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Just a real quick question i have about the ROTP Program, I know they pay for all your expenses such as food and others, but they mention that it is deducted from your total sallary.
ROTP after High School Questions
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ballz
Army.ca Veteran
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They do NOT pay for all your expenses such as food and other costs of living.
They pay your tuition, your books, pens/stationary stuff, some lab equipment if needed, a dictionary, a calculator.
They don't pay your rent, your food, your phone bill, blah blah blah.
They pay you a salary of approximentally 1400-1500 per month. There is nothing deducted from that besides the usual taxes, pension, life insurance, etc.
They pay your tuition, your books, pens/stationary stuff, some lab equipment if needed, a dictionary, a calculator.
They don't pay your rent, your food, your phone bill, blah blah blah.
They pay you a salary of approximentally 1400-1500 per month. There is nothing deducted from that besides the usual taxes, pension, life insurance, etc.
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ballz said:
Oh, and how long are you required to stay at RMC / day then?
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Hmmm, you LIVE at RMC.
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This idea has been floated around before but what do you guys (currently in ROTP) think of incorporating mandatory service at the nearest reserve unit on a training night at least once a week during the school year for ROTP cadets as part of their ROTP SERVICE? This is where ROTP cadets would be attached posted to their nearest possible reserve unit. Reservists, the majority of which are in university, do this regularly so I do not see how someone in the REGULAR Force would not be able to juggle both the duties of school and military training during the year. This also benefits the cadet as it provides them with training to better prepare them for classification training in the future and leadership training early on.
It baffles me that someone being paid by the crown to go to school in the reg force could potentially go through an entire academic year without doing one thing military or even be in uniform. A question for the more experienced members of the forum....Why has this not been done in the past? How can this be implemented?
It baffles me that someone being paid by the crown to go to school in the reg force could potentially go through an entire academic year without doing one thing military or even be in uniform. A question for the more experienced members of the forum....Why has this not been done in the past? How can this be implemented?
Snakedoc said:
Schools with no local reserve unit? There's a start, do we require some ROTP types to parade and some not to?
Also, what about say the air and navy types in areas with only Militia units? What are they supposed to do, not only do they not have the proper field kit (after BOTP) but they also lack any 'army' skills to make themselves useful to the reserve unit. On that note, say (like in Guelph) we have one small local Militia unit and 12 or so OCdt's, from two different environments. What is the reserve unit supposed to do with 12 young, untrained OCdt's? Keep in mind these units are limited in things like ammo, space and other training aids and getting a group of young, untrained officers who aren't really part of their estabishment, can't be sent on courses and aren't always available is a waste of resources. They aren't going to stick a bunch of us in the sections (aren't trained as such, even with CAP etc) and can't put us in leadership positions (again, not trained).
Essentially, requiring reserve units to take on a bunch of untrained officers that they don't get to 'keep' and can't find positions for is placing an unecessary burden on them. Again, what if you get a bunch of OCdt's at a school and the only local reserve unit is an HMCS Something? What on earth will they do with the army and air force types?
Good idea, but can't be implemented. People who want to do something like this are allowed to, but you can't make it mandatory. Now, a better idea (IMHO) is encouraging the more senior ROTP types (post BOTP) to assist at local cadet units, where their basic skills can actually be put to use and leadership skills (teaching classes especially) can be put to use.
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Intelligent Design said:Don't be so bitter Lumber! The pay is pretty good for doing nothing but going to school!
Woa know, I (we) do a lot more than just go to school. For example, if I have a tuesday morning briefing and my Intramural water polo game doesn't start until 2200hrs, then my day begins at around 0630 and ends at 2300. Thats a long day and I'm only in school for a part of it.
Cheers mate.
(p.s. I know civi-U types can be very busy as well....)
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Woah, sorry, I didn't mean any offense. My days are pretty long since I commute for about 3 hours of my day. We have plenty to keep us busy, and no mandatory fitness, which means we have to motivate ourselves to do it ourselves. Trust me when I say it's easy to let certain aspects slide when term paper season opens.
The " " was meant to signify the fact that I was kidding... But what would the system be if the ROTP people didn't accuse us Civvy U folks of being slackers?
The "
" was meant to signify the fact that I was kidding... But what would the system be if the ROTP people didn't accuse us Civvy U folks of being slackers? I agree with Piper. Honestly, one big reason as to why I went the ROTP route was to "escape" from the Reserve trg each week to be able to focus on school more. Last year, for the majority, I was unable to work as a reservist because my program was intense. This year, I do not have the time or the availability in my school schedule to spend time with the reserve unit, just to give an example of a regular force member who cannot juggle work and school. Our job is to go to school.
