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Liberals neglected army...

dano

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[ Original Article ]

Liberals neglected army, Harper says
4-year, $5.2 billion plan for defence
Where he'd find extra money is unclear


ROBERT BENZIE
QUEEN'S PARK BUREAU

TRENTON - The Liberal government has undermined Canada's sovereignty by allowing the armed forces to deteriorate, Conservative Leader Stephen Harper says.

Unveiling a four-year, $5.2 billion promise to boost military spending if he forms the next government, Harper yesterday accused prime ministers Paul Martin and Jean Chrétien of making the country look bad on the world stage.

"Neglecting our armed forces has been a neglect of our sovereignty and has weakened us in Washington and around the world," he told about 100 supporters at a rally outside CFB Trenton.

"Over the past 10 years, the Liberals have cut $20 billion in purchasing power from the Department of National Defence. As a result, we have fewer personnel, older equipment, and are far too reliant on the United States."

Harper, who eventually wants to increase the forces to pre-1993 levels of about 80,000, promised to have 65,000 Canadians in uniform by the end of his first four-year term. That's up from about 52,000 today.

"It enhances our sovereignty. When it really counts, protecting our sovereignty, guarding our security and ensuring that Canada is an important player on the international stage with an effective military, the Liberals are all talk and no action," he said.

"The Canadian Armed Forces are not just another government department."

To that end, a Conservative government would inject an additional $1.2 billion annually for the next three years and $1.6 billion in the final year of the first mandate.

The annual defence budget currently is about $13 billion.

Harper did not identify what government services would be cut to free up so much money for defence.

"Later this week we will be releasing our full platform that will have all the fiscal details. We will have different priorities than this government. They will not just include tax cuts. They will include different spending priorities," the Conservative leader said.

"We will be focusing our spending increases in a few ... priority areas, including national defence. We will certainly not be running HRDC (Human Resources Development Canada) boondoogles, sponsorship scandals and gun registries," he said, referring to Liberal spending scandals.

Harper spoke ambiguously when asked if he would have sent troops to the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq last year.

"We would have supported our (31) troops that were already there (serving with U.S. and British forces) and would have supported our allies. We should morally support our allies against Saddam Hussein. I was not for Saddam Hussein. I was not neutral. I was for our allies.

"It was unforgivable that our government would have people in a war zone and not fully support their mission," said Harper.

Then he emphasized that there is "no capacity to extend the commitments of the Canadian Forces in Iraq."

Last year, Harper said Canada should stand "shoulder to shoulder" with its allies against the now deposed and detained Iraqi leader.

 
Hope he wins a majority.

There's already a thread like this. ;)
 
I hope if he does win he actually sticks to what he says.
 
Here's an excerpt(sp?) from an article about something else.

On Monday, Harper announced a multi-billion dollar boost to the military, surpassing what the Liberals would spend.

Martin said the Conservatives are applying a "Cold War philosophy" to military spending.

"I don't think Canadians really do believe that aircraft carriers are more important than investments in basic health-care institutions," he said.

I hardly think Harper is apply a "Cold War Philosophy".  He's trying to fix what the Liberals have screwed up over the years.  But it is smart for Martin to suggest that Harper is going to go crazy on funding and turn us into a superpower.

 
Here's the link to that article.   That's the only part that's related to the military though.

http://www.cbc.ca/stories/2004/06/01/canada/martelecsen040601
 
  :rocket:

Come on guys!  Martin is already countering with the ole Liberal "Healthcare" ploy or threat.  He is promising millions to go into Healthcare.  As if we haven't heard that one before. 

I am tired of hearing Liberals mouth the word "Healthcare".  "We can't spend more on Defence unless we cut Healthcare."  "We can't change the Fisheries unless we cut Healthcare."  We can't do.....unless we cut Healthcare."  Everything came down to that.  I am tired of hearing him even mention the word Healtcare, it just makes me want to vote him out like the Mulroney Conservatives.

GW
 
At this point I wouldn't mind going into debt for better education, health and military.
 
CFL said:
At this point I wouldn't mind going into debt for better education, health and military.

agree.. for myself, post-secondary student, can't really afford this Hugh amount of tution fees. I can imagine that how much I have to pay back to government (student loan) in the future. Besides, I am not sure that I can find a nice job or stable job after I graduate. If I can't, how can I pay off all the money!  :'(
 
Do a three year basic engagement in the Army.  Save your money for school instead of pissing it away on women and booze and you come out mature enough to succeed in a post secondary setting and be financially ahead as well.
 
I was watching the CPAC station the other day and they were following Stephen Harper around to his events, profiling him and what not. Some dufus came up to him and started chanting "health care for seniors not aircraft carriers for George Bush's war", to which, after a few repetitions from said dufus, Stephen Harper replied "how about health care not corruption".

Let me echo that sentiment, it is time for change and it is time to move away from the corruption and broken promises of the Liberals.
 
Infanteer said:
Do a three year basic engagement in the Army.  Save your money for school instead of pissing it away on women and booze and you come out mature enough to succeed in a post secondary setting and be financially ahead as well.

