Haulin' the C9 and/or C6

[ProPatria031]

the other day I  put my hand up and volunteered for the C9 (because it's my baby  :rofl: ). but the problem is is sure I was able to haul the c@ck sucker around in battle school but I'm not sure if I'll be able to do it battalion. so if any of you "spartan" types  ushup: could give a few pointers on training to carry the thing it would be appreciated because I would hate to have it taken away from me for a stupid reason like personal PT.

:cheers:

 

[HItorMiss]

Simple answer Pro Pat

Dondonald Hall is about 400m from the 3 RCR shacks (I assume you live in shacks)

Step1: Run to Gym
Step2: Lift Weights
Step3: Run back to shacks

The C9 isn't as much of a pig as the C6 and trust me you wont have much difficulty if you just do a small bit of PT on your own time. Really that's all the advice you can get. As for carrying it the sling works fine IMO but I am sure there will be Senior guys in your Coy kicking around who will pass on some pointers that worked for them.

 

[ProPatria031]

"The C9 isn't as much of a pig as the C6"

ya i know what you mean. i was C6 #2 in battle school and I carried more weight then the #1 when you add up all the ammo, #2 and #3 barrels, cleaning kit, plus my personal weapon and ammo.

thanks a lot for the advice though HoM I'll ask one of the Jacks or sergeants at work.

:cheers:

 

[TN2IC]

I find the C9 doesn't really bother me. Might you know I have my flak jacket on too. Also to note; I am a husky type lad. I just put it on as if I was partolling. But I am more into operating VCP's. We really don't run around that much.


Regards,
TN2IC

 

[vanislerev]

the C9 is no biggie to carry, the weight of the C6 does not bother me as much as the sheer size of it that just makes it a bit akward more than anything else... you will adapt though, dont worry, after you carry it non stop for a while your arms will adapt

 

[Trooper Hale]

Just make sure that the Minimi isnt the only gun firing. Build up the guns that the ladies love. The biceps and forearms, especially in your left arm, are the ones thats carrying the weight of the C9 when your having a wander around the bush.

I love that shit though, especially at 3 in the morning, you've got a 200round box on the thing, the NWS sitting like a lead weight on the top, 600 rounds in your webbing and 15km to cover with your pack on. :warstory:

Another thing is love is handing it over to someone else and taking their Steyr off them. After carrying the gun all day its physically impossible to take a Steyr seriously and hold it with two hands. Actually my favorite Minimi activity is giving it to someone else.

Good luck buddy, go talk to some the RCR gym junkies, i'm sure they'll sort you out. A bloke called "Animal" helped me out, i think that was his name anyway.
Have fun,

 

[ProPatria031]

yea I know whos he is he lives downstairs from me I'll go talk to him. thanks alot i appreciate the help. especially today my sgt. made it official, Im a '9 gunner wohoooo!!!!

 

[Fusaki]

Just make sure that the Minimi isnt the only gun firing. Build up the guns that the ladies love. The biceps and forearms, especially in your left arm, are the ones thats carrying the weight of the C9 when your having a wander around the bush.

While upper body strength is important, I disgree that its the most important aspect for a C9 gunner who wants to improve his fitness. In my opinion, the most important thing you can work on is your legs and core for stength and endurance.

Being able to shoot a C9 from the standing or unsupported kneeling is an important skill for FIBUA and really close ambushes, but for 90% of the rest of the time your ability to maximize that weapons system is dependant (among other things) on your ability to get from firing position to firing position as quickly as possible. This means that you want to be shooting your C9  either on its bipod, resting on a ledge, window sill, log, or anything else that gives you a stable platform so you can put down a high rate of accurate and lethal fire from behind some form of cover. And when you're not shooting you're either reloading or running your ass to your next firing position. You should be moving WAY too fast to even think about shooting from any place so exposed that you don't have a solid spot to sit that gun.

And what muscle groups get you in and out of dead ground, around big rocks, over low walls, and in and out of the prone? Its your core and legs. There will always be exceptions and you should aim to be physically well rounded, but the ability to pepper pot over uneven terrain is - in my opinion - the mark of a strong C9 gunner.

 

[ProPatria031]

Your addvices are awesome guys keep this stuff coming. I'm also sharing this info with the rest of my Coy. ushup:

:cheers:

 

[footsoldier32]

Ok guys, here goes nothing.  I am one of those officer types, but I have carried both the C6 and C9 on several exercises before I came to Bn and the Sgt's and WO's wouldn't let me have any more fun.  Having had a Pl full of guys just aching to carry the C6 instead of the C9A1 (for obvious reasons vs the A2), we carried 4 dismounted C6's on several occasions.  The guys carried them well even with 6 belts for each gun...ammo was just shared around the Sect.

