More to my last on VSW ( very Shallow water) Ops, this area came to the fore during Gulf War I, when the preferred landing areas In Kuwait were determined to be heavily mined and covered by direct fire, and there was very little support for having new colour footage of troops being blown up, and machine gunned going ashore. since then, The US and allies have spent countless resources on attempting to clandestinely breach the Littoral zone. They transferred 100s of Marine amphib swimmers, Navy EOD divers & Seals to new VSW units, complete with underwater GPS, and Visual Sonar ( think Radar gun with colour LCD Screen) . They have also spent millions, probably billions, on training dolphins to swim the surf . I bring this up because concurrent with all this, the Australians have been quietly, to my ears anyway, been developing their own, low tech methods of doing the same tasks, and have had some success. Their attitude is low key, and suited to Canadian sensibilities, and setup would be a good Canadian model, and would bear some study
S
Sapper Bloggins
Guest
"Not sure if he is the KING of Divers"
I(we) had always thought of Mr. Roy Hogben as THE King Combat Diver
Cheers.
I(we) had always thought of Mr. Roy Hogben as THE King Combat Diver
Cheers.
- Reaction score
- 3,104
- Points
- 1,160
I always thought it was Rene Hache.... ;D
- Reaction score
- 0
- Points
- 210
I put a SEALS VIDEO link on line for you adventurous types - see www.donlowconcrete.com/CDAC
Also - next week wil be posting an article from the 5 RGC Dive Team
Also - next week wil be posting an article from the 5 RGC Dive Team
- Reaction score
- 0
- Points
- 210
Ya, the pictures are all great up to the SAS-style, blacked out eyes nonsense. Give me a break. I sincerely hope that it wasn't a current combat diver who did this. Gives us all a bad name.
S6.
p.s. The only cbt diver I ever saw with blacked-out eyes was Gully on Cbt Diver Crse 9101 after a particularly rough night at "The Forge".
S6.
p.s. The only cbt diver I ever saw with blacked-out eyes was Gully on Cbt Diver Crse 9101 after a particularly rough night at "The Forge".
S6, the ADC fully supports all of the efforts by our fellow post-er 54/102 CEF, who administers the CDAC website. The ADC and the units forward articles/photos (whenever we get off our butts to do so!) and 54/102 CEF sets things up. God knows no one else I know has the time, capability, or desire to take on that role so we are very thankful for the effort he puts into the site.
Gully, ref the 150 fsw (and the inactivation of the Dive O qualification), surprisingly neither has been met with hugs and kisses by those a wee bit higher in the chain of command. The ADC goals remain increasing capabilities and safety. We feel these steps do both. I agree that combat dive teams - who are lucky to get in the water a couple of times a month - shouldn't be walking into Dive Stores one morning and look at each other and say, "Hey! Let's drop down to 140 fsw in some dark lake!" For us, there's work ups involved. Do a couple of 70-100 fsw dives and the next day start deeper stuff. I'm also a believer that these should be LWSSDS dives so the Supervisor has comms and control of his team. Getting the authorization for 150 fsw simply increases options for commanders, increase our interoperability with Navy and Allied teams, and allows us to use the CABA eqpt to its authorized max.
Ref the VSW MCM issues, based on my recent meetings with Navy staff, your side of the house has plans already in the works for seeking to set up a new VSW unit. The scope of responsibilities planned for that unit seem, to an Army guy, to be moving into areas the Army may take issues with. FYI, there has been discussion of including combat divers in that unit. Thanks to inputs from Navy and other misc Amphib Ops staff who have been very supportive in offering advice, I am a bit aware of US/Aussie efforts and have stressed on the Ex ROGUISH BUOY invites to US/UK/Aussies/FR/BE/GE/NE that they send their VSW guys to the ex. We'll see what kind of response/participation we get. FDU(A) has been extremely supportive of ADC efforts on EX RB 06 thus far. We'll be doing a recce of the Halifax area 21-25 Nov. The ADC is also planning to visit key players in the US (if they'll have us!!!!) in the New Year.
