Grammar and Sentence Structures
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Ditto, funny stuff, havent seen it before.
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I know this thread is almost a year old, but I thought it best not to post this in its own thread.
"The Impotence of Proofreading"
http://youtube.com/watch?v=FjhOBiSk8Gg&mode=related&search=
"The Impotence of Proofreading"
http://youtube.com/watch?v=FjhOBiSk8Gg&mode=related&search=
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It looks like we on Army.ca/Milnet.ca aren't the only ones wondering and complaining about Grammar, Sentence Structure and Spelling:
Bad grammar backlash: Facebook groups, CBC show focus on state of the language is an article today. It has some links to other cases, such as: "Citizens Against Poor Grammar", "Grammar and Punctuation Are Your Friends", "Good Grammar IS Important", and many more links to even more links.
So there really is a grassroots backlash to the poor use of the English language in today's formal communications.
Bad grammar backlash: Facebook groups, CBC show focus on state of the language is an article today. It has some links to other cases, such as: "Citizens Against Poor Grammar", "Grammar and Punctuation Are Your Friends", "Good Grammar IS Important", and many more links to even more links.
So there really is a grassroots backlash to the poor use of the English language in today's formal communications.
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I believe the way any new member of the site should approach posting here is acting under the impression that each and every one of their posts represent the CF. If the forum were flooded by people posting spam, nonsense, and any other manner of unprofessional post, then someone visiting the forum could get the impression that the CF is full of undereducated High School dropouts; which for some trades is already an issue, in my experience. This is forum with an unusually mature user base, I'd wager that the majority of the internet forums out in intraweb land have a mean user age of 15. As a new user of the site, this is is my impression. I do not, however, claim to know the inside and out workings of this forum like the more experienced members.
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I think having good grammar and sentence structure is really important if you want to be taking seriously . I know that this is something that I have been working on to try and improve . It has been a while sense I graduated high school (1995) and I got lazy using the MSN talk on other sites so the way things are run here has helped me to try and change how I do post all together .
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Well, if you have serious ambitions of succeeding in the infantry world, one thing you must know......Snaketnk said:
the clauses on either side of a semi-colon must be grammatically complete in their own right; your second clause is not a complete sentence.
Physical memory regarding the handling of your personal weapon in a TIC will come, but grammar must be practiced constantly!
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I didn't really want to awaken an old debate, but I couldn't pass up this article in The Times: Why texting harms your IQ.
The article states that MSN speak drops your IQ more than twice as much as smoking pot.
The article states that MSN speak drops your IQ more than twice as much as smoking pot.
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Looks like text-messaging idiocy is genetic:
More parents using txt language to make their child's name gr8
More parents using txt language to make their child's name gr8
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Gee, how did I miss this thread all these years? Where do you want me to start....
In all seriousness, I was just having this conversation with my first period class this morning. We were talking about slang of the 1920/30's and I mentioned how slang is becoming more pervasive since the advent of chats and texting. Some of them just cannot write and it's frustrating trying to convince them of that. :brickwall:
Oh ya, is this an example of how technology is distracting us from our work? They are doing some seat work though
In all seriousness, I was just having this conversation with my first period class this morning. We were talking about slang of the 1920/30's and I mentioned how slang is becoming more pervasive since the advent of chats and texting. Some of them just cannot write and it's frustrating trying to convince them of that. :brickwall:
Oh ya, is this an example of how technology is distracting us from our work? They are doing some seat work though
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I'm not a teacher so I'm definitely not an expert....but could youths ever really write in the *first* place? I went to school with a lot of people whom struggled with English class, and I work with people now who are my age and still can't form a proper sentence or spell simple words. Are the kids really getting worse due to laziness, or are the poor spellers just latching onto to txt-speak because it's easier for them..?
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One thing I noticed when I was in school was that they stopped teaching grammar...it wasn't in the curriculum anymore. Then when I was in my final year, we were expected to write essays with correct grammar and most of the kids in my class didn't even know what a conjunction was. About the only ones that knew were those of us taking French because it was taught there. The English teacher was flabbergasted....apparently we were the first class that came through with the new English program that cut spelling and grammar out in Grade 7. So she had to put on extra English classes just to get the class up to snuff! Got to love how the provincial governments assume that students will just learn the skills without ever being taught them. I hope it's been changed since I left high school but I won't be holding my breath.