Sounds easy enough, but when your 18 your still definitly gunna piss some of it away.  On top of that, you'd have to find a school close to home because tuition plus residence fees or house rental fees are ridiculous.  I'm barely scrapping by this year, and I live at home.  Next year will be murder since my program (as most business programs are) are de-regulated tuition so they will climb to 7 or 8 grand a year after that. 

It can definitly be done, but tuition prices need to be reduced, especially considering how long it takes people to pay back student loans these days. 
 
Sounds easy enough, but when your 18 your still definitly gunna piss some of it away.  On top of that, you'd have to find a school close to home because tuition plus residence fees or house rental fees are ridiculous.  I'm barely scrapping by this year, and I live at home.  Next year will be murder since my program (as most business programs are) are de-regulated tuition so they will climb to 7 or 8 grand a year after that. 

It can definitly be done, but tuition prices need to be reduced, especially considering how long it takes people to pay back student loans these days.

So because someone can't be fiscally responsible, the government (ie: the taxpayer) should pick up more of the burden for post secondary schooling?
 
There may be a ray of hope for the Forces if the Harper team wins. :tank:
 
Infanteer said:
Sounds easy enough, but when your 18 your still definitly gunna piss some of it away.  On top of that, you'd have to find a school close to home because tuition plus residence fees or house rental fees are ridiculous.  I'm barely scrapping by this year, and I live at home.  Next year will be murder since my program (as most business programs are) are de-regulated tuition so they will climb to 7 or 8 grand a year after that. 

It can definitly be done, but tuition prices need to be reduced, especially considering how long it takes people to pay back student loans these days.

So because someone can't be fiscally responsible, the government (ie: the taxpayer) should pick up more of the burden for post secondary schooling?

No, the government should not be responsible for someone elses money, but where is the gaurantee that you will be financially ahead after a 3 year stint in the army?  Will you be ahead enough to pay for post seconday education?  Even if you do have money saved up, look at how much money you will have, and then the current costs of post secondary education these days.  I'd rather not go into my personal finances on a public board, but lets ballpark the price of tuition for a university around 5000-6000 dollars a year, that is just tuition.  If that person wants to live on residence, add another 5000.  On top of that maybe 1000 for food, depending on meal plans or if you buy your food yourself.  Plus books, 500.  Plus other expenses throughout the year could be anywhere between 200-500.  That adds up to anywhere between 11 000 and 12 000 a year.  If your in a four year program  thats over 40 000 dollars.  Of coarse, the numbers could fluctuate up and down, but as it is now, seconday school costs are rising.  The government currently wants to lower interest rates so students can borrow more money, and then end up paying the government more money back in the end.  As far as I'm concernced, we tax payers pay enough money as it is already, and they government can, if they wanted to, put more money into subsidizing education, or at least freezing the prices, which I believe they need to do.

The government lost millions of dollars in the sponsorship scandle, and they have estimated blowing almost a billion dollars on gun registry.  That money could have taken a HUGE load off students and tuition prices, instead of being wasted.
 
Northern Touch,
I can relate as I am currently attending college and paying said tuition fees. It makes me a little "cheesed" that if I had completed my degree straight out of high school it probably would have cost me half as much as it will when I do finally graduate. That being said, I've paid every cent of my tuition and books with no help from the family bank account (mommy/daddy) and no student loans. Granted I haven't taken a full course load, but that's part of the price of not owing anything. It can be done. I don't get to take spring break vacations in mexico but at least I won't have five digit loans when I graduate. I just can't sympathize with those that have a choice to attend school and still complain about the price. Post secondary education isn't owed to you. It's like a car, if you want a nice one you've got to shell out for it, if you don't like the price, don't buy it.
 
Infanteer said:
Sounds easy enough, but when your 18 your still definitly gunna piss some of it away.   On top of that, you'd have to find a school close to home because tuition plus residence fees or house rental fees are ridiculous.   I'm barely scrapping by this year, and I live at home.   Next year will be murder since my program (as most business programs are) are de-regulated tuition so they will climb to 7 or 8 grand a year after that.  

It can definitly be done, but tuition prices need to be reduced, especially considering how long it takes people to pay back student loans these days.

So because someone can't be fiscally responsible, the government (ie: the taxpayer) should pick up more of the burden for post secondary schooling?

2 months over the summer in the reserve + the $2000 education grant (if they are still keeping it) makes for around $6500 (or so I have been told) that will cover tuition on any regular degree and books.  You also have an 2 additional months of summer to get a full time job + 8 month you can work part time.  If you work a during your summer,you can pay off all your schooling costs and you can piss away anything you make during the year on beer and women. It does get tight if you are living away from home (down here res is 8000-9000) but it is doable.

Also spending money on women is a critical aspect of your university life and is essential to lthe growth of Canada...don't drop too low in this area ;)
 
Also spending money on women is a critical aspect of your university life and is essential to lthe growth of Canada...don't drop too low in this area

One university student to another, I feel it is my duty to ensure that you understand "spending money on women" to mean spending money on things FOR women, not actually spending it (ahem) ON women.  Give 'em hell :tank:
 
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