I'll believe it when I see it.
Justin Trudeau hints at boosting Canada’s military spending
- Thread starter Maxman1
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There is a lot of stuff that is still close hold FOUO or classified, so I wouldn’t throw too many stones.
Lots of stories about low tech successes are both vastly over stated, and also some have heavy support behind the scenes.
Lots of stories about low tech successes are both vastly over stated, and also some have heavy support behind the scenes.
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Here's the link to the Joly speech to the Economic Club that Blair referenced.
If I'm honest I have to say that my biases make it difficult to see any major shifts in focus. I would prefer a more full throated defence of Canada's interests in a troubled environment rather than trusting to reshaping the climate.
If I'm honest I have to say that my biases make it difficult to see any major shifts in focus. I would prefer a more full throated defence of Canada's interests in a troubled environment rather than trusting to reshaping the climate.
FSTO
Army.ca Veteran
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Our Foreign Minister tells the world--“I am a Door Opener”
Is this what Canadian foreign policy has become?
wesleywark.substack.com
What was billed as a major foreign policy speech by the Foreign Minister, Melanie Joly, two years into her surprise cabinet appointment, proved mostly empty of substance and devoid of anything new. Lots of generalities and bromides, though, and a hint of uncorked idealism from an old bottle.
You can follow the speech on CPAC, here:
CPAC
Delivered before an audience of the Economic Club of Canada in Toronto on October 30, the Minister began, necessarily, by reviewing Canada’s position on the war in the Middle East. Nothing new here. She described the horror of Hamas’ terrorist attack; affirmed Israel’s right of self-defence; emphasised the need to obey international law during the armed conflict; and stressed the importance of establishing a humanitarian pause or “truce” to allow much-needed aid into the Gaza strip. There was a little more punchiness in a reference to settler violence against Palestinians in the occupied West Bank, which she said must stop. There was no reference to a future plan for the region beyond embrace of a two-state solution.
Then she shifted gears, in and out of French, to the broader international threat environment. To set the scene she reached for a Madeleine Albright (former US Secretary of State) quote about international relations being more like a game of pool than of chess. Thanks, tips. Nothing from the storehouse of Canadian wisdom and experience on foreign affairs?
Joly talked about two guiding principles for Canadian foreign policy:
Defence of Canadian sovereignty
The conduct of pragmatic diplomacy
On the sovereignty theme, she promised that the long-delayed defence policy update will come out and prove Canada’s commitment to bolstering its military capacity. Over to you Minister Blair.
Joly briefly reviewed the geographic compass point in an upbeat fashion. The moderator afterwards called this an “optimistic outlook.” To put it mildly.
Looking to the south she said Canada would work with the US on border security and immigration. (That’s it?)
To East, across the Atlantic, Joly claimed Canada as a reliable NATO partner and strong supporter of Ukraine. Nothing about what the future might hold; nothing about support for a Ukraine peace plan; nothing about Putin’s Russia.
To the West, Joly affirmed the Indo-Pacific strategy, with a bit of a twist, suggesting the emphasis should be on closer ties with two key Asian states, Japan and South Korea. The current friction between Canada and India, and reduced hopes of an Indian connection as a counter-weight to China, was described as a “moment in time.” The clock might stretch on that one, Salvador Dali fashion. On relations with China—zero, baby.
Where Joly went further was in regard to the Northern compass point. She promised that Canada would safeguard the Arctic and exercise sovereignty, without saying anything about how. She said Canada will make the necessary investments to ensure economic development in the North, again nothing on how. Easy talking points. She promised that Canada will work with the Nordics and the US on Arctic issues. No mention of the future of the Arctic Council or what to do about Russia as a key Arctic power.
Joly then turned to democratic protections and promised strong defences against foreign interference, surprisingly without mentioning her own department’s leading role in countering disinformation.
She did say a ‘Foreign interference Transparency Registry ‘was coming, misnaming it a “Foreign actor” registry. But this is in the purview of the Minister of Public Safety, Dominic Leblanc. So a promise she can’t deliver on.