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Beware of glass houses and all that. We all make mistakes, as I've illustrated in the above quote ("who" is used as a subject in sentences, "whom" is a direct or indirect object. In this case, you've erroneously used "whom").the_midge said:
Having said that, I'll take my own advice, because, as I stated, we all make mistakes, and I am usually lost without "Spellcheck".
As for your question, I feel that it is a mix of poor examples in popular media, "msn-speak", and also due to our buggered up language, which is germanic in origin but heavily "polluted" with romance (thank you very much, William the Bastard!) ;D
(Have you ever wondered why we often have two words that have the same meaning? "Begin" and "Commence" mean the same thing, but one is from our germanic heritage and the other from our romance heritage!)
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Mortarman Rockpainter said:
In all fairness...I never claimed to be perfect either. But English was one of my better subjects. Better than math, but that doesn't say much.
I've been told by many people that English is one of the hardest to learn as a second language. Way too many exceptions, double-meanings, slang, etc. Maybe it's too much to ask that any of us get it right. **shrug**
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the_midge said:
Well, here's my take (part 2...my first write-up vanished before I could submit it). I'm not an English teacher and definitely not an expert, just a simple history teacher. Having taught for 10 years, I've seen a lot of students and dealt with a lot of spelling and grammar issues. Even though I just teach history, proper language usage is a huge part of this subject area (especially with the big push of literacy across the curriculum). Being able to communicate your ideas and views is an integral part of historical study. It's been my observation that language skills have deteriorated in the time that I've been in the classroom and I don't foresee it getting better anytime soon. What's the problem? Basically a combination of all of the above mentioned ideas (instruction, msn, texting and general laziness).Mortarman Rockpainter said:
I don't teach elementary, but I do know that there have been changes made to the way that grammar, spelling, phonics, etc. are taught. As for the msn and texting, I think that it ties in to the whole laziness idea. Most teachers will tell you that there has been a steady erosion of work ethic among students. This is not to say that all of them are like this, but there are enough to garner a lot of attention. The ironic thing is that many of them still expect to get top marks, without the requisite work. For example, many have mastered the art of “cut and paste” (another reason why they can't spell) and have no idea how to create a written document. I tried to teach my Gr.12’s how to properly formulate, organize, write and reference a research essay; the looks of disbelief I got! Mind you, this is the same group that complained that I use too many “complicated” words.
I, like many of the posters here, have no issue in admitting my inadequacies. I think that my grammar is pretty good, but I do have a nasty habit of leaving out words (I will reread this post many times before submitting). I will often get my wife to proofread my work to catch my goofs. This, I believe, is the crux of the entire issue. To write properly (just like anything else), requires a lot of effort. If you're not willing to put the time into it, you'll never write well or improve. If I can't spell anything, I will make a point of looking it up in the dictionary (and showing them what a dictionary is).
They need to bring back the commercials from Saturday morning cartoons...conjunction junction, what your function? ;Dteddybear said:
edited to fix spelling
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I hope members here will understand that communications in the field, in operations must go by: A, B, C:
Accuracy;
Brevity; and
Clarity.
B can always be sacrificed, just a bit, to aid A and C which are indispensable.
As the language evolves some common forms may become acceptable in the field - as soon as we are sure that everyone will understand (C),
You may have to communicate, Clearly, Briefly and Accurately when you are tired, cold, wet and frightened. The modern, reliable, high-speed, high-capacity telecommunications we take for granted here in Canada may be unavailable - army radios have a nasty habit of going off the air just when you need them most - and Brevity and Clarity become paramount when you need to send a runner to Coy HQ to pass a 100% Accurate request for fire or air support.
Just as we should train as we plan to fight, we should communicate here much as we plan to communicate in operations - and that means, above all, Clearly. Some (many?) of us don;t understand MSN-speak so when you use it you leave us in the dark.
Accuracy;
Brevity; and
Clarity.
B can always be sacrificed, just a bit, to aid A and C which are indispensable.
As the language evolves some common forms may become acceptable in the field - as soon as we are sure that everyone will understand (C),
You may have to communicate, Clearly, Briefly and Accurately when you are tired, cold, wet and frightened. The modern, reliable, high-speed, high-capacity telecommunications we take for granted here in Canada may be unavailable - army radios have a nasty habit of going off the air just when you need them most - and Brevity and Clarity become paramount when you need to send a runner to Coy HQ to pass a 100% Accurate request for fire or air support.
Just as we should train as we plan to fight, we should communicate here much as we plan to communicate in operations - and that means, above all, Clearly. Some (many?) of us don;t understand MSN-speak so when you use it you leave us in the dark.
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