Live 8...a success??

[swanita]

We all heard about the Live 8 concerts that took place July 2/05 to raise awareness for ending world poverty & to let the G8 group know that the world wants them to take action.   (remember that tickets to the events were free  :)

Do people think it was successful & will it help the poor countries get increased aid?

Also, what about Canada's local poor? Are they left out too?

Ideas.....?

 

[Da_man]

IMO throwing money at poor countries isnt going to change anything...  What we have to do is to stop exploiting them.

 

[Korus]

I can't help but think it's people's way of making themselves feel warm and fuzzy inside, like they made a difference.. without actually having done much at all to really help.

Although their intentions are noble...

 

[Sh0rtbUs]

like my father said, the same people who will cry for Africa 1 day out of 365, are the same people who step over the homeless on their way to work without a second thought. I really dont think its going to do much of anything...


Madonna was so bad, i deeply despise her. 

 

[sgt_mandal]

Can call over 27 million (last time i heard, its probably way more now) names not a sucess??

 

[Korus]

I can write my name down, and feel all warm and fuzzy, but that doesn't mean it'll change the world.

If said names actually convince the G8 to do something, *THEN* you can call it a success.

 

[paracowboy]

It's a joke. You wanna help the hungry? Go over and feed them.
Sign a list, kiss my ass. Both will do the same amount of good for the hungry.

 

[Gouki]

For that matter internet petitions to shut down Maddox or ban Grand Theft Auto 3 are just as effective.

Like was said, you can't throw money around at them and expect it all to magically fix itself. Their infrastructure itself is broken not to mention war, famine and corruption. It would take some sort of massive reconstruction project to make a difference else the money is just going to be funneled away and the poor will still poor and the dictator/corrupt official/warlord/etc will just get stronger.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

That was on yesterday, right?..........

 

[P-Free]

I fail to see what a load of pop stars are going to do to stop poverty in Africa from stages in such places as London, Paris, Philadelphia and Barrie.

 

[CADPAT SOLDIER]

Well if they're going to have a big concert with all of the worlds greatest acts they probably could have charged $20 a ticket and spent that money on poverty relief.
lets see 20 * 2,400,000 = a lot less poverty stricken Africans

Well it was successful if you count the fact that it got Pink Floyd back together if only for one show

 

[Mappy]

I agree with the charging people and giving the money away to the countries that need it.

BUT there are other parts of the world that need the money too.  There is poverty everywhere, not just in Africa.  Paul Martin did say that he cannot promise the .7% (or whatever number it was) GDP contribution because he doesn't want to put Canada's budget and debt at risk, and apparently most Canadians agree with him.

Raine Maida from Our Lady Peace was quoted yesterday in saying that this problem will not be solved overnight, it's something that will take 15-20yrs to achieve. 

World Globalization is one of the major causes of world poverty, unfortantely, the CEO's of the companies that are abusing the poorer countries probably don't care because 'it affects their profits' and whatnot. 

I honestly believe that the world poverty problem will never be fulled solved,  but perhaps a more equalized world is the ideal situation.

 

[Britney Spears]

Well if they're going to have a big concert with all of the worlds greatest acts they probably could have charged $20 a ticket and spent that money on poverty relief.
lets see 20 * 2,400,000 = a lot less poverty stricken Africans

This is a big lie.*  Africans are not starving because they lack western money or planeloads of western rice. If that were the case the problem would have been solved already, because rice and a few planes cost us basically nothing. Famines are not caused by nature, they are caused by dictatorships and war and bad guys with guns.

I'm not knocking the aid organizations and NGOs, they are brave people doing good work, but ultimately they are treating the symptoms and not the cause. The best thing you can do to help the poor and destitute of the world is join the CF, cbt arms if you really want to be in the thick of the action, go overseas, and settle the problem at the source(and sometimes you even get paid too). Once that problem is solved the rest is easy.

Also, I resent the comparison between an African eking out a living against all odds and the drug addicted, alchohol and tobacco sodden homeless squeegee kids here in the west. Maybe it's because I'm an immigrant, but if you can't make a decent living in Canada, the best darn country in the world, you might as well just give up and try again on the next karma roto, because there's nothing I can do to help you.

*EDIT: Sorry, I'm not calling Future Unknown a liar, I'm saying that the premesis of throwing more rice and money at the Africans is flawed.

 

[CADPAT SOLDIER]

I do understand the cause of the problem cannot be solved by throwing .7 percent of our GDP at Africa,
But I do believe that out there, there is a NGO that could probably use $48,000,000 to, as you say "Treat the Symptoms"
if only temporally until someone steps up and fixes the root of the problem.

Besides that I think Live 8 may only serve to make people less interested in looking for and solving the problem, because now we've all been told by the most influential artists that the problem can be solved if we give more and more money.

 

[1feral1]

How I see it...

Firstly I voted NO, it was not a success. This event was pumped live into Australian households on FOXTEL.

Africa will always be in the situation it is in. If their debts are cleared, the corrupt governments in these 3rd world countries will still line their pockets with $$$$$, and the poor will still die from their own government's incompetance, mismanagment and corruption. We cannot change a way of life with $$.

These places will continue to buy weapons, pocket money, divert $$ to what they feel it can be used for, kill innocent people because of religion or politics, and do what they have been doing again and again, meanwhile AIDS will take its share of people as its getting worse.

Its a vicious circle in which we really have no control over. We can't understand why they do this, thats because of our western culture and beliefs. These seem to collide with their way of life.

Sad but true.