Joly committed to sending foreign diplomats who engaged in foreign interference packing. OK, let’s see some action on that front with regard to the Russians, and a little quicker and more decisive action when news surfaces of Chinese diplomats’ meddling.
But the best of a badly under-cooked speech was left for last.
Joly tackled the theme of Canada’s approach to pragmatic diplomacy. Actually, she turned the concept on its head and talked about an idealistic policy in which Canada would perform as an independent honest broker in global affairs, avoiding any tendency to see the world as divided into two camps (heaven forbid not democracies versus autocracies, nor like-minded economies versus unfriendlies). For guidance she turned to the work of Pierre Elliot Trudeau, suggesting that his legacy was to keep allies close but to ensure Canada stayed open to different global perspectives. That might sound good as a distant lesson from the Cold War (if true—I leave that to Trudeau pere scholars), but it is far from a pragmatic response to the current divides in international relations and far from an embrace of the reality that the international system has reached, as she said (quoting from her boss, quoting from Joe Biden), an “inflection point” in terms of the threats facing it.
Perhaps the most quotable quote from the speech was Joly’s insistence that “I am a door opener, not a door closer.” Wow, is that what Canada has become? A flunkey in the service of an outmoded idea about Canada’s role in the world?
- Reaction score
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- Points
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What a deep thinker we have for a Foreign Minister...Our Foreign Minister tells the world--“I am a Door Opener”
Is this what Canadian foreign policy has become?
What was billed as a major foreign policy speech by the Foreign Minister, Melanie Joly, two years into her surprise cabinet appointment, proved mostly empty of substance and devoid of anything new. Lots of generalities and bromides, though, and a hint of uncorked idealism from an old bottle.
You can follow the speech on CPAC, here:
CPAC
Delivered before an audience of the Economic Club of Canada in Toronto on October 30, the Minister began, necessarily, by reviewing Canada’s position on the war in the Middle East. Nothing new here. She described the horror of Hamas’ terrorist attack; affirmed Israel’s right of self-defence; emphasised the need to obey international law during the armed conflict; and stressed the importance of establishing a humanitarian pause or “truce” to allow much-needed aid into the Gaza strip. There was a little more punchiness in a reference to settler violence against Palestinians in the occupied West Bank, which she said must stop. There was no reference to a future plan for the region beyond embrace of a two-state solution.
Then she shifted gears, in and out of French, to the broader international threat environment. To set the scene she reached for a Madeleine Albright (former US Secretary of State) quote about international relations being more like a game of pool than of chess. Thanks, tips. Nothing from the storehouse of Canadian wisdom and experience on foreign affairs?
Joly talked about two guiding principles for Canadian foreign policy:
Defence of Canadian sovereignty
The conduct of pragmatic diplomacy
On the sovereignty theme, she promised that the long-delayed defence policy update will come out and prove Canada’s commitment to bolstering its military capacity. Over to you Minister Blair.
Joly briefly reviewed the geographic compass point in an upbeat fashion. The moderator afterwards called this an “optimistic outlook.” To put it mildly.
Looking to the south she said Canada would work with the US on border security and immigration. (That’s it?)
To East, across the Atlantic, Joly claimed Canada as a reliable NATO partner and strong supporter of Ukraine. Nothing about what the future might hold; nothing about support for a Ukraine peace plan; nothing about Putin’s Russia.
To the West, Joly affirmed the Indo-Pacific strategy, with a bit of a twist, suggesting the emphasis should be on closer ties with two key Asian states, Japan and South Korea. The current friction between Canada and India, and reduced hopes of an Indian connection as a counter-weight to China, was described as a “moment in time.” The clock might stretch on that one, Salvador Dali fashion. On relations with China—zero, baby.
Where Joly went further was in regard to the Northern compass point. She promised that Canada would safeguard the Arctic and exercise sovereignty, without saying anything about how. She said Canada will make the necessary investments to ensure economic development in the North, again nothing on how. Easy talking points. She promised that Canada will work with the Nordics and the US on Arctic issues. No mention of the future of the Arctic Council or what to do about Russia as a key Arctic power.
