Re: New Operational Service Medal Announced

[Pusser]

I was told City Hall prefers to keep such things at the Metro level of government, rather than involve Ottawa. Why? "Because they don't sign your paycheck. We do."

That is ABSOLUTELY appalling!  These are NATIONAL honours that come from a grateful nation.  It shouldn't matter who signs the paycheck.  This is just proof positive that Toronto really does think it is the centre of the universe.  Stuck up, conceited @#$%&*!

 

[Pusser]

Maybe CEFCOM wouldn't be so far behind if every CO and RSM of every subunit wasn't put up for an award. Granted, some of these individuals were exemplary and deserve to be recognized, but it cheapens the whole system when everyone gets it. That's a whole other ball of wax though.

I don't think that's a fair statement.  Just look at the recent announcements - not a single CO and a only a few RSMs - many corporals.

On another note, the citation is not used to determine the award.  The committee has access to a detailed file, complete with witness statements.

 

[392]

On another note, the citation is not used to determine the award.  The committee has access to a detailed file, complete with witness statements.

For valour awards, yes. For Meritorious Svc awards, not so much. 2448 and narrative is all that is pushed up for MS awards and commendations.

 

[Old Sweat]

I don't think that's a fair statement.  Just look at the recent announcements - not a single CO and a only a few RSMs - many corporals.

On another note, the citation is not used to determine the award.  The committee has access to a detailed file, complete with witness statements.

You are correct there, but this group of awards comes after lists for the same tours that have awarded a lot of MSCs and MSMs for people in that specific category. Now, it has been the practice going back to the Boer War to give the CO an award if he managed to get through the tour without fouling the regimental linen too badly. That certainly was the case in Korea where the majority of COs received a Distinguished Service Order. Many of us have felt there were too many proforma decorations in this campaign that seemed to be in the categories of "it will help at the merit boards" and "what's his cap badge?"

 

[dogger1936]

I spent 9 months watching this very sort of thing happen - with no repercussions - which is why I wrote that TF 3-08 was an epic fail on other fronts....

 

[PuckChaser]

I don't think that's a fair statement.  Just look at the recent announcements - not a single CO and a only a few RSMs - many corporals.

On another note, the citation is not used to determine the award.  The committee has access to a detailed file, complete with witness statements.

For this particular announcement, yes. Look back over the last few years for CDS, MSM, MSC awards, and you'll find every LCol and above, every RSM that rotated through theatre. Whether they were in a command position or not. Heck, a CO of mine got an award and he almost got myself and my crew killed for something we could have had fixed.

 

[mariomike]

Toronto never, in 38 years, forwarded any nominations for Paramedic bravery medals to Ottawa. I had that explained to me this A.M. on the phone when I called to ask why I did not know anyone on the federal list.
I was told City Hall prefers to keep such things at the Metro level of government, rather than involve Ottawa. Why? "Because they don't sign your paycheck. We do."

That is ABSOLUTELY appalling!  These are NATIONAL honours that come from a grateful nation.  It shouldn't matter who signs the paycheck. 

Regarding the ( 20 year ) Exemplary Service Medal ESM. You could grow old waiting for it:
http://www.gg.ca/honour.aspx?id=85171&t=5

Many municipal Fire and EMS departments across North America issue their own medals and awards:
"Honoring the Courage, Commitment and Compassion of FDNY Fire & EMS Members":
http://www.nyc.gov/html/fdny/html/medal_day/2010/pdf/FDNY%20Medal%20Day%20Book%202010.pdf

T-EMS has been doing likewise ( on a smaller scale ) for many years.

This is just proof positive that Toronto really does think it is the centre of the universe.  Stuck up, conceited @#$%&*!

Whatever differences may exist between the politicians at City Hall and Ottawa, there is no question that Toronto Paramedics support our troops.

T-EMS has a 20-year-long partnership with the Canadian Forces. The two organizations have worked together not only to train paramedics and medical technicians, but also to respond jointly to civil emergencies in the city of Toronto and other regions of Canada.

There is "Operation Booster Shot": "Thank-you" packages to Afganistan with items like magazines, licorice, gum, hard candy, powdered drinks and Gator-aid.

In 2008, T-EMS sent 4,000 $10.00 Tim Horton gift cards and thank-you notes to the troops stationed in Afghanistan. I believe they managed to triple that number in 2009.

For years, all Toronto ambulances have displayed ( large ) permanent 'Support Our Troops' decals:
http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/7651/0620troops2.jpg

A full-size 'Support our Troops' flag flies at T-EMS HQ on Dufferin St. It must be seen by thousands of motorists every day.

T-EMS sends an Honour Guard to the Coroner's Office for every repatriation.

