The Great Gun Control Debate

[cryco]

Is it true to get your pal or rpal in other provinces they make you handle a weapon and actually discharge it? is there such logic outside of Quebec?
I got the RPAL and could have technically never fired any form of weapon in my life.
And at the range, they make us take the Anastasia law course, i believe Bill-9 officially,  which just tells you what common sense should have told us before bill-9 came out. Funny thing is if you let your membership expire, upon re-enrolling, you have to take the Bill-9 course again (40 or 50 bucks or some such).
Gun control is education. Bad people will find guns regardless of a 2 billion dollar list of people.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Is it true to get your pal or rpal in other provinces they make you handle a weapon and actually discharge it? is there such logic outside of Quebec?
I got the RPAL and could have technically never fired any form of weapon in my life.
And at the range, they make us take the Anastasia law course, i believe Bill-9 officially,  which just tells you what common sense should have told us before bill-9 came out. Funny thing is if you let your membership expire, upon re-enrolling, you have to take the Bill-9 course again (40 or 50 bucks or some such).
Gun control is education. Bad people will find guns regardless of a 2 billion dollar list of people.

Your PAL course is an indoor classroom course. There is no requirement to discharge a firearm as a condition to get your PAL. Your PAL & RPAL is a Federally issued license. Only needs to be renewed if it's going to expire, not if you go to another province. It is valid wherever you go in Canada.

Many clubs require you to do a range course before going on the range alone. There are variations as to what they are called, but they're pretty well all the same.

 

[cryco]

ok so my permit would be valid anywhere in Canada? that's good to know.
My question was about the actual course. We never once fired a weapon when doing the course to get the PAL or RPAL. I believe I remember my instructor saying that in other provinces, firing a gun at a range is part of the course. Sure, we assumed all firearms were loaded (as you do for the rest of your life) and had to point them 'downrange' (a back wall of the room), but it's certainly not like actually loading a round in the chamber and firing it.
I find it odd that not once during the course where we required to do so. It's like showing someone a car, letting them touch the steering wheel and gas/brake pedals, reading up all the theory about signals and such and only testing them on paper and issuing a driver's permit based on that.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

The only course that would require you to actually fire a gun would be a club specific safety course. There is no requirement to do so for a PAL.

 

[The_Falcon]

The new firearms licensing ammendments have been tabled.

Here is a video of the Minister's press announcement
http://www.cbc.ca/player/Shows/ID/2545914821/

And the tabled Act
http://www.parl.gc.ca/HousePublications/Publication.aspx?Language=E&Mode=1&DocId=6719328&File=4

 

[Colin Parkinson]

all good until the Liberals get in and use the new tools to screw us over.

 

[MilEME09]

all good until the Liberals get in and use the new tools to screw us over.

yep and they will make it as hard as possible to get a firearm

 

[BernDawg]

yep and they will make it as hard as possible to get a firearm

And that is why I will NEVER vote Lieberal again my friends. the very sight of Alan Rock sickens me.....

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Memo from the RCMP on SKS going into full fun mode

http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/rep-rap/inspection-eng.htm

 

[Kat Stevens]

Memo from the RCMP on SKS going into full fun mode

http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/rep-rap/inspection-eng.htm

Oh FFS, here we go...

 

[Retired AF Guy]

I had a little discussion today with a co-worker about possessing hard point (aka FMJ, ball) rifle and hollow point handgun rounds. His argument was that you are not allowed to possess them and he had been, so informed, when taking his firearms license test. I might add he is hunter and owns both longarms and handguns.

My understanding regarding hard point rounds, is that there are no restrictions, except in the case of some provinces where they are illegal for big game hunting. Plus, the fact that I checked out a couple of firearms sites and they both had hard point rounds for sale. And I might add that years ago (early '80s) when I lived out in Calgary it was no problem buying hard point/ball ammo.

The ownership of hollow point rounds seems to be a little murkier. This article from 1991, in one of its links (230) states that while hollow point ammo is illegal in Canada, the ownership of the bullets is not, and you can reload ammo with hollow points legally.

This NFA article about importation of hollow points rounds says something different.

Finally, checking out some gun dealer sites show various types of hollow point handgun rounds for sale from different manufactures with no restrictions.

Unfortunately its been years since I've done any shooting, so, my question is; are there restrictions on ownership of hard point/hollow points rounds or not?

Any help is much appreciated.

 

[Cloud Cover]

My understanding is that hollow point ammunition was no longer restricted at the import level into Canada: see Memorandum D19-6-1 of the Administration of the Explosives Act.

