How hard can an english course for a french guy???

[mysteriousmind]

I know from the back of my head somewere that the subject has probably been discussed, but I cannot pin point it in a search function.

As allot of you guys know, I'm a french Quebecois, who happens to be not so bad in English. I have a few glitch but, I think I'm OK. I was wondering, how hard would it be to follow my QL3 as a supply tech in Borden on a English course. The reason I'm considering this is quite simple, The french course are hard to get on for a Pres guy due to the short number of place available on course.  And, I would like to get it done this winter, instead of waiting to do it next summer.

Do you think A. Would I get myself into hell for a french to be on a English course???
                  B. That is would give me better chance to get in a course this winter???

Or should I wait to the Pres Summer course??

 

[GUNS]

From reading your post, I would think you would not have any problem. You command of the English language is very good.

As for being a French speaking Canadian on a English speaking Canadian course.

There is no issue here, we are all Canadian.

 

[mysteriousmind]

As for being a French speaking Canadian on a English speaking Canadian course.

There is no issue here, we are all Canadian.

Perhaps speaking out of my lane, but I have heard/read about francophone people ending up in a English environment and having a hard time there. Allot of people got laugh at, got ranted about, etc, etc, etc,

But thanks for your wisdom GUNS

 

[George Wallace]

You shouldn't worry about it.  Many Francophones, with English skills, have been placed on English Trades Courses.  The Instructors and Standards people will take language problems into account and if necessary provide the extra time and effort to assist them.  This is not new.  It has been happening for ages. 

As for jokes and laughing at, the same can be found when Anglos attend Franco Courses (and it does happen).  At the end of the Course, much of that is over with and good friendships are usually made. 

I have seen many instances where long lasting bonds have been made on such courses and postings.

 

[armyvern]

We have a trick that we use MM in the Supply trade for francos who end up in an english enviornment, but do not have a good command of the english language.

1) We throw you on the front counter of clothing stores to work, where you have the opportunity to develop those english language skills on a continual basis; (we would also attempt to have you loaded on the next possible SLT);

2) After we have sent a francophone on an SLT -- we throw them on the front counter of clothing stores to work!! Ergo ensuring that those language skills that you have been taught become comfortable for you.

I'm not sure about the PRes course loading, but in the RegF (here anyway), SLT for our franco suppies is a priority. You won't be completely immersed in english however, we are a bilingual Unit and many of our customers (staff & course candidates) are francophone.

Your personal command of english is very good BTW and I have no doubt that you would succeed on an english course.

 

[mysteriousmind]

Thanks Vern,


I will ask to be loaded on a QL3 ASAP even if its in English  ;D, I would like to get all this course thing done faster then having to wait until may... So i can start working at the clothing in Valcartier right after.  8)

 

[armyvern]

Thanks Vern,


I will ask to be loaded on a QL3 ASAP even if its in English  ;D, I would like to get all this course thing done faster then having to wait until may... So i can start working at the clothing in Valcartier right after.  8)

Our courses are "open book" -- they need to be due to the vast number of publications/regulations that we deal with. That being said, all our publications are en francais as well.

Your answers need to be direct quotes from the books, and properly reffed to their pub location (ie CFSM) right down to the sub-para. Copy & paste.

The CFSS Sup system itself works in the NATO standard language -- english. The screens would be identical on both franco and english courses as would the input that you are required to make. The factor that you must consider however -- is will you understand the instructions on how and what to do if you are taught each blocks meaning and significance in english? That's a big consideration -- given that this is a career course; do not ask for an anglo course if you are not 110% certain that you will understand what your instructors are teaching you.

 

[Sig_Des]

On a couple of my courses there were Franco's on Anglo courses.

They did allright, though some translation was required.

On my 3's confirmation Ex, they assigned the French guy to my Det so that if there was any confusion, I could translate for him. Worked out OK.

Keep in mind though, that if you are going to be working in a French environment, it may be easier to have your trades training in French.

 

[armyvern]

That being said, one will not usually find himself loaded onto a course not in their primary language if one does not have a valid language profile.

I've seen it happen in a couple of cases where pers volunteered for it -- but you MUST consider the implications of a "fail" (I've seen that too -- not good.) -- it IS a career course, don't take it lightly.

 

[Greymatters]

Do you think A. Would I get myself into hell for a french to be on a English course???
                   B. That is would give me better chance to get in a course this winter???

Im interested in how you got the impression that taking an English course would be hell.  Is that a personal impression, a friends advice, or is someone in your chain feeding you this information?

