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Civilan Killed, Boy Injured in Encounter with CF Troops

The Bread Guy

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Remember, this is a public forum, so let's keep speculation to ourselves while the authorities investigate.


Investigation launched after local national killed in southern Afghanistan
ISAF news release PR# 2007-665, 2 Oct 07
Article link

Kabul, Afghanistan – One local national died and one was injured in an incident in Kandahar today.

At approximately 6:45 a.m., an ISAF patrol in Kandahar experienced an equipment malfunction, which resulted in an accidental discharge from a weapon system.  It was soon apparent that two local nationals had been wounded.

ISAF troops immediately secured the scene, medical assistance was requested and the casualties were transported to a local hospital.  At the hospital one of the two injured, a 35 year old male, was confirmed dead; the other casualty is an 8 year old child.

“This incident is deeply regrettable” said Wg Cdr Antony McCord, a spokesman for Regional Command South. “ISAF will thoroughly investigate the circumstances.” 



Afghan man killed, child injured in accidental shooting by Canadian troops
Dene Moore, Canadian Press, 2 Oct 07
Article link - francais

KANDAHAR, Afghanistan - An Afghan man was killed and a child injured Tuesday in an accidental shooting by Canadian troops.

A Canadian combat logistics patrol was on a resupply mission to Canada's forward operating base at Ma'sum Ghar when a motorcycle approached the convoy in downtown Kandahar outside the governor's palace.

The driver of the motorcycle, a 35-year-old male, was shot and the passenger, an eight-year-old child, was injured.

It is unclear whether the shooting was a result of an equipment malfunction or human error.

"While the exact cause of the incident is unknown at this time, it is clear that this was an accident and not the result of enemy activity," said Capt. Josee Bilodeau, spokeswoman for Canada's Joint Task Force Afghanistan.

Canadian soldiers immediately cordoned off the area and offered medical assistance.

Afghan National Police also arrived on the scene and the victims were taken to the local hospital, where the 35-year-old driver was pronounced dead.

Military spokesman Wing-Cmdr. Antony McCord said there will be a full investigation.

"This incident is deeply regrettable," he said in a statement.

Civilian casualties have been a source of scathing criticism for foreign troops, and something the Canadian military has taken steps to avoid as they try to win the support of the Afghan public in their fight against insurgents.

International troops regularly traverse Kandahar city and its chaotic traffic en route to patrols throughout the province.

There are public service announcements in local media warning drivers to keep a safe distance from the heavily-armed convoys, which have been targetted by suicide bombers and roadside bombs.

Large red signs on the front of all military vehicles warn drivers to keep away.

When a vehicle approaches too closely, Canadian troops sound a warning alarm, followed by a warning shot into the ground or the air if the vehicle continues to advance.

"There are a lot of mitigation measures we've put in place to avoid this sort of thing," Bilodeau said.

The statement by the ISAF said the patrol "experienced an equipment malfunction, which resulted in an accidental discharge from a weapon system."

However, Canadian military officials said it is too early in the investigation to determine whether an equipment malfunction was involved.

Last month Afghans protested against international troops, including Canada, for the deaths of a religious scholar and his brother during a raid on a suspected insurgent's home.

Canadians were involved in a spate of civilian shootings in February. In those cases, the victims came too close to the soldiers' vehicles, prompting the soldiers to open fire.



Afghan man dies, child hurt after Canadian shooting
CBC.ca, 2 Oct 07
Article link

An Afghan civilian riding a motorcycle was killed by Canadian gunfire Tuesday morning in Kandahar City and a child was hurt in the same incident, military officials said.

The shooting occurred during a resupply mission in the Afghan capital when a local man riding a motorcycle with a young boy as a passenger drove up to a Canadian armoured convoy.

Either because of a weapons malfunction or an accidental discharge, the Canadian gunshots killed the 35-year-old Afghan man, Canadian military officials said. The eight-year-old boy was injured.

Soldiers immediately administered medical aid and rushed both victims to a local hospital, where the adult was pronounced dead, officials said.

Military spokesman Wing Cmdr. Antony McCord told the Canadian Press that military police are investigating the incident, but that it was not triggered by any enemy action or threat.

The NATO military mission in Afghanistan has been subject to criticism as the number of civilian casualties at the hands of foreign troops has risen.

