Ambulance Replacement (Mega thread)

[nsmedicman]

Is there any recent word on a replacement for the LSVW ambulance?

 

[Thompson_JM]

Ive seen an F450 set up as a Military Crash Amb in Ottawa at the war museum a few years back... i dont think it was going to be a replacement per say, (talking to the people at the display) but they said there are a few in the system... As I said I think it was a COTS purchase to fill a specific short term Requirement, and not intended as a replacement... that was the impression I got.... but that was also two years ago at a static display... Im sure there are people on here with a better ear to the ground then I.

 

[rogsco]

The F450 amb was purchased for the Fd Hosp, but some have also been distributed out to Fd Ambs. There was a vehcile survey that came out from Ottawa (last fall?) that was asking about the wants/needs for a COTS to replace LSVW (not just ambs) like the Milverado's replaced the Iltis. Nothing more heard since the survey was done. I suspect the LS will be with us for a while longer.

 

[Donut]

That's unfortunate, there're some really capable cots-suitable 4wd ambulances out there, most far superior to the LSVW.

Does anyone know if unsat condition reports have been sent up?  I know that's probably a stupid question, but if we've never identified it as a piece of shite, we can't complain when they aren't replaced or fixed.

DF

 

[nsmedicman]

Unfortunately the LSVW was, and still is a POS. Apparently, at one time it may have been a fairly good vehicle. Whatever was done to the design once we received it, I have no idea. Unfortunately as well, we may be stuck with it for some time. Bring back the CUCV amb!!!  ;D

 

[Armymedic]

Bison all the way, baby. Too bad its armoured. Then the 450's do on-road fine. We need the Euro's Gwagon version of an amb for us here.

 

[nsmedicman]

I would love to see Bisons in PRes Fd Ambs.....but I don't think that it's going to happen within my career....Would settle for the amb modules off the LSVW, refurbished and mounted on a new 1 ton or 5/4 ton 4X4 chassis.....Ford, GM, Dodge.....doesn't really matter. Even a commercially produced 4x4 ambulance would probably work.....

What about a vehicle like this one? Just a thought.

 

[xo31@711ret]

Nice looking amb, but I doubt we'll ever see one like it!

-ger

 

[medic269]

Nice and compact.  Does it use the 35a/p stretcher setup with antlers?  Only thing I wouldnt like is the cage separating the driver's cockpit from the back...but then again I'm used to civie trucks.

 

[CBH99]

I worked as an EMT up on the rigs for a bit, before getting hired with the City of Calgary as an EMT-P.

The service I worked for (One of the better ones, fortunately) invested in modified SUV's as BLS units.  We had rollon/rollout stretchers, defib. capability in the back, and enough room for one EMT to work while the other drove.  Unlike the newer ambulances used by the City of Calgary, we had to stop the vehicle anytime we needed to defib. a patient (Which was only once) - however, the vehicle itself was quite good.  I'm unfamiliar with the training and scope of practice of Army medics and Fd Amb. units - however - this could be a possible solution? 

What is the scope of practice for Fd Amb. anyhow?  I know this is probably covered on another thread, however, for the sake of knowing what possible solutions exist to replace our ambulances, we need to know exactly what the Fd. Amb. units require.  Do they require BLS units, or ALS units?

 

[Armymedic]

What about a vehicle like this one? Just a thought.

Not a bad thought, sort of a mod of a milcot style truck. That would be good as a training/safety veh for the res Fd Ambs, and as a good temp replacement for the reg fd ambs. Only draw back is load capability. Most evac platforms we need should be able to carry 4 or so litter loads.

What is the scope of practice for Fd Amb. anyhow?  I know this is probably covered on another thread, however, for the sake of knowing what possible solutions exist to replace our ambulances, we need to know exactly what the Fd. Amb. units require.  Do they require BLS units, or ALS units?

There isn't a scope. You have levels of training from baisc FA to trauma surgeon working at fd ambs. You can not nor should not limit your evac platform to a skill level, but maintain one level for all. Currently our LSVW ambs have a basic load for BLS and 450's and Bisons have a ALS basic load, but that is as they sit collecting dust on them. They are quickly upgraded as the need sees fit.