The dive course is in its last couple of weeks. Just finished demolitions and are into the lifting portion at George Lake now. Steve Scott is the lead (and only) instructor and likely running on fumes now. Aside from Ex RB 06, the rest of the ADC staff is focused on eqpt issues now. We're trying to find an Army org that has lots of year end money it needs spent. We have a fairly long wish list. Paul Albertson will be heading our trial of flotation vests at the EDU in Dec. In the New Year, we switch gears to developing the Army requal crse, VSW issues, and wrapping up the Dive Supr TP.
Hoping to meet with Comd LFDTS next week if he can fit the ADC into his schedule when he visits Gagetown. There are so many things going on at the ADC your heads spins ...or is that the beer? Anyway, we'll see if he has guidance on future ADC efforts. Will keep all info.
Gully, ref the 150 fsw (and the inactivation of the Dive O qualification), surprisingly neither has been met with hugs and kisses by those a wee bit higher in the chain of command. The ADC goals remain increasing capabilities and safety. We feel these steps do both. I agree that combat dive teams - who are lucky to get in the water a couple of times a month - shouldn't be walking into Dive Stores one morning and look at each other and say, "Hey! Let's drop down to 140 fsw in some dark lake!" For us, there's work ups involved. Do a couple of 70-100 fsw dives and the next day start deeper stuff. I'm also a believer that these should be LWSSDS dives so the Supervisor has comms and control of his team. Getting the authorization for 150 fsw simply increases options for commanders, increase our interoperability with Navy and Allied teams, and allows us to use the CABA eqpt to its authorized max.
Ref the VSW MCM issues, based on my recent meetings with Navy staff, your side of the house has plans already in the works for seeking to set up a new VSW unit. The scope of responsibilities planned for that unit seem, to an Army guy, to be moving into areas the Army may take issues with. FYI, there has been discussion of including combat divers in that unit. Thanks to inputs from Navy and other misc Amphib Ops staff who have been very supportive in offering advice, I am a bit aware of US/Aussie efforts and have stressed on the Ex ROGUISH BUOY invites to US/UK/Aussies/FR/BE/GE/NE that they send their VSW guys to the ex. We'll see what kind of response/participation we get. FDU(A) has been extremely supportive of ADC efforts on EX RB 06 thus far. We'll be doing a recce of the Halifax area 21-25 Nov. The ADC is also planning to visit key players in the US (if they'll have us!!!!) in the New Year.
The dive course is in its last couple of weeks. Just finished demolitions and are into the lifting portion at George Lake now. Steve Scott is the lead (and only) instructor and likely running on fumes now. Aside from Ex RB 06, the rest of the ADC staff is focused on eqpt issues now. We're trying to find an Army org that has lots of year end money it needs spent. We have a fairly long wish list. Paul Albertson will be heading our trial of flotation vests at the EDU in Dec. In the New Year, we switch gears to developing the Army requal crse, VSW issues, and wrapping up the Dive Supr TP.
Hoping to meet with Comd LFDTS next week if he can fit the ADC into his schedule when he visits Gagetown. There are so many things going on at the ADC your heads spins ...or is that the beer? Anyway, we'll see if he has guidance on future ADC efforts. Will keep all info.
Been awhile since I've had a chance to look at the site. S6, ref Ex RB 06, the rough plan is:
half General Support diving tasks:
(1) Debris clearance eg clearing demolished bridges out of a navigable waterway. Means lots of tool use, Broco cutting, and lifting.
(2) search and recovery - bodies, cars, weapons. Will introduce preservation of evidence, proper body recovery, sonars and drop cameras for searches
and half Very Shallow Water Mine Counter-Mine type tasks. (this one a little trickier because so new and we don't have dolphins, UUVs, UAVs, INSS, REBREATHERS! and lots of other required kit. We'll just have to suck up and do/develop the drills.)
(1) boat handling and long distance night nav trg (hopefully we won't have boat teams sailing off into the Atlantic)
(2) shallow water and beach obstacle breaching - FYI, it'll be an explosive free ex - we're in Halifax after all.