Special Toronto street signs - "Route of Heroes" - have been erected along the Don Valley Parkway from the 401,  all the way to the Coroner's Office.

If Councillor Ford is elected Mayor:
"Maverick Councillor Rob Ford wants all new streets in Toronto automatically named for Canadian soldiers killed in Afghanistan, even if the war dead are not from the city.":
http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/toronto/archive/2008/02/27/name-new-streets-after-war-dead-councillor-urges.aspx


 

 

[Pusser]

I don't doubt the support that Toronto paramedics, police and firefighters support the troops.  In fact, I've seen it first hand.  What I find appalling is the lack of support the city bureaucracy has for its paramedics, police and firefighters.  The city thinks it's OK to eschew national honours in favour of its own?  That's sort of like a high school not allowing its students to win scholarships from universities because they give our their certificates of achievement.

 

[Pusser]

For valour awards, yes. For Meritorious Svc awards, not so much. 2448 and narrative is all that is pushed up for MS awards and commendations.

Somebody's feeding you a line.  Everything goes forward for all decorations - at least for the nominations that are successful.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

I don't doubt the support that Toronto paramedics, police and firefighters support the troops.  In fact, I've seen it first hand.  What I find appalling is the lack of support the city bureaucracy has for its paramedics, police and firefighters.  The city thinks it's OK to eschew national honours in favour of its own?  That's sort of like a high school not allowing its students to win scholarships from universities because they give our their certificates of achievement.

C'mon man. Don't you know we're talking about Toronto? The Big Smoke, Hogtown, Cabbagetown, The Big Stink, The Entry Point for Canada's Enema, THE CENTRE OF THE UNIVERSE?

The Great Oz, His Blondness, The All Encompassing, All Knowing Pretender to the Throne of Canada, within the borders of 905 and the Green Belt. I give you the Mayor of Toronto, David Miller. The Great Ponz in a Pulpit can't see past his own delusional self importance to give any sort of recognition to anyone within his sphere of influence unless he has personally anointed the decree and made it all about him and his backwoods, inbred administration of the most self-aggrandizing lemmings that were ever elected by a more dispassionate populous than the country has ever seen.

What's the suprise?

You knew all this inherently, like any other reasonably civilised person from the rest of Canada. You just didn't want to voice your opinion out loud, because, being Canadian, and not from Ontario's largest cesspool, you didn't want to offend anyone




Oh. That just my $00.02 and opinion. Your mileage may vary.

 

[392]

Somebody's feeding you a line.  Everything goes forward for all decorations - at least for the nominations that are successful.

Like, I said earlier - I found out a few things WRT the H&A process. A fair bit of research was required on my part due to not only the job I held in the latter part of the tour, but also because I was part of the nomination process for a few of our members. Obviously, I'm not going to cut and paste the entire chapter from the pub, but here are the supporting quotes from A-AD-200-000/AG-000 Honours, Flags and Heritage Structure of the CF that more or less repeat what I posted earlier:

For valour awards, yes. For Meritorious Svc awards, not so much. 2448 and narrative is all that is pushed up for MS awards and commendations.

I did notice that a pers info sheet was to be forwarded as well, but that was not done at our level, which is why I did not mention it. It should be noted, that the citation listed in the para ref the MSD / CDS Commendations is part of the DND 2448, and that sheet, along with a written narrative is forwarded for all decoration recommendations.

Specifics for Military Valour Awards:

6. Recommendations shall be supported by statements gathered from a minimum of two witnesses. If practicable, sworn statements should accompany each recommendation. These statements may be sworn before any commissioned officer on full-time service. In exceptional circumstances where there are fewer than two witnesses, a statement from one person may be acceptable. It should be accompanied by an explanation of the exceptional circumstances.

Common to all, and standard for Meritorious Svc Decorations and Commendations:

9. Military valour and bravery recommendations must meet certain critical time constraints and require sworn statements as described in Annexes E and F.

12. A narrative in support of a recommendation must contain an account of what the individual did to merit the award, including such matters as a full description of any events that gave rise to the recommendation, the names of all participants, the location, and the time frame. It shall not exceed two typewritten pages, excluding annexes and attachments, and shall be attached to the  recommendation form shown in Annex B. (A narrative for the Order of Military Merit shall be a single page without annexes or attachments. See Annex D, Appendix 2.)

13. A proposed citation for an award must be included in the recommendation form in Annex B and must summarize the case fully, factually and concisely. Grandiose superlatives should be avoided. Simple statements, which make it clear to an outside observer, now and in the future, why the actions of the individual stand out from those of the individual's peers in rank and experience, or were beyond those expected, are best. Say, simply, who did what, when and where, in a form which demonstrates why or how the activity was beyond the expected norm. For the Order of Military Merit, note the individual’s branch, years of service and the career highlights which reveal why an appointment in this fellowship of honour is merited.

