With regards to the new Minister of Defence here is Peter Worthington

[Scoobie Newbie]

That was what I was trying to say.  Thanks for making it easier to articulate.

 

[MJP]

Well said Slim and CFL.
Just an addition I poached off another site from a Coy commander that deploy with 3VP.  After reading it maybe the armchair generals can tell me what part of not closing with the enemy 3VP didn't do?

I would suggest that "shots fired in anger" is a relative term. It is true that the only direct engagements against positively identified enemy combattants were those prosecuted by members of Recce Pl during the initial stages of Op ANACONDA. However, I would argue it is also true that the many direct-fire SA and AT rounds, satchel charges, etc, expended in prepping sangars and caves for clearance on the Whale were fully intended to kill enemy soldiers. The fact that those fighting positions had been abandonned is largely irrelevant, as the soldiers doing the shooting did not know that. Many soldiers within the rifle coys fired rounds with the expressed intent of killing enemy combattants. We can split hairs all day long, but I would consider any round fired with the expressed intention of killing whoever is at the far end, to be a shot "fired in anger".

Apparently the guys you've been talking to around 3 VP have also forgotten the mortar barrage fired with the intent of killing the escaping AQ on the South end of the Whale. I am personally aware of yet another incident where a Pl Comd engaged an enemy target with rifle fiire during a bunker clearance with his signaller. The fact that the engaged enemy turned out to be previously deceased should not belittle the fact that upon transitioning from bright daylight to a dim bunker and idenifying a potential threat, the individual in question immediately engaged to kill. Again, I would suggest that those were "shots fired in anger".

 

[Slim]

I would suggest that "shots fired in anger" is a relative term.
Apparently the guys you've been talking to around 3 VP have also forgotten the mortar barrage fired with the intent of killing the escaping AQ on the South end of the Whale. I am personally aware of yet another incident where a Pl Comd engaged an enemy target with rifle fiire during a bunker clearance with his signaller. The fact that the engaged enemy turned out to be previously deceased should not belittle the fact that upon transitioning from bright daylight to a dim bunker and idenifying a potential threat, the individual in question immediately engaged to kill. Again, I would suggest that those were "shots fired in anger".

I love the fact that I'm a Canadian...But sometimes this "apoplogist" way of life we have starts to rub a bit! Those soldiers did a bang-up job! Why take take away from their accomplishments with armchair crap from some one who has never even seen an enemy, except perhaps on television.

They had no way of knowing what they were up against when they cleared those caves. They went, and did a profesional job, without complaint!

I say again, good job!

Slim

 

[Kirkhill]

Reference the discussion about the PPCLIs on this thread I can only agree with those who say "Good Job".

However the original discussion point was the new MND.  I just saw something in today's National Post (I think - I can't find it again).  Surprised the heck out of me but should make Ex-Dragoon ecstatic - Bill was a Subby in the Navy.  He got out in '57.  Precious eh?? ;D

I still don't like him but for military experience I think he has got everybody beat except for Sgt Barney Danson and Cpl Paul Hellyer. 

Cheers.