There'll be a few lectures and likely a lot more bottom time than in the past. Hope to have a few international players and lots of help from FDU(A). We'll see. Warning O has been issued, Op O still being hashed out. Ex runs 30 Apr-19 May.
half General Support diving tasks:
(1) Debris clearance eg clearing demolished bridges out of a navigable waterway. Means lots of tool use, Broco cutting, and lifting.
(2) search and recovery - bodies, cars, weapons. Will introduce preservation of evidence, proper body recovery, sonars and drop cameras for searches
and half Very Shallow Water Mine Counter-Mine type tasks. (this one a little trickier because so new and we don't have dolphins, UUVs, UAVs, INSS, REBREATHERS! and lots of other required kit. We'll just have to suck up and do/develop the drills.)
(1) boat handling and long distance night nav trg (hopefully we won't have boat teams sailing off into the Atlantic)
(2) shallow water and beach obstacle breaching - FYI, it'll be an explosive free ex - we're in Halifax after all.
There'll be a few lectures and likely a lot more bottom time than in the past. Hope to have a few international players and lots of help from FDU(A). We'll see. Warning O has been issued, Op O still being hashed out. Ex runs 30 Apr-19 May.
That's up to much higher pay grades to decide. All we are doing is trying to gather enough info about the expected tasks, eqpt needed, training then required, resultant changes necessary to current unit dive team orbats (or even creation of new units or trades), and an estimate of time to complete all, and it will be pushed up the chain of command for an informed decision to be made. At that point the Army will say "Combat divers, welcome to the new world of the SCTF" or "Get back into the rivers and lakes, you mud divers, ocean diving is a Navy job."
Right now there are a number of low level initiatives, such as ours, which are a bit stove piped in that, presently, I don't believe there is one central point of contact from the SCTF itself directing what needs to be looked at from both a diver and an Engineer angle. That is fast changing I understand as the APS starts to kick in, but right now there are separate Army and Navy staff efforts being done in this area. However, there has been some combining of efforts as we and Navy counterparts are looking into the potential of a dedicated mine counter-mine diving unit to support the SCTF. This could be an all singing-all dancing, cross-trained unit involving Army and Navy divers as well as Pathfinder/SOF types.
There is also the thought out there that there are "lines in the sand" if you will, where Navy divers go to a certain point, and then Army types take over. Keep each dog in its own cage. Where that will happen: 10 fsw or high water mark or wherever, others will decide.
Should a few administrative hoops be addressed, there's a fair chance of an Army/Navy team heading to another distant country which has dive units doing very similar things. I'm hoping this trip will provide lots of int and TTPs which I plan on incorporating into Ex RB 06.
Know of SCTF positions for Engineer types? One of ours may be penciled in already.
Right now there are a number of low level initiatives, such as ours, which are a bit stove piped in that, presently, I don't believe there is one central point of contact from the SCTF itself directing what needs to be looked at from both a diver and an Engineer angle. That is fast changing I understand as the APS starts to kick in, but right now there are separate Army and Navy staff efforts being done in this area. However, there has been some combining of efforts as we and Navy counterparts are looking into the potential of a dedicated mine counter-mine diving unit to support the SCTF. This could be an all singing-all dancing, cross-trained unit involving Army and Navy divers as well as Pathfinder/SOF types.
There is also the thought out there that there are "lines in the sand" if you will, where Navy divers go to a certain point, and then Army types take over. Keep each dog in its own cage. Where that will happen: 10 fsw or high water mark or wherever, others will decide.
Should a few administrative hoops be addressed, there's a fair chance of an Army/Navy team heading to another distant country which has dive units doing very similar things. I'm hoping this trip will provide lots of int and TTPs which I plan on incorporating into Ex RB 06.
Know of SCTF positions for Engineer types? One of ours may be penciled in already.
- Reaction score
- 0
- Points
- 210
Combat Divers doing their 'thang...oh, and that's Ex ROUGISH BUOY not ROGUE BUOY!
Navy / Marine Maple Leaf, 12 April 2006, Vol. 9, No. 15
la Feuille d'érable, 12 avril 2006, vol. 9 no 15
In-land Army divers get a taste of Navy sea life
By Kurt Heinrich
ESQUIMALT, B.C. — Jacques Cousteau once said southern Vancouver Island and Puget Sound had the best temperate water for diving in the world. Army engineer divers accustomed to the cold, murky mud lakes of northern Alberta are now apt to agree.
