Will CSOR have a set of regimental colours

[Disenchantedsailor]

on a side note but another CANSOFCOM unit recieved battle honours I'll post the Canforgen when I get back to work tonight,  JTF-2 now shares battle honours with the Artillery and Engineers,  "Ubique"

 

[dapaterson]

Saw that one as well.  We've created a contradictory situation, though:  Either JTF-2 gets "Ubique" or they can get other honours- they can't get both.

 

[Disenchantedsailor]

I'm confused how is it contradictory, CSOR and JTF-2 are 2 different regiments within CANSOFCOM,

 

[Michael OLeary]

Read the two messages separately, and, for clarity, HONOUR-BEARING STATUS FOR CANSOFCOM UNITS should have been published before PERPETUATION OF 1ST CANADIAN SPECIAL SERVICE BATTALION, CIC, CASF BY THE CANADIAN SPECIAL OPERATIONS REGIMENT,

HONOUR-BEARING STATUS FOR CANSOFCOM UNITS gives both CSOR and JTF-2, two separate units, the right to bear honours.

PERPETUATION OF 1ST CANADIAN SPECIAL SERVICE BATTALION, CIC, CASF BY THE CANADIAN SPECIAL OPERATIONS REGIMENT gives the one unit, CSOR, the right to perpetuate the existing honours of the 1st CSSB.

Two different issues.

The real good news may be this - SECOND MEETING OF THE BATTLE HONOURS COMMITTEE 27 SEP 07 - i.e., that there is currently a Battle Honours Committe and that it is having meetings.

 

[Haggis]

Read the two messages separately, and, for clarity, HONOUR-BEARING STATUS FOR CANSOFCOM UNITS should have been published before PERPETUATION OF 1ST CANADIAN SPECIAL SERVICE BATTALION, CIC, CASF BY THE CANADIAN SPECIAL OPERATIONS REGIMENT,

The DTG on both messages is identical.  I guess the message centre dosen't pay attention to stuff like "precedence" and, possibly, no clear instructions on release sequence was provided with the messages.  I posted the messages in numerical sequence.

The real good news may be this - SECOND MEETING OF THE BATTLE HONOURS COMMITTEE 27 SEP 07 - i.e., that there is currently a Battle Honours Committe and that it is having meetings.

Yep, I saw that too.  Good news, indeed!

 

[geo]

Propat,
By tradition some units that are "in the thick of it" don't.
The Artillery don't .... they have their guns instead
The Rifle units don't... they have their drums
The Engineers don't.... though they have the batthe honour "UBIQUE" (Everywhere)

 

[ProPatria031]

why does RCR have colors then???

 

[ArmyRick]

RCR have colours because they are a line infantry regiment. When they say rifles they are reffering to QOR, RRR or Brockville rifs, etc, etc.

 

[ProPatria031]

Ah seen, thanks for the clarification. I sure hope CSOR will get them  8)

 

[rifleman]

Just a side bar, Rifle regiments, wear their Primary Battle Honours on their Cap Badge. The drums are just an instrument that lends to painting all the battle honours on.

 

[geo]

Just a side bar, Rifle regiments, wear their Primary Battle Honours on their Cap Badge. The drums are just an instrument that lends to painting all the battle honours on.

Their cap badges aren't that large....
the Drums are their Colours.

The way you say it, the regimental colours are just an instrument that lends to stitching on all the battle honours on...

Precisely!

 

[Michael OLeary]

THE HONOURS, FLAGS AND HERITAGE STRUCTURE OF THE CANADIAN FORCES
pp 5-1-3

c. ...(rifle regiments have no Colours as their original tactical role precluded them from carrying and using Colours on the battlefield). (See Note below.)

NOTE

The drums of rifle and voltigeur regiments are not Colours, although they may be emblazoned with battle honours and honorary distinctions. Drums shall not be paid compliments. (See also Chapter 4, Annex A.)

 

[geo]

DOH!

While I would never suggest that the Drums would have been taken into battle as a gathering / rallying point - I stand corrected that they are not colours - though - by common usage, on ceremonial occasions the drums are given the same courtessies as a stand of colours.

I still stand by my other comment Cap badges aren't coulours either.

Last I checked, only the Engineers and the Artillery carry their Battle Honour "UBIQUE" on their Cap badge

 

[ProPatria031]

So what about CSOR then, does it say anywhere that they can or can not have colors, if they can what battle honors will they put on there??? or will they just do like the CAR and put on some of the FSSF battle honors???

 

[Blackadder1916]

Last I checked, only the Engineers and the Artillery carry their Battle Honour "UBIQUE" on their Cap badge

It's not the Battle Honour "UBIQUE" but honours are on other cap badges.

Royal Winnipeg Rifles
http://army.ca/inf/rwr.php

Armorial Description
A maltese Cross with a tablet above surmounted by the Crown; on the centre of the Cross a medallion edged by an annulus inscribed ROYAL WINNIPEG RIFLES; on the medallion a naked black devil running on a scroll bearing the regimental motto HOSTI ACIE NOMINATI; in the devil's right hand a trident and offering a chalice with his left; encircling the Cross a wreath of maple leaves within a spiral riband scroll inscribed with the battle honours which are placed in pairs one over the other on each visible turning of the scroll; the battle honours are as follows: on the tablet below the Crown, FISH CREEK and BATOCHE; on the dexter side of the wreath from the top downward, YPRES, 1915,'17 and MOUNT SORREL; VIMY 1917 and PASSCHENDAELE; DROCOURT-QUEANT and NORMANDY LANDING; CARPIQUET and CALAIS, 1944; LEOPOLD CANAL and THE RHINE; on the sinister side FESTUBERT, 1915 and SOMME, 1916; HILL 70 and AMIENS; CANAL DU NORD and PUTOT-EN-BESSIN; FALAISE and THE SCHELDT; MOYLAND WOOD and N.W. EUROPE, 1944-45; on the portion of the battle honour scroll on the base of the wreath NORTH-WEST CANADA, 1885 and SOUTH AFRICA, 1899-1900.

Royal Regina Rifles
http://army.ca/inf/rrr.php

Armorial Description
A maltese Cross surmounted by a bar bearing the word CANADA with the Crown above; superimposed upon the cross an annulus inscribed THE REGINA RIFLE REGIMENT. On a shield within the annulus, the arms of the City of Regina (on the upper half a buffalo, on the lower half a sheaf of wheat); the arms of the cross inscribed with battle honours of the regiment selected to be borne on the badge.

 

[geo]

Well, given that the CDS has issued some Canforgens that grant the lineage of the 1st SSF to the CSOR, I would venture to guess that there are colours not too far off in the future of the CSOR.