask me directly to train as infantry let say and be deployed as infantry, if it is not my occupation.

thanks again I really need to know what I will be signing for. :

 

[ModlrMike]

It's not a question of expecting the worst, but rather one of being able to do the same that is expected of everyone in uniform. There is very little likelyhood of a Logistics Officer being forced to perform as infantry... unless you were "outside the wire" and came under contact. In the normal course of things, your occupation is your occupation.

 

[the_girlfirend]

I think I am getting it...

What does "outside the wire" mean? (I am french I have never heard that before  )

and do you know if supporting trade carry weapons when deployed? for self defense...
or let say when deployed if I need, for my occupation, to move from the base to the city (in any country)
Am I going to be alone or if it is concidered a dangerous move would they send me with infantry or how does it work?

thanks again I am so curious  :

 

[Nfld Sapper]

What does "outside the wire" mean? (I am french I have never heard that before  )

Means that you are outside the confines of the airbase at Khandahar, like at one of the Forward Operating Bases.

 

[muskrat89]

Regardless of trade, everyone is supposed to be a soldier first. Being a soldier means that you may have to fight. The likelihood of that depends on your chosen trade of course, but the possibility is there - that's what soldiers do.

If you are looking for some kind of guarantee that you will not be required to engage directly in combat operations, maybe you should examine a different career.

 

[the_girlfirend]

Well, I am not looking for a guarantee, I am sure that there is no such thing in the Forces 

It is more about knowing what I would be signing for...
When I do something, I do it right, and I don't want the CF to waist its time on my application,
I won't apply if I am not 100% sure and ready... But at this point I don't know if one can ever be 

When you applied were you 100% sure and ready?

thanks again

 

[Loachman]

"Outside of the wire" means beyond the perimeter of KAF.

You will be enrolled in, and employed in, a specific specialty, ie Logistics. Infantry is another distinct specialty. While there is some overlap, members of one specialty are not expected to be equally competent in another.

Universality means that you could be sent on tour at any location around the world, such as Afghanistan.

In such environments, all members of the CF, regardless of specialty or colour of dress uniform, could find themselves "outside of the wire" for various reasons.

As a Log Officer, you would not lead Infantry soldiers into battle, but you could be part of a convoy. You would be armed for this, of course, and trained and expected to be able to defend yourself and command those under you in such a defence. Convoys are escorted by force protection elements.

I am a Tac Hel pilot. I am preparing to deploy, at some time in the future, as a Tactical Unmanned Aerial Vehicle (big remote-controlled model aeroplane with cameras) Mission Commander. Most of my time on the job overseas I will sit, with three others, in an airconditioned box inside the wire operating this machine. As any of us could in theory deploy outside of the wire, we are all doing the appropriate training to include combat first aid (and a select few doing TCCC), weapons (C7/C9/C6/Pistol/Shotgun/M72/M203/Carl Gustaf), convoy and IED drills etcetera. This does not make us Infantry by any stretch - there is so much more to that - but it will provide us with the means to survive and operate in unfriendly territory should the need arise. This employment, outside of but related to my specialty, is part of what universality of service entails.

Continue to read other threads, and you should get more of the picture.

 

[Loachman]

When you applied were you 100% sure and ready?

If you are uncertain, you might want to consider a few years as a reservist to get a taste without incurring too great a liability.

 

[the_girlfirend]

Yes I am considering the Reserves, but on the other hand I am worried:

If my boyfirend is in the regular forces we might have to move, and I don't know if a reserve would like to give me all the training knowing that I can move at any time.
And also I don't know how easy it is to transfer from one reserve to another. And I guess it is worse if I am logistic officer... there are not so many open positions.

But yes it is still an option, maybe I should go back to the CFRC and ask some of those questions.

 

[Loachman]

No need to worry at all.

You wouldn't be the first reservist who changed locations, and there are usually reserve units near bases or reserve positions on bases.

There is a variety of ways to serve.

 

[the_girlfirend]

Thank you you have been very helpful,

I just think that in the civilian world if I look for a job and mention to human ressources that my boyfriend is in the CF... they will reject me
I don't know to many employers willing to train people that are going to leave anyway.
That is a big concern for me and I am assuming that reserves are no different.

Like I said earlier I have nothing to lose, I will try.
fingers crossed

 

[Loachman]

Thank you you have been very helpful,

My pleasure.

I just think that in the civilian world if I look for a job and mention to human ressources that my boyfriend is in the CF... they will reject me
I don't know to many employers willing to train people that are going to leave anyway.
That is a big concern for me and I am assuming that reserves are no different.

Ah, but it is different.

A reserve career is highly portable.

There is a high turnover rate anyway, so some degree of loss is expected. In balance, though, is the fact that many stay for years and make great contributions, including serving on tours and going into the regular force.

Service couples, reg/reg, reg/res, and res/res, are fairly common. You are not breaking new ground.

Your boyfriend is not a major factor in your enrollment from the recruiter's point of view.

You have nothing to lose by joining as a reservist, and much to gain.

I did that at age seventeen. Thirty-five years later, I'm still around, and in the process of entering the regular force for the second time.

Were I able to be seventeen all over again, I'd do it all over again - with a few minor changes, but nothing major.

 

[the_girlfirend]

Wow! reading you is very encouraging!
thank you for taking the time
and I think I will apply very soon 

 

[kratz]

Posting between locations has also improved for supporting spouses finding employment opportunities. We are in the midsts of a move from Halifax to Borden and the MFRC in both locations has been a valuable resource of information to assist in searching for relevant employment. Granted each location you move to the support levels will vary, but this is our third move together as a service couple and it is working well. I am the class A (part-time) reserve in this case.