 

[Cdn Blackshirt]

This is a big lie.*   Africans are not starving because they lack western money or planeloads of western rice. If that were the case the problem would have been solved already, because rice and a few planes cost us basically nothing. Famines are not caused by nature, they are caused by dictatorships and war and bad guys with guns.....

You forgot my big three pet peaves:

• The fact that overpopulation is unsustainable in the environments causing irreversable damage to forests and water resources.
• The fact that overpopulation is caused by a lack of birth control and proper family planning as most of the NGO's are religiously-affiliated and will not support birth control even though it is clearly essential
• The the fact that in addition to overpopluation and destroyed environments, the AIDS epidemic is causing demographic chaos on the populations as those that should be educated and supporting the country's development are cut down by the disease leaving behind millions of children and their grandparents (many of whom are too old to work).

Bottom Line:  If you don't have a frank debate about those three issues in addition to the corruption/dictatorship issues you mentioned, you could throw billions per year at Africa in particular and only create an ever larger mess.  Ergo, it is my own opinion that LIVE 8 actually does a huge disservice because it both misrepresents the problem and sanctimoniously miscasts blame to those people who do genuinely want to make a positive difference....

JMHO,


Matthew.   

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

Quote from Mappy,
World Globalization is one of the major causes of world poverty, unfortantely, the CEO's of the companies that are abusing the poorer countries probably don't care because 'it affects their profits' and whatnot. 

This line of thought is a cop-out we use to make ourselves feel good while shifting the blame onto others. Just how do these "companies" survive?......oh yea, you, me, us, consuming the goods they produce at the lowest price that we can........

 

[I_am_John_Galt]

I'm with Britney & Wes ... the unfortunate fact of the matter is that the root of the problem is that many of these countries are run by corrupt dictatorships (the term kleptocracy seems to fit).  Morevover, the prevalence of socialist orthodoxy in both their world and ours prevents them from enjoying the benefits of freer trade.

I found this interesting:

The changing ideology of rockonomics
Samizdata Illuminatus (Arkham, Massachusetts)  African affairs "¢ Globalization/economics "¢ Opinions on liberty
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At Hyde Park, Dido just introduced as the "African Ambassador for Music from Senegal", Youssou N'Dour, who she was "in awe" of, "not just because he has a wonderful voice, but because of his wonderful beliefs". He came on stage to say:

    "The debt cancellation is OK. The aid is OK. But, please, open your markets."

There will be an awful lot of well-intentioned nonsense given unquestioning, reverential coverage today, with ignorance and platitudes dressed up as profundity. Maybe, however, for perhaps the first time at an event of this type and on this scale, a kernel of truth will wriggle its way onto TV.

I consider this a small but notable victory for the notion that, if you permit free speech and are prepared to tolerate every misguided and moronic idea, eventually the truth will out.

http://www.samizdata.net/blog/archives/007724.html

Cdn Blackshirt, the "problem" of overpopulation is a myth that has been exposed over and over since Thomas Malthus first came up with it 300 years ago (according to him, and several others, we should have already been wiped-out several times over).  Unfortunately, this doesn't stop the eco-luddites "anti-gmo" crowd from trying to make sure it happens.

 

[camochick]

I read an article in the paper yesterday that said that alot of the people at these concerts didnt have a clue why they were there. Alot of people I know didnt even know live 8 was going on and if they did they had no idea about it's purpose.
  I really dont think that throwing a bunch of money at any situation is going to be beneficial and if they want to help the poor why dont they help all people in poverty, why just focus on africa. I think the best thing we can do is educate people who are in extreme poverty, show them how to grow crops in extreme conditions, teach them about birth control, teach them to read and write. Once you educate them then they will be able to rise up against the corruption in their countries and fix it themselves.

 

[a_majoor]

A quick look at North Korea should lay anti-globalization AND increase aid arguments to rest once and for all (but only if you are really willing to see what is going on).

North Korea is perhaps the most "closed" economy on the planet; their only major exports happen to be ballistic missiles and (perhaps) weapons grade plutonium, high "value added" products to be sure, but available to a very small and select group of buyers. The remainder of the economy is cut off from globalism, and the people have about the lowest per capita income anywhere.

North Korea managed to blackmail the Clinton administration into providing vast quantities of food and oil, as well as a promise of two light water reactors (which were less capable of producing plutonium), yet this conucopea of goods (supplimented by South Korea's then current "Sunshine" policy) did not make a dent in the situation north of the DMZ.

The only way to "fix" the problem in Africa over the short term is naked Imperialism; nothing less than conquering these "countries", imprisoning or shooting the kleptocrats who cause so much misery and installing a Procounsel with the specific mission of organizing and mobilizing the masses to clean up and repair the infrastructure, get educated and trained up in taking over the various jobs and positions required to run a country. This is "White Man's Burden" with a vengence, but if we don't stay the course for generations, then the places will slide back to kleptocracy (look at the Central American states after the Marines left). Even India, with about 300 years of colonial British rule, is quite wobbly in terms of being a fully mature democracy (India was a virtual "one party" state under the Congress Party, which itself was a dynastic vehicle for the Ghandi family, until the late 1980s, early 1990s).

The alternatives are almost as bad; the Status Quo; or a complete disintigration of the nation states and a reversion to tribalism. The other possible alternative; the creation of an "American" nation in Africa, with a proper Federal government and the idea of Civic Nationalism replacing tribal or identity politics is on the very outside edge of probabilities (We don't even have this in Canada!). Free markets without the level playing field of legal and property rights will only make a very small dent in the overall problem of Africa.