Military Police branch will receive their new 9 mm service pistol in 2024: the C24

[markppcli]

I'll go ahead and ruin that dream by saying even the different branches of the RCMP need different types of pistol, let alone all the branches of the Federal Government. There no reason we couldn't all have the same manufacturer with specific models, though.

I feel like there’s probably a reasonable compromise that works there. And yeah if it was sub models of the 320 for all, I’m sure we could work it out. But of course this is Canada so that will never work.

 

[brihard]

I'll go ahead and ruin that dream by saying even the different branches of the RCMP need different types of pistol, let alone all the branches of the Federal Government. There no reason we couldn't all have the same manufacturer with specific models, though.

If RCMP general duty is moving to flashlight and red dot, any reason for them to not be common with the ERTlings and the dog guys? That would really just leave a need for a very compact for stuff like air marshal and maybe specialty surveillance teams.

 

[RedFive]

If RCMP general duty is moving to flashlight and red dot, any reason for them to not be common with the ERTlings and the dog guys? That would really just leave a need for a very compact for stuff like air marshal and maybe specialty surveillance teams.

I'd agree with you, but I just know some ERTling somewhere will complain bitterly that they have to carry a GD gun and they'll find a way to change something whether it be the sight, flashlight, frame size, what have you.

The lengths literally every unit no matter what they do will go to in order to distance themselves from General Duty is in my opinion one of the funniest aspects of working for the RCMP.

 

[MJP]

I'd agree with you, but I just know some ERTling somewhere will complain bitterly that they have to carry a GD gun and they'll find a way to change something whether it be the sight, flashlight, frame size, what have you.

The lengths literally every unit no matter what they do will go to in order to distance themselves from General Duty is in my opinion one of the funniest aspects of working for the RCMP.

Everyone has their own "we are special, just ask us" 3rd Battalions

 

[brihard]

I'd agree with you, but I just know some ERTling somewhere will complain bitterly that they have to carry a GD gun and they'll find a way to change something whether it be the sight, flashlight, frame size, what have you.

The lengths literally every unit no matter what they do will go to in order to distance themselves from General Duty is in my opinion one of the funniest aspects of working for the RCMP.

Until it’s story time.

 

[Haggis]

If RCMP general duty is moving to flashlight and red dot, any reason for them to not be common with the ERTlings and the dog guys? That would really just leave a need for a very compact for stuff like air marshal and maybe specialty surveillance teams.

I believe the US Air Marshalls went to a 320 compact.

My agency is looking at a red dot and flashlight for our next pistol. So far, not entertaining different models of the same gun, but a gun with different options if needed. Our plainclothes cadre is rather small compared to the Mounties.

One of our biggest concerns at this point will be conversion training from iron sights to a red dot. It's not insurmountable, but our last two changes to our firearms training have not been well thought out or executed and I fear the same may happen again.

 

[brihard]

I believe the US Air Marshalls went to a 320 compact.

My agency is looking at a red dot and flashlight for our next pistol. So far, not entertaining different models of the same gun, but a gun with different options if needed. Our plainclothes cadre is rather small compared to the Mounties.

One of our biggest concerns at this point will be conversion training from iron sights to a red dot. It's not insurmountable, but our last two changes to our firearms training have not been well thought out or executed and I fear the same may happen again.

I could definitely see logic in your agency piggybacking on an RCMP purchase and conversion training if the system were smart enough to allow it…

 

[Booter]

I could definitely see logic in your agency piggybacking on an RCMP purchase and conversion training if the system were smart enough to allow it…

There’s been an issue, very easily solved, but still out there with agencies relying on Mounties for their pistol training but not taking on the new versions of training or equipment. For example DFO piggy backing on our pistol/training but not adopting the “new” course of fire-
So Mountie trainers deliver their courses but they deliver the old versions etc. they never made the switch- so they have an even larger task ahead of them for things like transitioning to RDS etc. same thing for CCG and MP5.

That may have changed since Covid but I don’t think so.

 

[KevinB]

I believe the US Air Marshalls went to a 320 compact.

My agency is looking at a red dot and flashlight for our next pistol. So far, not entertaining different models of the same gun, but a gun with different options if needed. Our plainclothes cadre is rather small compared to the Mounties.

One of our biggest concerns at this point will be conversion training from iron sights to a red dot. It's not insurmountable, but our last two changes to our firearms training have not been well thought out or executed and I fear the same may happen again.

US Secret Service went with Glock versions.

SOD units get two, the full size with light and MRDS (Aimpoint Acro) and the 19 sized gun (that isn’t a 19, I don’t recall what it’s called), all the Uniform Division and Agents get the 19 sized gun, which will also have a MRDS and Light.

FBI also went Glock.

Both of those entities failed the Sig…

DHS went 320 as they only had a 10k round requirement for service life, and Sig was cheap.

 

[Navy_Pete]

Having once experienced an interdepartmental procurement process, I will merely observe that dental surgery without anaesthetic while getting kicked in the groin by a 300 pound individual wearing Doc Martens for a month straight would probably be less frustrating and painful.