 

[nsmedicman]

The F450s would probably be a good solution, but the more experienced members of the forum might disagree. The problem with them is that they don't go very far from a well-maintained road. Then again, has anyone ever gotten a LSVW stuck on an icy hill with a slight grade???  ;D

 

[The Heathen]

I got qualified on the 450 crash amb last month.  It has some great features, tons of room, lots of storage, and a hydraulic lift on either side, so it is still capable of carrying 4 patients.  On the downside, its as if no one really thought out what we need access to quickly, and there is no place to put anything other than medical supplies.  For it to work as an LS Amb replacement, it would need somewhere to store rucks etc.  Also, it's mad drifty on gravel roads, especially in the wind.  Plus, the vehicle itself is LONG, and has little ground clearance, it wouldn't do well in the field.

So a replacement it is not.  Sweet vehicle, has AC and a CD player, so I'm willing to forgive a lot.  It makes range taskings so comfortable, and in that way, it is way better than the LS.

The problem is we need a vehicle that goes X country, and carries 4 patients  + medic + kit.  Something tacked on the G wagon might do it.  If the LS just had a more powerful engine, better shocks, not steel brakes, and constant servicing, it would be a fine vehicle. 

 

[medicineman]

I miss the Unimog amb I had in Croatia in the mid 90's - the thing could carry everything you need and then some, had high ground clearance, and would literally go ANYWHERE (with very few exceptions).  It was 12 speed manual - 8 gears forward, 4 reverse and ungoverned, could really motor.  Due to the high ground clearance, there was hydraulic assist for the litter racks.

If we want to stay a little closer to home, play a bit with the old CUCV's and they're pretty good platforms.  I just remember some problems with the litter rack pins sometimes breaking, that annoying hub lock for 4x4 and of course the heaters were a bit of a problem.  The AC in  summer, the walk through cab and space more than made up for the other problems.

My 2 pennies.

MM

 

[nsmedicman]

medicineman.....

Did it look something like this??

This is actually a Danish Army model....

 

[George Wallace]

I miss the Unimog amb I had in Croatia in the mid 90's - the thing could carry everything you need and then some, had high ground clearance, and would literally go ANYWHERE (with very few exceptions).  It was 12 speed manual - 8 gears forward, 4 reverse and ungoverned, could really motor.  Due to the high ground clearance, there was hydraulic assist for the litter racks.

All that great kit that came from 4 CMBG.  We even had those big MAN Tank Transporters.....only four, but.......what a truck........and real 10 Tonne MAN Transports......not those 7 Tonne (10 ton) Steyr Percheron trucks that we landed up with.......and those buses.......

I am greatly disappointed in our LSVW; White Stars knock off of the Italian Iveco which is the Italian knock off of the German Unimog.

 

[medicineman]

nsmedicman - Mine was all white with the targets attached, both blue and red.

George - what was really ironic was my partner was in 4 Fd Amb and the truck we had was his in the Amb Coy there.  Small world.  I loced that beast - unfortunately, I had to trade her in for a different one after my steering box got damaged, as we weren't allowed to canniblalize for spare parts and none were available (courtesy of both our Gov't and the UN).

MM

 

[medicineman]

My beast is the one on the right (well the only Umimog there really) old 83C2.

 

[Blackadder1916]

Did it look something like this??
This is actually a Danish Army model....

That one is an older U404 model.  The ones that 4 Fd Amb got in 1986 were U1300L models.  They had excellent cross-country capability and had been acquired to replace the M113 tracks as well as to augment the 5/4 ton ambs.  IRRC we had 6 or 7, the only ones in the Cdn inventory.  They were bigger than the U404.  Lots more payload, longer wheel base, higher ground clearance & fording depth.  They were also diesel vice gas in the 404s which had a reputation for sucking gas faster than a soldaten swilling beer on a Friday night.

 

[nsmedicman]

I guess one can dream.... ;D