As to suggestions on how to be prepared to carry the thing, it has already been touched on in some of the earlier responses, keep working out.  My suggestion for you would be to take every chance that you get to carry it in training and when you are carrying it, DO NOT use the sling!  Carry it with you hand on the pistol grip at all times and keep it at your chest ready for employment.  Too many times have I seen guys marching with the thing slung and their hands resting on the top.  Train like you fight.  If you do that and keep up the upper body workouts, you will be able to do it.  Remember, carrying it won't be the difficult part, hitting what you are aiming at has always been the show stopper for any soldiers that I have seen.  You never get enough time on the wpn.

 

[3rd Herd]

Ok guys, here goes nothing.  I am one of those officer types, but I have carried both the C6 and C9 on several exercises before I came to Bn and the Sgt's and WO's wouldn't let me have any more fun. 

A differnt thought on their reasoning. Those of us who have had/do have the pleasure of carrying around various pieces of heavy "kit" are easly identified by the enemy as being GRUNTS, and therefore not worthy of being shot first. It is simply a matter of self preservation, Sir.  ;D

 

[DirtyDog]

Is there a c9 sling in the BFG Contractor pack or should I go with something like the Vickers sling?  Apparently, for the time being anyway, I'll be on a c9 as well.

 

[footsoldier32]

Is there a c9 sling in the BFG Contractor pack or should I go with something like the Vickers sling?  Apparently, for the time being anyway, I'll be on a c9 as well.

Dirty Dog, all of the kit questions always make me laugh (and not at you).  Most guys out there are kit hogs (myself included) and we tend to think that the more the better.  What works for me may not work for you and so on.  I know a lot of guys who went out and spent a huge pile of cash on kit for TF 3-06 and many of them went back to issued kit.  Somethings work great for the dismounted stuff, but not for the Mech and vice versa, so the difficult thing is finding something that will work for most applications and is easily adaptable to the unexpected. Many of my soldiers started off with such things as leg holsters for everything under the sun, but when we started fighting, the only ones who kept theirs were the M203 Gnrs and a few TCCC soldiers with their FA pouch.  The vickers type sling is a pretty good sling and it was pretty good when I was climbing over walls and up ladders.  My suggestion is to find a nice double point sling that is made of thick and robust material that won't bunch up.  It has to be easily adjustable. BFG makes a nice one for the M60/C6/C9.  The biggest issue that I have ever seen with LMG/HMG slings is the way that after lots of use, the material crimps up.  Just remember, the sling is only there to steady the weapon, but don't get too reliant on it.  It will get hung up at the wrong time (it brings to mind the soldier who shot himself in the nuts because his sling caught on his veh when he was dismounting). True story for another time.

 

[DirtyDog]

Dirty Dog, all of the kit questions always make me laugh (and not at you).  Most guys out there are kit hogs (myself included) and we tend to think that the more the better.  What works for me may not work for you and so on.  I know a lot of guys who went out and spent a huge pile of cash on kit for TF 3-06 and many of them went back to issued kit.  Somethings work great for the dismounted stuff, but not for the Mech and vice versa, so the difficult thing is finding something that will work for most applications and is easily adaptable to the unexpected. Many of my soldiers started off with such things as leg holsters for everything under the sun, but when we started fighting, the only ones who kept theirs were the M203 Gnrs and a few TCCC soldiers with their FA pouch.  The vickers type sling is a pretty good sling and it was pretty good when I was climbing over walls and up ladders.  My suggestion is to find a nice double point sling that is made of thick and robust material that won't bunch up.  It has to be easily adjustable. BFG makes a nice one for the M60/C6/C9.  The biggest issue that I have ever seen with LMG/HMG slings is the way that after lots of use, the material crimps up.  Just remember, the sling is only there to steady the weapon, but don't get too reliant on it.  It will get hung up at the wrong time (it brings to mind the soldier who shot himself in the nuts because his sling caught on his veh when he was dismounting). True story for another time.

Fortunately, my budget keeps me from being the kti slut I want to be.  There are definte things I have in mind however (sling, chest rig/lbv of some sort, helmet pad kit, desert boots, rifle optic (moot if I stay on the C9)).  Anyway, I look up BFGs sling for the c9.  Do you know the exact name?  I've heard good things in the past about the Vickers, that's why I asked.

Carrying weight on a leg is something I would want to avoid as much as possible and have no plans on a leg holster anytime soon.  I'm curious as to what issue kit guys went back to from gucci stuff?  In my limited experience, and from what I've gathered around her, a lot of the issue kit leaves a lot to be desired and a lot of room for improvement.  I do understand what you mean about different needs and applications however.

Thanks for the advice.

 

[geo]

problem with storebought gucci kit... if it gets busted, you're SOL.  You have to invest more $$$ to buy something that is just as likely to bust once again .. and again

some issue kit leaves things to be desired.  No argument there.  But, it's issued, it's available in quantities and everyone around you knows how to work it.

