Member on IR making MTEC claims

[snowball17]

TD is for CF members and public servants who travel.

For individuals accompanying the CF (including civilians accompanying bands) they should be under a contract for services that dictates what is covered.

Is it the same if the civilian is a member of the Band, and not just accompanying them? There are a lot of members of the band who are civilians. I am trying to figure out for them what they are entitled for, and what they are not.

 

[CountDC]

In what way is he a member of a Military band?  Volunteer? Then he could not be tasked but requested to go.  At that time he should have asked if they were footing the bill for him to go. 

You did answer one of you own questions:

Question: Is there any president for this? Answer: He was allowed before to claim these expenses

Interesting case.  I think the Band COC should dig into this one and find a way to cover the expenses as they were paid before and no one informed him the rules had changed.  For future events they (and he) should be sure that everyone understands what is to be covered and what is not.

 

[snowball17]

In what way is he a member of a Military band?  Volunteer? Then he could not be tasked but requested to go.  At that time he should have asked if they were footing the bill for him to go. 

You did answer one of you own questions:

Question: Is there any president for this? Answer: He was allowed before to claim these expenses

Interesting case.  I think the Band COC should dig into this one and find a way to cover the expenses as they were paid before and no one informed him the rules had changed.  For future events they (and he) should be sure that everyone understands what is to be covered and what is not.

Yes he is a volunteer, however with this unit if you want to be a member of the band you have to attend all taskings as asked, or you are replaced. When he brought it up through the ranks he was told that they were not going to be reimbursed for their travel, but at the same time they made it known to him that the military members were being given TD as they are military. I think it is a kick in the pants if you ask me. Yes he was allowed to claim these things before, but after they arrived and he asked about it he was told that it wasn't in the budget and they would not be reimbursed. They did however allow him to claim his train ticket, and they provided accommodation for him while they were away for a week.

 

[dapaterson]

There is no legal authority to pay non-CF / non Public servants TD unless there is a contract for services in place.  Bands are no different.  There is no provision in the CFTDI or the NJC travel directive to pay travel or incidental costs for civilian volunteers.  That it was done in the past does not make it legal or correct.

If they are public servants, lines may be a bit more blurred, since the NJC directive is for duty travel; volunteering with a band would not seem to meet that criteria.

Ultimately, DHH & DFPP need to sit down and resolve the many issues surrounding civilians with military bands.  Frankly, given that military bands have been able to swan around Europe and Asia on Tattoos for the past 10 years but have never once been able to find the time to provide musical support to troops in Afghanistan (you know, that whole "bands exist for morale and esprit de corps" thing) I'd cut the entire branch to zero.

 

[Blackadder1916]

. . . .  He was tasked to play at an event which was out of town and was for several days. . . . .

Was this event a "military" tasking or was it the attendance of the band at a performance event?

I was not a bandsmans and the only "tune-r" I've carried in the army was communications related, though I have had to "pay the piper" a few times.  Things may have changed since I've left the CF and there were probably differences among the various militia districts/brigades on how they funded the "official" activities of reserve bands.  The way I recall it, bands (being separately accountable) were allocated budgets for Class A days (based on total number of reservists in the band and an estimate of the number of official events for all brigade units where music support would be required) and for operations (for travel, meals, TD etc to support the authorized official events of the brigade).  Since civilian volunteers could not be "tasked" it was assumed that travel outside the local area would not include the civilians and if they did travel with the band it would have to be on their own dime, or funded by the organization requesting the band's presence or funded by the band's regimental NPF.  Similarly, if a unit requested music support for an event that was not on the authorized list (i.e. more than one mess dinner a year) then the requesting unit also had to provide the Class A days and travel if necessary (or an honorarium in lieu).

But regardless of the legality of reimbursing civilian musicians for expenses incurred while travelling with a volunteer there appears to be at least one such band that says they do:

http://12wingpipeband.ca/join.htm

Join the band

12 Wing Pipes and Drums is always looking for new members. Anyone is welcome to join, you do not need to be a member of the Canadian Forces to play in our band.

If you are interested, please contact us.

Top 5 reasons to join the band

1. No band dues.

2. We go on several trips per year, which in the past three years have included: Maxville, Quebec, Korea, Holland, Belgium, Russia, Bermuda, and Virginia.

3. All travel is paid for, including transportation, accomodation, meals, and an incidentals allowance.

4. Dedicated full time leadership and instruction - the pipe major and drum instructor run the band as their full time job and offer free private lessons to band members and military personnel.

5. Best uniform ever.

 

[dapaterson]

I should clarify: reimbursement from public funds.  NPF is a whole other kettle of fish.

 

[CountDC]

Ultimately, DHH & DFPP need to sit down and resolve the many issues surrounding civilians with military bands.  Frankly, given that military bands have been able to swan around Europe and Asia on Tattoos for the past 10 years but have never once been able to find the time to provide musical support to troops in Afghanistan (you know, that whole "bands exist for morale and esprit de corps" thing) I'd cut the entire branch to zero.

Got my support there.  Cut the Branch and let the units that want it have their own bands.  That way the bands can be with the units doing their job where ever they are deployed to.

 

[snowball17]

Was this event a "military" tasking or was it the attendance of the band at a performance event?

I was not a bandsmans and the only "tune-r" I've carried in the army was communications related, though I have had to "pay the piper" a few times.  Things may have changed since I've left the CF and there were probably differences among the various militia districts/brigades on how they funded the "official" activities of reserve bands.  The way I recall it, bands (being separately accountable) were allocated budgets for Class A days (based on total number of reservists in the band and an estimate of the number of official events for all brigade units where music support would be required) and for operations (for travel, meals, TD etc to support the authorized official events of the brigade).  Since civilian volunteers could not be "tasked" it was assumed that travel outside the local area would not include the civilians and if they did travel with the band it would have to be on their own dime, or funded by the organization requesting the band's presence or funded by the band's regimental NPF.  Similarly, if a unit requested music support for an event that was not on the authorized list (i.e. more than one mess dinner a year) then the requesting unit also had to provide the Class A days and travel if necessary (or an honorarium in lieu).

But regardless of the legality of reimbursing civilian musicians for expenses incurred while travelling with a volunteer there appears to be at least one such band that says they do:

http://12wingpipeband.ca/join.htm

Yes it was a military tasking, and I know that there are a few bands that do pay TD for their members even if they are civilians or not. I think it was a case that the Drum Major did not want to do the extra paperwork for the meals to be claimed, and as far as he was concerned he was getting TD so it was no big deal to him if the civilian members of the band got TD or not for their meals etc.
This is just my opinion though from what I have heard and seen first hand...