Specifics for MID:

5. No detailed citation is required if the recommendation is for valour in conditions where all serve bravely and well, but a few are singled out for special mention. The appropriate commander may simply cite "for valour in battle" and then mention the names of those who so distinguished themselves. Short, amplifying remarks may be added if warranted.

And again, if you go back and re-read one of my previous posts, I already noted that the recommendations are vetted at each level - so, yes, if they keep being approved and sent higher, all the paperwork keeps-a-movin'. CEFCOM is even nice enough to send one of their guys to theatre when the TFA board sits to help make sure the recommendations and narratives are done properly so they don't get held up due to simple staffing errors 

EDIT: I should add that in no way do I profess to be the be all, end all when it comes to H&A - I'm far from it, but the TFA H&A policy mirrors the CF policy, so this is where I base my experience from. Other Commands / Formations may do business differently.

 

[Infanteer]

On another note, the PAM you are quoting is out of date - DHH has released it under a different title and taken out all instructions on H&A.  DHR is, as I understand it, still working on a replacement.

 

[mariomike]

What I find appalling is the lack of support the city bureaucracy has for its paramedics, police and firefighters.  The city thinks it's OK to eschew national honours in favour of its own? 

That would seem the obvious conclusion. The award goes back decades: "The Award of Valour is presented to Toronto EMS personnel in recognition of performance above and beyond the call of duty, as evidenced by an act of bravery."
Although I never received one, I never heard any recipients complain they felt short-changed.

 

[392]

On another note, the PAM you are quoting is out of date - DHH has released it under a different title and taken out all instructions on H&A.  DHR is, as I understand it, still working on a replacement.

I found that out today while searching the DIN for something else. The pub still has the same number and title, the most recent change has the H&A for individuals removed. I know there is an interim guide for the nomination of individual awards floating around the DIN, but I'll be darned if I can find it now  ??? It more or less lays out a similar nomination process and paperwork requirements as the above pub did, just in a shinier, more colourful way 

You'd think that with the current push to keep CF members being nominated for deserved decorations, they'd have made sure it was readily available prior to removing the associated paras from the other pub....

 

[dogger1936]

medals are arriving from 2007 still. Found one of my buddies getting one for something from 2007!

One problem that is broken is when someone submits paperwork on the member; if it is denied the person submitting the info never knows if it was approved or not. I believe this should be changed to allow the person submitting the paperwork the ability to tell if it has been lost, thrown out, denied or just taking years to get aproved.

I called up my old boss and outright asked him what happened to it (part of my healing...tieing up loose ends) and the above is what  Iwas told...he had no idea if it ad been approved or not.

I think that should change.

 

[Infanteer]

I found that out today while searching the DIN for something else. The pub still has the same number and title, the most recent change has the H&A for individuals removed. I know there is an interim guide for the nomination of individual awards floating around the DIN, but I'll be darned if I can find it now  ??? It more or less lays out a similar nomination process and paperwork requirements as the above pub did, just in a shinier, more colourful way 

You'd think that with the current push to keep CF members being nominated for deserved decorations, they'd have made sure it was readily available prior to removing the associated paras from the other pub....

The pub's title was changed.  I think this reflected the fact that DHH was issuing direction on DHR matters?

Regardless, you are correct in that - for whatever reason - there is currently no national level direction on H&A as the CFAOs were also recinded and not replaced by a DAOD.

 

[dapaterson]

The pub's title was changed.  I think this reflected the fact that DHH was issuing direction on DHR matters?

Regardless, you are correct in that - for whatever reason - there is currently no national level direction on H&A as the CFAOs were also recinded and not replaced by a DAOD.

DHH used to include DHR.  In one of the many NDHQ re-orgs (to be fair, it's not that there are many, it's that it's an ongoing process with no end state in sight) DHH and DHR were split, thus ensuring "leading change" points on someone's PERs.  No doubt some enterprising staff officer saved the old org chart and, a few years hence, will pull it out as evidence of their keen organizational acumen, get them combined again, and claim still more "leading change" points on their PER.

It is the circle of life (NDHQ edition).

 

[mariomike]

Re: Reply #32:
http://forums.milnet.ca/forums/threads/96846/post-976884.html#msg976884

The City of Calgary ( EMS ) also awards their own medals:
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/calgary/story/2009/02/20/cgy-paramedic-award.html?ref=rss#socialcomments
"The Silver Heart Medal for Distinguished Conduct was struck as an internal recognition piece to be awarded solely to paramedics and EMTs employed by the City of Calgary Emergency Medical Services."