Ok< now turning to possession of Hollow Point Ammunition:
the following is Prohibited Ammunition:

PART 5

Regulations Prescribing Certain Firearms and other Weapons, Components and Parts of Weapons, Accessories, Cartridge Magazines, Ammunition and Projectiles as Prohibited or Restricted

SOR/98-462
PROHIBITED AMMUNITION-

Former Prohibited Weapons Order, No. 10

1. Any cartridge that is capable of being discharged from a commonly available semi-automatic handgun or revolver and that is manufactured or assembled with a projectile that is designed, manufactured or altered so as to be capable of penetrating body armour, including KTW, THV and 5.7 x 28 mm P-90 cartridges.

2. Any projectile that is designed, manufactured or altered to ignite on impact, where the projectile is designed for use in or in conjunction with a cartridge and does not exceed 15 mm in diameter.

3. Any projectile that is designed, manufactured or altered so as to explode on impact, where the projectile is designed for use in or in conjunction with a cartridge and does not exceed 15 mm in diameter.

4. Any cartridge that is capable of being discharged from a shotgun and that contains projectiles known as “fléchettes” or any similar projectiles


Does a Hollow Point bullet meet the definition of "Explode on Impact"? My thought here is "no" because there is not any "explosive substance" in the hollow point itself which seems to be a requirement of an "explosive substance" under the regulations of the Explosives Act. My thinking here is that the "bullet" is differentiated from the chemical or mechanical reaction used to eject the projectile although it could be argued that the disintegration of the hollow point on target is in fact a mechanical reaction. That being said, more clarity should be sought directly from the RCMP, and if they say "yes" please ask them to point to a specific document like a regulation, circular, something like that...

 

 

[stealthylizard]

As far as rifle rounds go, no, hollow point is not illegal.  I will leave the handgun answer to someone else.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

There was a time when importing was illegal but not now, perfectly legal to buy, possess and reload with. As for AP ammo, pretty much any 7.62x25, x39 qualifies as that stuff will punch through impressive amount of steel, even if not intended to be.

 

[KevinB]

It was never illegal - it was being denied import.

Problem with the Canadian (and any) Firearms Act is that idiots make them...

 

[Jarnhamar]

If your a firearm owner and you want to go see Liam Neeson's new movie Taken 3 maybe you should think twice.

It looks like he's went and joined the eliete group of hollywood action stars who make their living making movies with firearms but support strict gun control and shit talk firearm owners.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2909555/America-f-guns-Taken-star-Liam-Neeson-launches-expletive-laden-tirade-Charlie-Hebdo-attack.html

    *The 62-year-old is famous for playing gun-totting father Bryan Mills in Taken franchise
    *He defended his on-screen role, saying movies were just 'fantasy'
    *Neeson spoke out after being asked about the Paris terrorist attacks
    *He said his 'thoughts and payers and heart' were with the Paris victims
    *Was reportedly paid more than $20 million for Taken 3 - elevating him to the same pay-bracket as Leonardo DiCaprio and Angelina Jolie
    *Taken 3 shot to number one at the box office over the weekend with a gross of $39.1 million
    *The ultra violent revenge franchise as raked in $630 million at global box office



It has become one of Hollywood's surprising second acts - how 62-year-old Liam Neeson became one of Tinseltown's most bankable action heroes playing a cold blooded killer with a particular set of skills.

But now the Irish-born actor and star of the ultra-violent Taken trilogy has thought it wise to wade into America's fraught gun debate.

Speaking at a press conference in Dubai for the launch of Taken 3 on Tuesday, Neeson offered an interviewer his opinion of his adopted home's attitude to firearms.

'There's just too many [expletive] guns out there,' said Neeson, who is reputed to have been paid $20 million for the new latest Taken installment.

'Especially in America. I think the population is like, 320 million? There's over 300 million guns. Privately owned, in America.

'I think it's a [expletive] disgrace. Every week now we're picking up a newspaper and seeing, 'Yet another few kids have been killed in schools.'

This guy makes 20 million portraying a man going around murdering people then lambasts private gun ownership. 

 

[Jarnhamar]

Great response from the firearm company that provided guns to the movie taken 3

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2015/01/16/company-that-provided-guns-for-taken-3-does-more-than-talk-after-reading-liam-neesons-fiery-anti-gun-rant/

 

[shootemup604]

Good for them!  Another hypocrite who thinks that since his face is everywhere, he's somehow an expert.

 

[Retired AF Guy]

Good for them!  Another hypocrite who thinks that since his face is everywhere, he's somehow an expert.

And what's with all the profanity?? I expect that from some rap singer, but for someone of Neeson's stature I think is unbecoming.

 

[Kat Stevens]

And what's with all the profanity?? I expect that from some rap singer, but for someone of Neeson's stature I think is unbecoming.

No, it's cool to cuss like a trooper in Hollywood these days, makes 'em seem just like us mere mortals.