It's funny because it's true!

 

[RedFive]

Having once experienced an interdepartmental procurement process, I will merely observe that dental surgery without anaesthetic while getting kicked in the groin by a 300 pound individual wearing Doc Martens for a month straight would probably be less frustrating and painful.

Having very recently had dental surgery that did not go as expected and engaged me in a significant recovery period in addition to a significant bill post benefits, I wholeheartedly agree with this message.

 

[dapaterson]

It's funny because it's true!

"Now that we're in concurrent signoff for three Minsters to get this file before the TB Ministers, our Department is starting its first substantive review. Remember when we said our team was empowered to make decisions on behalf of our Department? Lolz. Here's the first set of material changes we insist on."

 

[Maxman1]

Never happen. They'd be smelted first.

Imagine the left wing uproar and political fallout for JT @ Co. if a former CAF or RCMP pistol was used in a crime in the US? The anti-gunners would be all over that like ugly on an ape!

I can't recall if the Mountie pistol are distinctively marked. My agency's pistols have custom engraving identifying them as agency firearms.

Since NYPD has the 5946 as one of its approved duty pistols, it wouldn't surprise me if S&W bent over backwards to get the M&P9 adopted by the RCMP and do a buyback of the 5946s, if only for the "exclusive supplier" bragging rights, plus "bought back by the OEM and transferred to another police service" is an easy sell to the "merely misinformed" casually anti-gun people (nut bars like Rathjen and Cukier will never be happy, and public safety was never their intention anyway).

 

[Retired AF Guy]

Meanwhile, the RCMP continues to drag ass through their own pistol procurement...

Funny you sound mention that, back in mid-December 2023 a RFP for a new pistol for the RCMP was published with a closing date at 08 March 2024.

The tender can be found here:

RFP for RCMP Pistol Modernization

Attached are:
Annex B - Statement of Work,
Annex C - Statement of Requirements, and
Annex D - Mandatory Technical & Rated Criteria

The following for statement from Annex B I thought interesting:

1.2.1
Expected Outcomes

The Pistol Replacement project will provide police officers with a new modern pistol, ancillary equipment, and the necessary training to use these items in a safe and operational manner. The following represents the expected outcomes as a result of this acquisition:

a) Government of Canada’s diversity and inclusion policies are respected by leveraging Gender Based Analysis (GBA+) in the selection of the service pistols and ancillary equipment and training;

b) RCMP Members have a pistol that supports the day-to-day performance of their policing duties as required by section 124 of the Canada Labour Code, “Every employer shall ensure that the health and safety at work of every person employed by the employer is protected”;;c) Canadians can rely on the police services to provide for their safety and security because police officers have the appropriate equipment and related training to meet the high standard of competence required to successfully perform policing duties;

d) Lifecycle management process that includes an embedded sustainment (also known as “ever greening”) resulting in an established long-term planning, optimization and ultimate replacement of equipment assets; and

e) Members will have a service pistol that
:i) Is reliable and flexible, allowing for adaptability and weight reduction;
ii) Has a reduced trigger pull weight in line with GBA+ analysis;
iii) Uses a mounted flashlight to increase effectiveness in low light threat response; and
iv) Has a Red Dot Sight (RDS) for quicker and more accurate sight acquisition.

 

[Booter]

What is standing out to you Retired?

 

[Retired AF Guy]

What is standing out to you Retired?

Gender Based Analysis (GBA+); I don't think I've heard of the phrase* before and of course with all the progressive talk about "gender" and how it seems to overrule common sense just caught my attention.

RDS and flashlights attached to pistols. Just a personal bias from a old curmudgeon who learned to shoot a pistol before all these toys came out and a firm believer in the KISS principle.

* A quick Google search shows that GBA+ hsa been Canadian government policy since 1995. Just shows how behind the times I am.

 

[dangerboy]

So part of the GBA + that was done for the Canadian Army (and MP) pistol was measuring the hands of people and then having different size frames so that those soldiers (of all genders) can safely and effectively use the pistol if they require a larger or smaller frame than the standard frame.

 

[Booter]

So part of the GBA + that was done for the Canadian Army (and MP) pistol was measuring the hands of people and then having different size frames so that those soldiers (of all genders) can safely and effectively use the pistol if they require a larger or smaller frame than the standard frame.

This is the main goal with our GBA+ scan as well.

 

[dimsum]

So part of the GBA + that was done for the Canadian Army (and MP) pistol was measuring the hands of people and then having different size frames so that those soldiers (of all genders) can safely and effectively use the pistol if they require a larger or smaller frame than the standard frame.

I guess the old military joke of “there are two sizes” doesn’t work anymore

 

[Colin Parkinson]

I guess the old military joke of “there are two sizes” doesn’t work anymore

We have 4 sizes now. To big, to small, on order, and it shows up on the stocklist, but we can't find it. So a 100% improvement in selection.