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Soldiers serving outside the wire are asking for more money

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Yrys

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... and if somebody access the database to know how many people in/out ?
 

Spring_bok

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MCG said:
There was far less going in & out the front gate in Julien than KAF.
Are you for real?  People left Julien alot more than KAF.  The only difference was they were going to the airport for a massage and some shopping then back a couple of hours later.  When people leave the KAF however they are usually gone for weeks if not months.  BTW, tracking was taken care of at the Troop /Platoon level, not by the guys at the main gate.
 

Good2Golf

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Yrys said:
... and if somebody access the database to know how many people in/out ?

You mean the database that is already sitting on the LAN at KAF in the Headquarters?  I know the point you're trying to make, but there are other issues than tallying in/outs if someone has compromised the HQ DB.
 

McG

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MedTech said:
Someone just has to do it.
You're right.  Let's just cut a rifle section out of the TO&E so there is the someone to do this. 

It is a bit of a stretch equating TFA to a plant in Canada with a single front entrance, a predictable shift rotation, & uniform access to a shared high-speed computer network.    Will each FOB be the same rate?  Will Leager have a higher rate than a FOB?  How does KAF compare to CNS?  What rate do you give a patrol that spent the night in a leaguer but most of the day in a FOB?  What about a patrol with different start & end points; do we make pay part of a patrol commander's concerns?

Spring_bok said:
Are you for real?  People left Julien alot more than KAF.  The only difference was they were going to the airport for a massage and some shopping then back a couple of hours later.  When people leave the KAF however they are usually gone for weeks if not months. 
This movement from Julien is clearly not relevant to a discussion on pay rates for time outside the wire.
 

medaid

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MCG said:
You're right.  Let's just cut a rifle section out of the TO&E so there is the someone to do this. 

I am merely saying that I agree with the fact that some jobs are more dangerous, and as such deserves higher compensation. Now I have no clue about how to implement this. Someone with a bigger hat and more stripes then I do probably has a better idea.

 

X-mo-1979

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MCG said:
You're right.  Let's just cut a rifle section out of the TO&E so there is the someone to do this. 

Why would you need a rifle section?
 

COBRA-6

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X-mo-1979 said:
Why would you need a rifle section?

Because if you add x number of clerks to the task force to calculate outside the wire pay you need to delete x number of positions from elsewhere in the task force, like gunners, infanteers, truckers, etc... it's zero sum game, to add one new posn you have to cut one old posn

I agree with the notion of outside the wire but the implementation would be an admin nightmare that would create more grief than it relieves!
 

X-mo-1979

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COBRA-6 said:
Because if you add x number of clerks to the task force to calculate outside the wire pay you need to delete x number of positions from elsewhere in the task force, like gunners, infanteers, truckers, etc... it's zero sum game, to add one new posn you have to cut one old posn

I agree with the notion of outside the wire but the implementation would be an admin nightmare that would create more grief than it relieves!

Interesting.Where I work we call it secondary duties or multi tasking.

Send someone down to Timmys to get all the orders at once,that should make up the time.
 

Good2Golf

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Tango2Bravo said:
Shall we 'swipe out' from tour benefits when we go on HLTA?

T2B, one could program an reversion to HA4 (or whatever the min HA becomes for the garrison) while you're away on HLTA.  That could be accomplished by using a portable reader at the AMU, "swiping" you just before boarding the Herc/17 -- the cheerful Aircraft Security Officer to swipe your card while you prove your weapon to him/her.  ;)

G2G
 

Michael OLeary

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Tango2Bravo said:
Shall we 'swipe out' from tour benefits when we go on HLTA?

Subcutaneous RFID tracking tags, GPS tracked 24/7, individual plots against a daily/hourly changing threat map with incentive bonuses for those within established perimeters around critical events.  Try disputing that data model after the tour.  For every low tech problem there is at least one inordinately expensive solution relying on untested layers of technology.
 

TCBF

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Spring_bok said:
... The only difference was they were going to the airport for a massage and some shopping then back a couple of hours later.  ...

- A massage parlour at Kabul airport - who knew?
 

Good2Golf

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Michael O`Leary said:
....For every low tech problem there is at least one inordinately expensive solution relying on untested layers of technology.

Don't forget frustratingly complex, as well!  ;)
 

TangoTwoBravo

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I put that out there merely to see how far down the road we have wargamed to conclusion the impact of having exact tracking of where a person is on tour.  Be careful of what you wish for, because you just might get it.
 

McG

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Good2Golf said:
T2B, one could program an reversion to HA4 (or whatever the min HA becomes for the garrison) while you're away on HLTA. 
That would be the Theatre Support Base.  Good bye tax free status, hello:
Tango2Bravo said:
Be careful of what you wish for, because you just might get it.
 

Good2Golf

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Part of the issue is people comparing themselves to others.  To put "theoretical blinders" on, and not worry about what other people are getting, people should consider if what they are receiving for allowances seems genuinely acceptable to them.  If people are honest with themselves, I would think that a lot of folks are actually content with the allowance package they individually receive.

G2G
 

Kilroy

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When I served on TF1-06, I too said the people who lived outside the wire should get some kind of extra pay. And i was an inside the wire guy! I went on four road moves as a "right seater". If it is any consolation to those that served outside the wire, I thanked them every chance I got (usually when they came to pick up their LAV after I repaired soemthing in the turret) and thier reply was always "no problem".

One other point on all this. There are also those that serve outside the wire, but never leave the FOB. Would those not be safer than people in a convoy? Are not most of the deaths caused by IED's or stupidcide bombers attacking our convoys? How would you factor in this?

Don't get me wrong, I agree 100% that those serving outside the wire going after those )*^&$*&^% Taliban pr**** deserve alot more than I ever got just repairing equipment. But I am but a humble EO tech, and i cannot presume to figure out how they would calculate this.
 

armyvern

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Michael O`Leary said:
Subcutaneous RFID tracking tags, GPS tracked 24/7, individual plots against a daily/hourly changing threat map with incentive bonuses for those within established perimeters around critical events.  Try disputing that data model after the tour.  For every low tech problem there is at least one inordinately expensive solution relying on untested layers of technology.

Sounds like the system they used to track "our vehicles" movements ... man, the UN gave me a speeding ticket (issued in Syria) for speeding in Eilat, Israel for crying out loud. Couldn't even start the darn vehicles without swiping our drivers license through the reader mounted on the steering column ... damn technology.  :mad:  I can only imagine a person-mounted system ... and the placement of the swiper.

Talk about feeling like Orwell was onto something.
 

Sig_Des

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Kilroy said:
Might be true, but the data is transmitted anyway, so regardless of the memoryin the unit, they know what happens, as it happens.

Not if you know what to disconnect. But of course, SDS never sped  ;)
 
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