Joly then turned to democratic protections and promised strong defences against foreign interference, surprisingly without mentioning her own department’s leading role in countering disinformation.
She did say a ‘Foreign interference Transparency Registry ‘was coming, misnaming it a “Foreign actor” registry. But this is in the purview of the Minister of Public Safety, Dominic Leblanc. So a promise she can’t deliver on.
Joly committed to sending foreign diplomats who engaged in foreign interference packing. OK, let’s see some action on that front with regard to the Russians, and a little quicker and more decisive action when news surfaces of Chinese diplomats’ meddling.
But the best of a badly under-cooked speech was left for last.
Joly tackled the theme of Canada’s approach to pragmatic diplomacy. Actually, she turned the concept on its head and talked about an idealistic policy in which Canada would perform as an independent honest broker in global affairs, avoiding any tendency to see the world as divided into two camps (heaven forbid not democracies versus autocracies, nor like-minded economies versus unfriendlies). For guidance she turned to the work of Pierre Elliot Trudeau, suggesting that his legacy was to keep allies close but to ensure Canada stayed open to different global perspectives. That might sound good as a distant lesson from the Cold War (if true—I leave that to Trudeau pere scholars), but it is far from a pragmatic response to the current divides in international relations and far from an embrace of the reality that the international system has reached, as she said (quoting from her boss, quoting from Joe Biden), an “inflection point” in terms of the threats facing it.
Perhaps the most quotable quote from the speech was Joly’s insistence that “I am a door opener, not a door closer.” Wow, is that what Canada has become? A flunkey in the service of an outmoded idea about Canada’s role in the world?
Little wonder the world views us as not being a serious nation.
Happy Guy
Full Member
- Reaction score
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MND Blair is using political speech. He is referring to commitments to purchase the F35, the Long Range Patrol Aircraft replacement, the NSSP and other already announced buys. What he doesn't say is whether the gov't will commit to a sizable increase to the baseline funding of DND.
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You know things are sliding, when we’re not even a convenor any more….just a door opener…
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I prefer this one....
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MilEME09
Army.ca Veteran
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Passing off old announcements as new committments
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It will be interesting to watch Michael Chong as FM when PP wins the next election. I have high hopes for Mr Chong and quite honestly, would prefer him to be the leader of the Conservatives.
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What a truthful or up to date POL.?
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Do you really think Joly wrote that speech?
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Edited some portions more likely, to remove ‘we’ or ‘Canada’ and replace with ‘I’….Katie Telford probably let those minor Jolyisms stay, since they didn’t material affect the ‘warm fuzzy’ (aka. Peeing in a dark suit) sense of awesomeness that Canadians should feel comfortable believing of themselves.
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Harder..... faster..... deeper..... stop moaning!
Prayers - what did you think I was talking about?
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- Reaction score
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- Points
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Our Foreign Minister tells the world--“I am a Door Opener”
Is this what Canadian foreign policy has become?
What was billed as a major foreign policy speech by the Foreign Minister, Melanie Joly, two years into her surprise cabinet appointment, proved mostly empty of substance and devoid of anything new. Lots of generalities and bromides, though, and a hint of uncorked idealism from an old bottle.
You can follow the speech on CPAC, here:
CPAC
Delivered before an audience of the Economic Club of Canada in Toronto on October 30, the Minister began, necessarily, by reviewing Canada’s position on the war in the Middle East. Nothing new here. She described the horror of Hamas’ terrorist attack; affirmed Israel’s right of self-defence; emphasised the need to obey international law during the armed conflict; and stressed the importance of establishing a humanitarian pause or “truce” to allow much-needed aid into the Gaza strip. There was a little more punchiness in a reference to settler violence against Palestinians in the occupied West Bank, which she said must stop. There was no reference to a future plan for the region beyond embrace of a two-state solution.
