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With new Hercules soon to be on order, could some of our older models be converted into AC-130. Would a gunship be effective in a place like Afghanistan? :threat:
Best Air Support ?
- Thread starter toglmonster
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I stand to be corrected by one of our Air Force friends, but I think the best thing to do with our Hercs is to retire them. My understanding of the AC-130 is that it requires extensive reinforcement to accomodate the recoil system for the howitzer: I wonder if our current airframes are still good enough to use for that.
And, yes-the AC-130 could definitely be used in Afgh, because the US has been using it. There was at least one stationed at Bagram when I was there, and I know that it was factored into planning at least a couple of ops that I did liaison for, because of its accuracy with the howitzer, not for its miniguns.
Cheers
And, yes-the AC-130 could definitely be used in Afgh, because the US has been using it. There was at least one stationed at Bagram when I was there, and I know that it was factored into planning at least a couple of ops that I did liaison for, because of its accuracy with the howitzer, not for its miniguns.
Cheers
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I think we will be hard pressed to have a fleet of Transport Aircraft of sufficient size to handle all of our needs, without dedicating some as specialty SOF Aircraft, which would only have one use/task.
A
aesop081
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pbi said:
The CC-130s we have now are reaching the end of their life.........some are already grounded because they have maxed out their flyable hours. No sense modifying them if thay cant fly anymore
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The American A-10's are putting on a good show in Afghanistan, but will never see them in our inventory. The Apache, maybe but I won't hold my breath. Cf-18 too big a logistical tail to deploy to Afghanistan. The AC-130, well we already have Hercules in country. Just thinking of how to get the biggest bang for the smallest buck. Our own air support would be nice. Teddy Bears, hey why not.
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aesop081
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toglmonster said:
You dont understand aircraft structural life do you ?
i agree, it would be nice to have our own air support but thats been discussed already by peole more knowlegable than me. Aircraft structural life i do understand quite well. last aircraft i flew has over 21 000 hours on it.........and its all hard hours and i see the issues we deal with flying an ageing aircraft. Those Hercs you are talking about are passing 40000 hours......they should have been made into popcans years ago...not turned into gunships.
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And new AC130s would only eat away at the limited resources we have to by tactical and strategic lift air craft. What do you think we need more of?
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It has also been shown that the AC-130's are of limited practical/tactical use. They work well only when you have complete air superiority and are facing a poor and squallied enemy force (i.e. Taliban in Afghanistan and Insurgents in Iraq). Anywhere else (like a modern battlefield) they would have a very short life span.
Hey guys,
C'mon now, can't we please both sides? A teddy bear being launched out of a howitzer, being assisted by gravity at the same time, could still knock a few heads off - we get our gunships, and the NDP get their candy coated armed forces. And hey, what better dual-purpose technique than to kill the bad guys with teddy bears flying down at them at 300km per hour, only to have some orphan find it the next day? I think your onto something...
C'mon now, can't we please both sides? A teddy bear being launched out of a howitzer, being assisted by gravity at the same time, could still knock a few heads off - we get our gunships, and the NDP get their candy coated armed forces. And hey, what better dual-purpose technique than to kill the bad guys with teddy bears flying down at them at 300km per hour, only to have some orphan find it the next day? I think your onto something...
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Also, if it's the Snuggles fabric softner Teddy we're using their clothes will be springtime fresh. Come on...Do it!
TangoTwoBravo
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Zoomie said:
Just for the fun of it, what makes you think that Afghanistan and Iraq are not modern battlefields? Is there some modern battle that the air force is fighting that I'm not aware of?
In the land of the blind the one-eyed man is king. AC-130 has capabilities that are quite desirable in the counter-insurgency theatre. The A1 was quite popular in Vietnam, even though it was "obsolete." Stukas might even do the trick.
Cheers,
2B
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2B you make an excellent point. Afghanistan IS modern war. So was GWII, and so is the "post major conflict" operation that the Coalition is undertaking in OIF. It's all the way war looks, right now. (And, anyway...what does "war" really mean any more? Isn't "combat" what we're really concerned with, not whether or not we call it a "war"?...but that's a different tangent.)
And, I think you're also right about the kit: what works, works. A crossbowman can kill just as effectively today as he did 500 years ago, and in some situations he might be just the very system we want. So could a laser guided bomb. It all depends. As we have seen in Afgh, Iraq, etc, etc, it isn't always the flashy , expensive hi-tech stuff that works best: sometimes its the cheap, dirty and brutally effective.
Cheers
And, I think you're also right about the kit: what works, works. A crossbowman can kill just as effectively today as he did 500 years ago, and in some situations he might be just the very system we want. So could a laser guided bomb. It all depends. As we have seen in Afgh, Iraq, etc, etc, it isn't always the flashy , expensive hi-tech stuff that works best: sometimes its the cheap, dirty and brutally effective.
Cheers
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I just checked Jack and Olivia said no to Stukas, didn’t give a reason but I think it has something to do with mustache envy. They did however say that after talking to Gilles Bombardier is now developing a Teflon coated teddy that will survive the 300kph hit without losing its fur or glass eeyes. Hey can’t have those kids photographed with beaten up raggedy teddies. Cost is estimated at 4-5 billion so good bye to some of the goodies announced this week. Delivery guaranteed in 10 years.
Seriouly good points 2B and PBI re low tech still works especially in this type of conflict , but not too loud or they’ll be raiding the was museum and you guys will be going outside the wire with Brown Besses and Iroquois war clubs. 8)
Seriouly good points 2B and PBI re low tech still works especially in this type of conflict , but not too loud or they’ll be raiding the was museum and you guys will be going outside the wire with Brown Besses and Iroquois war clubs. 8)
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Marines continue to use the Cobra (OK... super Cobra) while the USArmy has moved on to the Apache..... simple reliable design wins out over the new & improved product.
The A10 was supposed to be "dumped" a long time ago.... and then they had a chance to prove themselves in GW 1.... simple reliable design wins out over the new & improved product
The A10 was supposed to be "dumped" a long time ago.... and then they had a chance to prove themselves in GW 1.... simple reliable design wins out over the new & improved product
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Just a note: I personally am not in love with the idea of being launched from an aircraft but jack the hardship and risk up a bit more and I'll think about it....I assume I'll get some sort of parachuting allowance and a C-8?
Teddy
Teddy
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geo said:
Just a point that I have 'pointed out' to others in the AFV Recognition lines of discusion....The USMC has a lot of its equipment predeployed aboard ship. A Super Cobra is very small, it, besides offering a smaller head-on profile, takes up little space compared to an Apache. As such you can fit two or three Super Cobras in the space that an Apache may take up aboard ship.
Now ask yourself; "Would I want one Apache in support of my Operation, or two or three Super Cobras?"