 

[HItorMiss]

Dirty Dog


I did not see a single person go back to issue kit by choice. I did see some go back briefly out of necessity or because what they had bought was not what they wanted and were waiting for something new to arrive but that is it. I can honestly say there is not a piece of kit that is issued I would not ditch in a heart beat for the stuff I can pick up myself. It might b plentiful but that is all it has going for it. I would rather pay $$$ for stuff I use then be forced to use free stuff that is crap IMO.

I too have heard great things about the vickers slings. One of the best people on this site for slings is Wonderbread he has had more then one and is generally pretty knowledgeable about kit. try PMing him.

 

[footsoldier32]

Fortunately, my budget keeps me from being the Kit slut I want to be.  There are definite things I have in mind however (sling, chest rig/lbv of some sort, helmet pad kit, desert boots, rifle optic (moot if I stay on the C9)).  Anyway, I look up BFGs sling for the c9.  Do you know the exact name?  I've heard good things in the past about the Vickers, that's why I asked.

Carrying weight on a leg is something I would want to avoid as much as possible and have no plans on a leg holster anytime soon.  I'm curious as to what issue kit guys went back to from gucci stuff?  In my limited experience, and from what I've gathered around her, a lot of the issue kit leaves a lot to be desired and a lot of room for improvement.  I do understand what you mean about different needs and applications however.

Thanks for the advice.

Ok, so budget issues will limit you.  That is good.  My suggestion is take the list that you have and try and talk to some of the guys that you may know from the other units that were on 3-06.  See if the have, a: kit you can buy at a reduce cost that they used or b: at least try it on and see what it is like.  The real big issue that may affect you back here in Canada with respect to kit is having the CofC allow you to wear it.  While we are RCR and many other Inf organisations like to think that we are spit and polish all of the time, this is not true.  Generally, we want everyone to look like a professional army with kit that is relatively robust, easily replaceable (it will break at some point and there is nothing worse than trying to work in the new issue desert boots over there) and generally good quality.  Too many younger soldiers will buy something for the LCF (Look Cool Factor) and it falls apart quickly.  So to deal with that, we set restrictions.  I am a huge fan of personal boots, modifyable TV's and slings.

Ref your question on on gucci kit, there were a lot of guys who bought the warlord (HSGI Warlord V-3) that is sold on "One Shot Tactical" but is pretty pricey $250ish.  For you C9 Gnr's it is pretty good as you can easily adjust it to fit more C9 ammo pouches and still carry first aid and water.  Your choice, but most guys actually went back to issue vest as it was pretty hard on the back carrying that extra weight on your chest.  Not to mention your profile in the prone is much higher.  Again, if you can make it work and carry more ammo without thundering in, then more power to you.  Again, see if you can try one on and buy it just before you head over as you may not be able to wear it...just in case (I would really be surprised to see you wearing it in the trg area here in Canada.  A lot of guys went back to the Elcan sight as it can more magnification.  I stuck with my EOtech because I was always too busy as  a Pl Comd to be shooting and it was great for close in work hands down.  If you have the C9, be careful, some inexperienced guys tried using iron sights on the damn things until I and my Sgt's sorted that you.  It's and area weapon, make her sing and the rest of the boys will support you.  ACOG is really the way to go with a laser red dot thingy on top are pretty top notch, but you will shell out at least $1000 for it unless you get lucky.  If it is weight, then just go with an iron sight (buy one) and become damn proficient on it.  I had a couple of soldiers that went that route with the M203/C7 combo and they did just fine in firefights.  It is hard for me to tell you which sling to go with for the C9 as I haven't carried one for real, but my suggestions would be the BFG Two Point Sling for M60/C6 / C9 from One Shot Tactical or maybe the TAG CQC Double Hook Sling (cheap but you could try it out) both are on http://www.oneshottactical.com/merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=oneshot&Category_Code=SL-BFG.  Again, some guys bought some slings that fell apart, so buy it early and trial it out as soon as you can.

Now onto boots and helmet things...SWAT and Oregon Aero Bliss Kit.  You can buy SWATS at Valley Workwear (just don't leave it till too late as they will get back logged quickly with all of the guys rushing out to buy).  The Brits sell a nice boot in KAF that is German made and seemed pretty good, so check out the Brit store over there.  As to the helmet issue, buy the Oregon Aero Bliss Kit (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mZUHvZRnt8)...anywhere from 150-200 dollars and you should be able to pick it up here in town.

Anything else, don't hesitate to ask and I am sure that there will be other guys out there who may disagree on things, so try stuff and see what works for you.

 

[HItorMiss]

Big Fan of Converse Desert boot's myself, very very robost but also light weight. And yes I did say Converse LMAO

 

[footsoldier32]

HitorMiss, don't laugh too hard...I know a couple of guys who swear by the Converse.

 

[HItorMiss]

Best Boots I have ever worn, And now I got a chit for em cause they make them in back as well.

http://www.lapolicegear.com/comefo.html?gclid=CKSnuMiEio4CFQPrYgod0F_XEA

Got both my pairs here.



EDIT: Added link