So does the City of Edmonton ( Police ):
Medal of Valour:
"This is the highest award and is bestowed for outstanding acts of personal heroism or the most conspicuous acts of courage in circumstances of extreme peril and personal hazard to life."

Medal of Honour:
"This medal is to be conferred upon members of the Edmonton Police Service, who during the intelligent and appropriate execution of their duty as a peace officer, suffered grevious physical injury or permanent disfigurement."

"The Governor General of Canada: Decorations For Bravery Nomination Form":
http://archive.gg.ca/forms/bravnom_e.html
The employer ( city ) is not required to be the Nominator: "Any person or group is welcome to nominate a deserving individual as candidate for a Decoration for Bravery"
It would be a duplication to receive medals from two levels of government for the same incident.

"The Advisory Committee is made up of representatives of the Clerk of the Privy Council, the Office of the Secretary to the Governor General, the Commissioner of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, and the Deputy Ministers of Canadian Heritage, the Department of National Defence and Transport Canada, as well as up to four others appointed by the Governor General."

I think a departmental advisory committee made up of one's peers ( ie: co-workers and supervisors who are operational on the job themselves ) are capable of making informed decisions, subject to approval by the Chief.

 

[Rheostatic]

It would be a duplication to receive medals from two levels of government for the same incident.

I thought of your post when I saw this:

Sergeant Bryant Wood, S.C., M.B., Port Hope, Ontario
Star of Courage

On September 9, 2007, Sergeant Bryant Wood, of the Port Hope Police Service, rescued a woman from a burning house, in Port Hope, Ontario. Dispatched to the scene, Sergeant Wood and a colleague found the main entrance engulfed in flames and a secondary door blocked from the inside. They opened a window, and through the thick, black smoke, they pulled a man and two women to safety. Another woman remained inside, unwilling to exit until she found her cat. As the fire quickly worsened, Sergeant Wood climbed inside to search for her. Fearing that the second floor could collapse at any moment, he searched through the apartment and finally located the victim in a bedroom. He grabbed the resisting woman and brought her to a window, where his colleague helped pull them both out.

Sergeant Wood is also receiving a Medal of Bravery for a separate incident.

The Ontario Medal For Police Bravery

Sergeant Bryant Wood    Port Hope Police ServiceJust before 5 a.m., on September 9, 2007, a man called 911 to report ahouse fire on Sherbourne Street in Port Hope, indicating people were stillinside. Sergeant Bryant Wood arrived on scene first and witnessed that thebuilding was already fully engulfed in flames from the ground to the roof.Through the dense smoke, some people were observed inside and appearedincoherent. A girl and a woman were quickly pulled from a window by SergeantWood and another officer and pushed to safety. A man yelled that another womanwas still inside searching for her cat. With the fire quickly worsening,Sergeant Wood decided to enter the unit and did a room-to-room search. Hefinally located the woman, picked her up and carried her into the living roomwhere he pushed her outside through an open window. The second floor now fullyablaze, he finally exited to safety suffering smoke inhalation. Sergeant Woodput his life on the line and saved this woman's life.

Also notable is that all the recent citations on the GG's site are for actions between 2004 and 2008.

 

[mariomike]

I thought of your post when I saw this:

That's a good example of federal and provincial duplication. And, municipal triplication ( There is a Toronto Police Medal of Honour, and a Medal of Merit ):
"In addition to the various Long Service awards for police officers and civilian members, TPS presents the following awards for outstanding performance:
Medal of Honour: Granted by the Board to a police officer or a civilian member for distinguished acts of bravery.
Medal of Merit: Granted by the Board to a police officer or a civilian member for outstanding acts of bravery or the highest level of performance of duty."

On 9-1-1 operations, I doubt others are concerned with how much bling you have, or what level(s) of government gave it to you. What they do look at is your left sleeve for years of service insignia. That let's them immediately know how much operational experience you have. When it's just you and your partner out there, that's what counts. My opinion only.

I knew Jacques, and other guys just like him. The city never sent paperwork to Ottawa or Queen's Park for medals. 
The reward was a lot of excitement, and the satisfaction of helping people. No two shifts were ever the same. And a steady paycheck:
"All the police lying down, lying down," Hins recalls.
Hins jumped into the back of his ambulance as a cop drove him through the bullets to a screaming officer.
"In the dark, when you hear those shots, it's scary because you don't know where they're coming from, where they're going to," he says. "But you have to do what you have to do.":
http://www.torontosun.com/news/torontoandgta/2009/01/16/8050051.html#/news/torontoandgta/2009/01/18/pf-8060636.html

"The longest serving paramedic in Toronto history, he has graced many front pages of the Sun, always the nameless emergency worker in a story deemed bigger than he."

Also notable is that all the recent citations on the GG's site are for actions between 2004 and 2008.

Yes.