 

[armyvern]

Im interested in how you got the impression that taking an English course would be hell.  Is that a personal impression, a friends advice, or is someone in your chain feeding you this information?

I think it's more a ref to his wondering whether or not his grasp of english is good enough to successfully complete an english language QL3 ...

I certainly don't get the impression that he thinks the course "would be hell".

 

[aesop081]

That being said, one will not usually find himself loaded onto a course not in their primary language if one does not have a valid language profile.

Some trades have courses only offered in English. Staff provide assistance as able.

 

[Sig_Des]

Forgot to mention, on more technical courses, it's very much preferable to get the course in the language you will be operating in.

 

[armyvern]

Some trades have courses only offered in English. Staff provide assistance as able.

Absolutely agreed. In that case however, they would also have to provide translation services if/when requested by the non-primary language pers as per the Official Languages Act.

That's not the case for a member who volunteers to attend a course not within his primary language where the course is run in both official languages. MOST will provide the assistance necessary to the member (but this would be minimal as they would much expect someone volunteering for an english career course vice a french one to at least be capable in that language that he has REQUESTED to do the course in), however he has chosen to take the course outside of his mother tongue, thus he must consider the implications a "fail" would bring on this career course if the instructor can not provide the member with language translation and assistance at his leisure.

 

[Roy Harding]

When I (re)joined the CF as an Adm Clk back in 1982, my first posting was to an English Language Unit in Calgary.  One of my fellow privates was a francophone, who despite having attended SLT (a requirement for all Franco tradesmen at that time) did not have a STRONG grip on English.  He and I became buddies, and he soldiered on in his second language - and steadily improved.  He made a request to our Career Manager that he attend all courses in English.  As it turned out, a few years later we attended QL6A together.  By that time, his English was impeccable, he was fully bilingual (unlike me), and he had far more options when it came to postings than I did.

We remained buddies throughout the years and when we've talked about those early years, he admits they were tough at first - but there was no way he was letting us English bastards get the best of him!

The point being - my buddy fully immersed himself in his second language - going so far as to request all trade courses in it.  His ability in English may have had an effect on his academic performance on his 5's (he did well enough, but I thought he'd do better), but by the time we were on our 6's together, language was no longer an issue.  His second place finish on that course was purely the result of being course loaded with an English bastard (me), who was ever so slightly ahead of him in a couple of areas - a fact I never let him forget.

Your written English seems fine to me, mysteriousmind - I think if you want to go the English route for your trade courses you'll be opening horizons for yourself which were not visible to a monophone like myself.

Best of luck to you, you're a better man than I, Gunga Din.


Roy

 

[aesop081]

And another hugfest comes to a close.....I hope

 

[Roy Harding]

And another hugfest comes to a close.....I hope

Just for you, CDN Aviator - wouldn't want you to feel left out of the hugfest.

:-* :-* :-*

 

[284_226]

Forgot to mention, on more technical courses, it's very much preferable to get the course in the language you will be operating in.

I think if you speak to Francophones who have attended technical courses conducted in French, the consensus will be that they would never do it again.  Back when I was an instructor in Halifax, they conducted a couple of French serials for the apprentice Naval Electronics Techs.  The overwhelming opinion of the students and the instructors was that it was a flop, and I don't think they've attempted it again since then.

Back in the days when tech manuals were printed one page English, and then one page French - it would be the Francophones that would tear out the French pages.  Useless, they said - they used terminology that was virtually unknown in common French.  None of the French guys wanted to hear or read générateur de signaux, it was a sig gen.

Then somebody wised up to the fact that all the French pages were getting thrown out of the manuals at the end units, and they went to printing the left column of a page in English, and the right column in French.

 

[vonGarvin]

I echo the previous comments: Immersion is the best way to learn a second language.  That's how I learned German.  That's also how I improved my French:  I taught on francophone serials at the Infantry School (albeit in the "bilingual section" of the platoon, but I still had to speak much more French there during those courses than probably in my entire service life before and since)

 

[GUNS]

Consider yourself fortunite to be able to speak French and English. To be so lucky.

When I  was posted to 5 RALC in Valcartier, I had to learn Canadian English and Canadian French. You see I am from Newfoundland and both English Canadians/French Canadians had a hard time understanding me. :warstory: ;D

Perhaps speaking out of my lane, but I have heard/read about francophone people ending up in a English environment and having a hard time there. Allot of people got laugh at, got ranted about, etc, etc, etc,

But thanks for your wisdom GUNS