Aviation Systems Technician ( AVN Tech )

[Sparkplugs]

The VIE is still 5 years for an AVN tech.

And now that the course in Borden has been shortened, (as of March 2008) it is no longer counted as a college course by Transport Canada, so when you leave the CF, you'd have to take a civilian AME college course again anyways, and the shortest of those is 2 years.  If you're just doing the CF thing to get the school paid for, skip it, you'll eventually have to pay it anyway.  If you honestly want to make a go as a CF technician, then I wish you all the luck in the world. 

You get a couple of travel days to get to CFB Borden after BMQ.  Some of the guys I was there with got pmq's right away, but one guy was on the waiting list for 6 months.  You'll have to start off in the shacks though, until  you get your pmq, so your family will have to stay home, for which you'll get free rations and quarters, and separation pay.  If you do move them down anyway, you'll be paying for their accomodations, as well as your own.  It can be frustrating, but you will get a pmq eventually.

When you leave the CF, your military tech quals count for only experience.  And some employers have issues with the way we do our work...  nothing wrong with the work, but they think we're too specialized.  A civvie tech, on a small-ish aircraft, will learn everything.  We still have engine techs who know nothing about the airframe, and vice versa.

I'm not trying to scare you off of the trade, but it's a huge commitment, 5 years at the least, and if you're just using it to jump off a civvie career, it won't do you much good.  After your 12-14 month course in Borden, you'll get posted to a unit, and then you'll do an apprenticeship, and then you'll have to do a type course on your aircraft, which could be anywhere from 2 months, to 8-10 months (the rumoured time frame for the new J-model Herc course in the US)...  So it's a big life, as well as time committment. 

 

[pfl]

And now that the course in Borden has been shortened, (as of March 2008) it is no longer counted as a college course by Transport Canada, so when you leave the CF, you'd have to take a civilian AME college course again anyways, and the shortest of those is 2 years.  If you're just doing the CF thing to get the school paid for, skip it, you'll eventually have to pay it anyway. 

Can anybody else confirm this for me? Not scaring me off at all but its kind of a bummer if thats the case. I'm looking at going at it for 10 years, getting a nice pension, and then a sweet civvie job lol, is this likely? And thank you for all the info so far 

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Can anybody else confirm this for me? Not scaring me off at all but its kind of a bummer if thats the case. I'm looking at going at it for 10 years, getting a nice pension, and then a sweet civvie job lol, is this likely? And thank you for all the info so far 

You will NOT get a pension for 10 years of service.  25 years is the minimum for pension under the current TOS.  Personally, I have an issue with people who join to CF for it to serve them, vice for them to serve Canada so I encourage you to tell the recruiter "this is all about me".  Make sure it is a Combat Arms officer who has done tours of FRY, Afghanistan and hasn't been home much with his/her family.

Don't dislike me for being honest.  I don't have much respect for people who use the CF, as I have dedicated my life to it and all that its about, just like my father did for 28 years. 

 

[Sparkplugs]

Can anybody else confirm this for me? Not scaring me off at all but its kind of a bummer if thats the case. I'm looking at going at it for 10 years, getting a nice pension, and then a sweet civvie job lol, is this likely? And thank you for all the info so far 

Call Transport Canada and ask if the CFSATE AVN course counts anymore.  I was on the second last course that counted as a college equivalent.

 

[pfl]

Sparkplugs, thank you for all your help so far, you're great.

Eye in the sky, get a life. Im a married man, with a young family, you cannot question any of my motives for joining up. I love Canada as much as anybody else, and even if I didnt, Im a dedicated guy. if I give my all, and uphold my end of the bargain, pay respect to those who came before me, well, what more could you want? I'm as willing to throw myself on a grenade as anybody on these boards. Can you tell me how it would be that I put money into a retirement fund every month, week ,whatever. I leave the CF and I dont get any payout? Hmmm, seeing as I have a few years experience in the mtg field, dealing as a financial advisor, please inform me. Ty

 

[kincanucks]

Sparkplugs, thank you for all your help so far, you're great.

Eye in the sky, get a life. Im a married man, with a young family, you cannot question any of my motives for joining up. I love Canada as much as anybody else, and even if I didnt, Im a dedicated guy. if I give my all, and uphold my end of the bargain, pay respect to those who came before me, well, what more could you want? I'm as willing to throw myself on a grenade as anybody on these boards. Can you tell me how it would be that I put money into a retirement fund every month, week ,whatever. I leave the CF and I dont get any payout? Hmmm, seeing as I have a few years experience in the mtg field, dealing as a financial advisor, please inform me. Ty

Perhaps if you did some research on the CF Pension Plan you would understand your entitlements.  And he didn't say you wouldn't get any payout just that you shouldn't expect a pension.