In late March, the Navy divers gave them a chance to see the diverse marine life and refresh their diving skills in Operation SALTY SAPPER.
“We came here because right now, in Edmonton, there is still two feet of ice on all the places with water,” said Captain Jean-Olivier Berger, First Combat Engineer Regiment member.
Fleet Diving Unit (Pacific) [FDU(P)] supported the week-long annual exercise. Sixteen divers from Edmonton, Gagetown, and Valcartier participated in the exercise. “We need Army divers because they do underwater demolition and underwater construction in lakes and rivers inland,” said Lieutenant(N) Clay Cochrane, operations officer at FDU(P).
Combat engineers practiced underwater welding and cutting, using special underwater blowtorches to practice skills needed to build and repair bridges. “Diving is a perishable skill and if you don’t remain current, you can become an impediment to your self and your team mates,” said Lt(N) Cochrane.
The divers have to refresh their skills to maintain their diving certification, which requires at least one dive every 90 days. Part of this refresher course included using underwater Bronco torches to cut and weld metal tetrahedrons or underwater obstructions.
Esquimalt provided divers an ideal environment to work in. Divers completed a jackstay: an underwater rope course more than 20 feet below the surface among various metal buoys. They made several shallow and medium dives, as well as a number of deepwater dives to about 100 feet off Abalone, a diving support vessel operated by FDU(P).
The experience helped Army divers prepare for Op ROGUE BUOY, an international diving exercise to be held later this summer in Shearwater, N.S. The operation will include divers from across the country, as well as teams from New Zealand, Australia, the US, and Belgium.
Mr. Heinrich writes for the Lookout.
S6
Navy / Marine Maple Leaf, 12 April 2006, Vol. 9, No. 15
la Feuille d'érable, 12 avril 2006, vol. 9 no 15
In-land Army divers get a taste of Navy sea life
By Kurt Heinrich
ESQUIMALT, B.C. — Jacques Cousteau once said southern Vancouver Island and Puget Sound had the best temperate water for diving in the world. Army engineer divers accustomed to the cold, murky mud lakes of northern Alberta are now apt to agree.
In late March, the Navy divers gave them a chance to see the diverse marine life and refresh their diving skills in Operation SALTY SAPPER.
“We came here because right now, in Edmonton, there is still two feet of ice on all the places with water,” said Captain Jean-Olivier Berger, First Combat Engineer Regiment member.
Fleet Diving Unit (Pacific) [FDU(P)] supported the week-long annual exercise. Sixteen divers from Edmonton, Gagetown, and Valcartier participated in the exercise. “We need Army divers because they do underwater demolition and underwater construction in lakes and rivers inland,” said Lieutenant(N) Clay Cochrane, operations officer at FDU(P).
Combat engineers practiced underwater welding and cutting, using special underwater blowtorches to practice skills needed to build and repair bridges. “Diving is a perishable skill and if you don’t remain current, you can become an impediment to your self and your team mates,” said Lt(N) Cochrane.
The divers have to refresh their skills to maintain their diving certification, which requires at least one dive every 90 days. Part of this refresher course included using underwater Bronco torches to cut and weld metal tetrahedrons or underwater obstructions.
Esquimalt provided divers an ideal environment to work in. Divers completed a jackstay: an underwater rope course more than 20 feet below the surface among various metal buoys. They made several shallow and medium dives, as well as a number of deepwater dives to about 100 feet off Abalone, a diving support vessel operated by FDU(P).
The experience helped Army divers prepare for Op ROGUE BUOY, an international diving exercise to be held later this summer in Shearwater, N.S. The operation will include divers from across the country, as well as teams from New Zealand, Australia, the US, and Belgium.
Mr. Heinrich writes for the Lookout.
S6
- Reaction score
- 3,104
- Points
- 1,160
Good article, but are the press EVER going to stop shagging up the name of my beloved ex-regiment?
Similar threads