Tuesday's killing happened only hours after a suicide bomber set off a blast in Kabul, targeting Afghan police riding in a bus. At least a dozen officers were killed in the attack — the second such incident in four days.

Although police recognized the attacker beforehand, they could not stop him from detonating his explosives near the front of the bus, Deputy Chief Zalmay Khan told the Associated Press.

On Saturday in Kabul, another suicide attacker who disguised himself in a police officer's uniform blew himself up next to a police bus, killing 30 people.


 
"Remember, this is a public forum, so let's keep speculation to ourselves while the authorities investigate."

What exactly is speculation?
Like discussing what might have happened?
Discussing past experiences among members IE " I too seen an AD with the weapons system"
Technical talk 'The gun system has been known to malfunction at times'.
'Maybe they hit a bump'

I'm not trying to be a dink here. I honestly get confused about some of this stuff. This is a privately owned public message board and when something in the news happens, it gets posted on here but we're prompted to not talk about it.  I mean rampant rumor mongering would obviously be unacceptable but what's wrong with a grown up discussion about stuff going on?
 
What is unfortunate about this is that this accident will be used by those who seek to have Canada turn tail and run.  It will be spun into the negative, careless and possibly even criminal long before any facts are ever known.

Personally, my condolences go out to this Afghani family and regardless which of the speculated causes is correct and regardless of how the anti-war crowd will spin this I think we can all say that much.
 
Shit happens - we should wait til the dust settles and there is more clear info on what went on before commenting.

Sorry to hear about this unfortuante incident, but its war, and we are human. Mistakes happen, be they mechanical or human error.

We had two UDs on my tour. One Minimi, one MAG 58 flex. The latter nearly killing two of our lads, sending the rd into the suburbian hellholes of Baghdad.


Wes
 
Reccesoldier said:
What is unfortunate about this is that this accident will be used by those who seek to have Canada turn tail and run.  It will be spun into the negative, careless and possibly even criminal long before any facts are ever known.

It is not longer "will", but is, over and over again.
 
Flawed Design said:
"Remember, this is a public forum, so let's keep speculation to ourselves while the authorities investigate."
What exactly is speculation?
Like discussing what might have happened?
Discussing past experiences among members IE " I too seen an AD with the weapons system"
Technical talk 'The gun system has been known to malfunction at times'.
'Maybe they hit a bump'

I guess I should have been more specific - I'm hoping people don't use a public forum to second guess or reach premature conclusions about what may or may not have happened in this specific incident, or "convict" anyone who may be involved (you never know if someone who knows one of the folks directly involved is reading). 

You're right - nothing wrong with discussing general issues and concerns -- I should have been clearer.
 
What are the odds of another cycle with two folks on it being engaged about an hour later in Helmand?

Incident under investigation after motorcyclists injured in Helmand Province
ISAF news release PR# 2007-667, 4 Oct 07
Article link

KABUL, Afghanistan – At approximately 7:45 a.m. on Oct. 2, an ISAF checkpoint, located near the village of Zumbalay, was approached by two individuals on a motorcycle.  In an effort to keep the motorcycle from getting too close, clear and measured warning signals were issued by ISAF troops.  The riders failed to heed the warnings and continued toward the checkpoint.

ISAF troops fired one shot and the two riders were wounded.  The site was immediately secured and first aid administered before the motorcyclists were airlifted to an ISAF medical facility for further treatment. Unfortunately one of those involved succumbed to their injuries and died in the early hours of this morning.

“Although this death is deeply regrettable, ISAF forces opened fire only after they exhausted all reasonable measures to ensure their safety,” said Wg Cdr Antony McCord, a spokesman for Regional Command South.  “Every effort is made by ISAF Forces to avoid risk to civilian life while dealing with potential insurgent threats including those posed by suicide bombers.  Afghan citizens are urged to comply with the warning signs in order to prevent these incidents.”

The warning procedures followed by ISAF troops were in accordance with rules of engagement protocols. The incident is currently under investigation.

 
Often motorcycles seem to feel they don't need to abide by the same rules as cars and trucks.  It's sad that the drivers put 3 or 4kids on bikes then not only weave in and out of traffic but come within a convoys bubble.

We've already seen motorcycle's cost us Afghan civilian lives, CF and allied soldiers lives and vehicles.
 
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