Then she shifted gears, in and out of French, to the broader international threat environment. To set the scene she reached for a Madeleine Albright (former US Secretary of State) quote about international relations being more like a game of pool than of chess. Thanks, tips. Nothing from the storehouse of Canadian wisdom and experience on foreign affairs?
Joly talked about two guiding principles for Canadian foreign policy:
Defence of Canadian sovereignty
The conduct of pragmatic diplomacy
On the sovereignty theme, she promised that the long-delayed defence policy update will come out and prove Canada’s commitment to bolstering its military capacity. Over to you Minister Blair.
Joly briefly reviewed the geographic compass point in an upbeat fashion. The moderator afterwards called this an “optimistic outlook.” To put it mildly.
Looking to the south she said Canada would work with the US on border security and immigration. (That’s it?)
To East, across the Atlantic, Joly claimed Canada as a reliable NATO partner and strong supporter of Ukraine. Nothing about what the future might hold; nothing about support for a Ukraine peace plan; nothing about Putin’s Russia.
To the West, Joly affirmed the Indo-Pacific strategy, with a bit of a twist, suggesting the emphasis should be on closer ties with two key Asian states, Japan and South Korea. The current friction between Canada and India, and reduced hopes of an Indian connection as a counter-weight to China, was described as a “moment in time.” The clock might stretch on that one, Salvador Dali fashion. On relations with China—zero, baby.
Where Joly went further was in regard to the Northern compass point. She promised that Canada would safeguard the Arctic and exercise sovereignty, without saying anything about how. She said Canada will make the necessary investments to ensure economic development in the North, again nothing on how. Easy talking points. She promised that Canada will work with the Nordics and the US on Arctic issues. No mention of the future of the Arctic Council or what to do about Russia as a key Arctic power.
Joly then turned to democratic protections and promised strong defences against foreign interference, surprisingly without mentioning her own department’s leading role in countering disinformation.
She did say a ‘Foreign interference Transparency Registry ‘was coming, misnaming it a “Foreign actor” registry. But this is in the purview of the Minister of Public Safety, Dominic Leblanc. So a promise she can’t deliver on.
Joly committed to sending foreign diplomats who engaged in foreign interference packing. OK, let’s see some action on that front with regard to the Russians, and a little quicker and more decisive action when news surfaces of Chinese diplomats’ meddling.
But the best of a badly under-cooked speech was left for last.
Joly tackled the theme of Canada’s approach to pragmatic diplomacy. Actually, she turned the concept on its head and talked about an idealistic policy in which Canada would perform as an independent honest broker in global affairs, avoiding any tendency to see the world as divided into two camps (heaven forbid not democracies versus autocracies, nor like-minded economies versus unfriendlies). For guidance she turned to the work of Pierre Elliot Trudeau, suggesting that his legacy was to keep allies close but to ensure Canada stayed open to different global perspectives. That might sound good as a distant lesson from the Cold War (if true—I leave that to Trudeau pere scholars), but it is far from a pragmatic response to the current divides in international relations and far from an embrace of the reality that the international system has reached, as she said (quoting from her boss, quoting from Joe Biden), an “inflection point” in terms of the threats facing it.
Perhaps the most quotable quote from the speech was Joly’s insistence that “I am a door opener, not a door closer.” Wow, is that what Canada has become? A flunkey in the service of an outmoded idea about Canada’s role in the world?
The counter to the Joly speech and pragmatic diplomacy
Dominic Raab MP is a former foreign secretary and deputy prime minister
The West faces a reckoning with realism
We have re-entered an era of balance of power geopolitics. But it is not the same as Henry Kissinger’s touted pre-First World War paradigm
www.telegraph.co.uk
Both Raab and Joly are keen on pragmatism and engagement but I suspect that the pair of them are approaching the table from different sides.
Raab seems to be more firm on national self-interest.
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…but there may be times when Kumbaya is a valid method…maybe…sometimes…once?
quadrapiper
Sr. Member
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Haiti, as an alternative national offering to getting mired in a fractally messy deployment.…but there may be times when Kumbaya is a valid method…maybe…sometimes…once?
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