I do believe it is a good idea to keep in the loop, there are other ways of doing so. Those who want to, and are able to, can volunteer at a Reserve unit with permission. Reserve units are generally structured to be self-sufficient, with the expection of Reg F support staff; most people I know who volunteer their time at the units don't get to do much teaching, or much of anything for that matter. Again, it's situation and trade dependant.
I do believe it is a good idea to keep in the loop, there are other ways of doing so. Those who want to, and are able to, can volunteer at a Reserve unit with permission. Reserve units are generally structured to be self-sufficient, with the expection of Reg F support staff; most people I know who volunteer their time at the units don't get to do much teaching, or much of anything for that matter. Again, it's situation and trade dependant.
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Piper said:
If parading at a reserve unit became an integral part of the ROTP system, it would make sense that only universities within a reasonable distance from a reserve unit would be eligible for new ROTP candidates. Most major universities should have a reserve unit in their vicinity anyways because they are located in major cities.
Piper said:
There are two options for cadets of different environments without a matching environmental reserve unit. Either they can, from the outset, be only allowed to choose a university with the proper environmental reserve unit in its vicinity; or they can be attached posted to a unit of a different environment. Having 12 or so OCdt's in a small militia unit is fine, as long as there are more NCM's then there are officers. If anything this gives the cadets a chance to put on their uniform and help out any way they can at the unit (even if it means supporting the wardroom/officer's mess lol). Learning to be an officer is more than learning how to operate in one’s environment, and much of this ‘officership’ can be taught at the unit level with commissioned officers as mentors. This is where subordinate officers can be assigned a divisional or platoon officer to shadow and learn the ropes involved in their jobs (much of the bread and butter work of an officer) such as: writing PER’s and PDR’s, learning the military administration system to help the people under your command, shadowing officers on exercises to learn basic leadership techniques, learning how to deal with NCM’s and the complex officer NCM relationship that exists, learning where to look for information and even who to ask, and even learning things like mess etiquette and military culture (etc. etc.). Getting these basics down early can help cadets become more comfortable in the military system and allow them to be better able to hit the ground running when they are given responsibility, letting officers focus more on big picture leading rather than the nitty gritty details.
Piper said:
In addition, reserve units will often have a training program set up for all those members that are not yet basic qualified to get them prepared for their basic training. Having a bunch of untrained NCdt’s and OCdt’s is no different than all the other subordinate officers a reserve unit normally has to deal with in the first place. They can be attached posted to the unit and essentially become part of the unit. As their training progresses they can be allowed to participate further (such as in sections) and often can be given leadership positions (I’ve even heard of NCdt’s being operations officers at a reserve NRD due to the lack of officers available). This would be no different from OJT that ROTP cadets sometimes do but just on a part time basis.
Shamrock said:
What’s in it for the reserve units? Well if this was made an integral part of the ROTP system for civie U cadets, it could just become part of a reserve units regular mandate. ROTP cadets can be treated just like any other member of the unit with the reg force ROTP system providing compensation for training costs. Essentially they become extra members at no cost for salary to the unit. Something may also need to be developed to incent reserve units to take on extra ROTP members (these are all just ideas up for debate). Also some sort of standardized training program may need to be developed from the people that run the ROTP program or they can be just integrated into the training of other reserve officers. Often the issue at reserve units is more the fact that there arn't enough officers..rather than too much.
Piper said:
There’s no reason why a reg force member in ROTP can’t commit to training at a reserve unit at least once a week or even the bare minimum in the reserve world of once every three weeks because reservists do this all the time! Not to mention people at RMC are essentially doing this every day. I just think that the Crown needs to be getting more bang for their buck if they are going to be paying for a cadets education. If reservists are both going to university and training at a unit..but the reg force can’t or isn’t willing to, what does that say about the training of ROTP members? They should be setting the standard or be above the standard of the reserves because its their full time job! A ROTP cadet’s job should not only be to go to school but to participate in military training/activities during the year as well. IMO, since they’re not going to a military college the least they can do to maintain some semblance of being in the military during the year is parade with a reserve unit. I would argue that teaching at a local cadet unit should be something ROTP cadets volunteer in doing, however parading at a unit should be mandatory as its specifically designed to fit in with work/school and is actually in the CF system.