HH and DA

 

[observor 69]

By payout, at the end of ten years service, you mean return of contributions ?

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Eye in the sky, get a life.

I said what I think, my opinion, and thats that.  I never pass my opinion off as anything other than my opinion. 

I am off to go try to get a life now.  :-*

 

[Eye In The Sky]

I love Canada as much as anybody else, and even if I didnt, Im a dedicated guy. if I give my all, and uphold my end of the bargain, pay respect to those who came before me, well, what more could you want? I'm as willing to throw myself on a grenade as anybody on these boards. Can you tell me how it would be that I put money into a retirement fund every month, week ,whatever. I leave the CF and I dont get any payout? Hmmm, seeing as I have a few years experience in the mtg field, dealing as a financial advisor, please inform me. Ty

I never questioned how much you love Canada/living in Canada.  Serving Canada is different IMHO.  What do you know about that? 

As stated, you said the word pension.  I merely said you wouldn't get a pension.  That, after 10 years service is a fact.  Full stop.  With your few years mtg experience, I will assume I don't have to find the applicable sources to confirm this, you should do fine on your own. 

 

[pfl]

Ah what do you want lol I dont lay down for much. Somebody with manners already informed me as to what actually happens in that scenario 

 

[chinook003]

Please remember that the military is not in the business of training people for civilian careers. Their sole goal is to get you ready for the job that they want you to do and nothing else. If you want a civilian qualification you can take courses and study on your own time while in the service to prepare youeself for a civilian career.

 

[pfl]

I've come to accept that, and it has not really changed my opinion of the CF. Im as excited as ever to get in, and as I recently made the drive from Montreal to Toronto, stopping by in Trenton has made me more determined than ever to try and get posted there (Cold Lake will do also lol). Basically I just want in. I know the CF has courses to help its members ease back into civilian life and when the time comes, 5 or 10 years down the road I will use those. You know, it seems that camo gear is back in fashion on the streets, but I couldnt do it cause I would fell like such a damn poser. Its the true CF uniform for me or nothing.

 

[cp140tech]

The military has a way of holding on to folks who get in with the intention of doing a few years and jumping back into civvie life.

In any event, we can certainly use the help.... some of the young folks who get in with the intention of gaining skills and experience are among the most motivated and productive techs that I've worked with.  Listen and learn from the people around you, put in an honest effort and everybody will come out ahead.

Good luck.

 

[pfl]

Thank you Peabody, thats the type of encouragement that works well lol
Can I just run through the timeline w/ you guys? Once into BMQ its 3 months, then off to Borden for 12 or 15 months, off to a squadron for some more trainng, then off to my first posting, right? When will I do QL5's? At the squadron? After which I would recieve Spec 1 pay? Just asking cause I like to know as much as possible, thanks to anyone who can clarify, I know this isnt the most complicated question....but military timelines from what it seems can be quite the fickle lady lol

 

[belka]

Here is a rough timeline:

1)Basic training - 11-12 weeks.
2)Pat Platoon in Borden - 0-12months. (depends if you get luck and put on course or not). Personally, I was on PAT for 3 months, others were aslong as a year.
3)AVN course (QL3) - 12-15 months.
4)Posting to Squadron after grad.
5)Now, depending on what aircraft you are posted to, you might get a course right away for your QL5's or you might have to go a few months as an apprentice getting your log book signed off. Either way, you don't get your Spec pay until you are a Cpl and QL5 qualified.

You might get into a situation, like myself and a few other Pte's in the sqn, who hold their QL5's and POM's yet don't recieve spec pay. While there are new remustered cpl's coming in from Borden who do get spec. We are more qualified and trained, yet recieve alot less pay.  :-X

 

[pfl]

Thanks bro, but whats PAT Platoon? Kind of a holding pen I guess?

 

[belka]

Personel Awaiting Training. Or the cattle ranch.  ;D

 

[pfl]

What goes on during PAT? Can I have my wife and kid with me in a PMQ? What are the day to day duties and all that..

 

[belka]

Usually alot of sitting around and waiting for something to happen. You might get lucky and get sent to another base/unit for OJT for a few months. Yes, you can bring your family.

 

[George Wallace]

What goes on during PAT? Can I have my wife and kid with me in a PMQ? What are the day to day duties and all that..

If you don't want to use SEARCH; then perhaps you guys ought to take this to PMs as these questions have been covered in many topics already.