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I‘ll answer your question if you can honestly tell me if you‘ve done a search on this forum first.
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That is a good side splitter. I think the the bureaucrats should check their patriotism. Have you ever tried to apply for the Public Service. Their are boxes on applications to check off for females, visible minorities, people with disabilities and first nations. How loyal are they to veterans. Nadda... I think Ottawa should practise what they preach. The private frims are more loyal to their troops than than Ottawa.
I have deleted alot of what I wanted to say, but lets just say that Ottawa is the group that is not being loyal in my opinion.
:rocket:
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Your are kidding right QY Rang.
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kiltedtradesman I think you should include what you deleted. I‘m kinda interested.
I meant budget per solider obviously. Getting more money then an entire element would be ridiculous. Sometimes good opinions come from members who may accidently present their thoughts poorly.
I‘m using an example of an individual soldier. It‘s hard to speculate since I‘m far from being in the position of such a member but I think there is an appeal towards being highly trained and getting to actually use that training. That may play a bigger part than money.
I‘m using an example of an individual soldier. It‘s hard to speculate since I‘m far from being in the position of such a member but I think there is an appeal towards being highly trained and getting to actually use that training. That may play a bigger part than money.
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Gibson said:
Key point - getting to use it...
You can make $70k a year ('ish) have a donut eating competition at the Trout Farm, or leave and get $982 US a day tax free (and more) and do the job (similar) you trained for.
The gov't is losing its best and brightest to CP duty due to most don't want to rust. Now I am not speaking for all - but I talked to afew when I was on disembarkation in Ottawa and those I talked to all urged me to go private, rather than go do "6 easy days ;D - as one calls it) for selection and then the SOAC.
Two Months in Iraq and you got your annual salary in USD - tax free... Some of the companies out there are much more individual oriented than the CF - 2 months hot zone - 1 month off with ~5kUSD holiday pay for that month...
Cheers
Kevin
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can't spend it if your dead
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"and lower end ones"
ding ding
no air support
no medivac
no back up
ding ding
no air support
no medivac
no back up
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I am not going to say that the PMC route is a "good thing" or a "bad thing". Each to his (or her) own, based on skill-sets, life circumstances, opportunities (read money), etc.
What I will say is that not all PMCs are created equal. I STRONGLY caution any member of this board against signing on with anything less than a fully-accredited and credible PMC for overseas work. I am old and wise enough to know that the business spans the spectrum between "cannon fodder" and "high threat but low risk". If you can't differentiate between the two, then you are the former just waiting for a body-bag.
I know for a fact that there are several upstart Canadian "companies" scraping warm bodies off of Reserve Armoury floors with the lure of "big bucks". If you are so inclined, then fill your boots. But you had better ask a whole bunch of questions before you sign on as a "rental" with such an organization. Unlike the established international agencies that have been in the business for many a year, most of the Canadian agencies are decidedly "low-rent". Above and beyond the (perhaps attractive) pay, ask about your life and disability insurance coverage, the provision of weapons and personal equipment, about the living conditions, the company history, about the operating environnment, the minimal hiring prerequisites (do you want to be paired with a numpty yahoo?) and on, and on, it goes.
I'm not saying that the PMC route is a bad thing. What I am simply suggesting is that for the vast majority who frequent this board, it is a "rambo dream". And for those who actually have the training and experience to make a go of it, the scene is fraught with danger and disappointment.
At the end of the day, if a company is actively recruiting on public forums such as "Lightfighter.com", "Assault.web", or any other public-acess board, then you are well advised to steer a wide berth. If you are serious and think that you have the requisite parts, then you ought to talk to KevinB and a few others who are connected to the business and understand the skit. And by "parts" I don't mean immature bravado. I mean folks who have actually faced fear and performed despite the loaf in their trousers.....
What I will say is that not all PMCs are created equal. I STRONGLY caution any member of this board against signing on with anything less than a fully-accredited and credible PMC for overseas work. I am old and wise enough to know that the business spans the spectrum between "cannon fodder" and "high threat but low risk". If you can't differentiate between the two, then you are the former just waiting for a body-bag.
I know for a fact that there are several upstart Canadian "companies" scraping warm bodies off of Reserve Armoury floors with the lure of "big bucks". If you are so inclined, then fill your boots. But you had better ask a whole bunch of questions before you sign on as a "rental" with such an organization. Unlike the established international agencies that have been in the business for many a year, most of the Canadian agencies are decidedly "low-rent". Above and beyond the (perhaps attractive) pay, ask about your life and disability insurance coverage, the provision of weapons and personal equipment, about the living conditions, the company history, about the operating environnment, the minimal hiring prerequisites (do you want to be paired with a numpty yahoo?) and on, and on, it goes.
I'm not saying that the PMC route is a bad thing. What I am simply suggesting is that for the vast majority who frequent this board, it is a "rambo dream". And for those who actually have the training and experience to make a go of it, the scene is fraught with danger and disappointment.
At the end of the day, if a company is actively recruiting on public forums such as "Lightfighter.com", "Assault.web", or any other public-acess board, then you are well advised to steer a wide berth. If you are serious and think that you have the requisite parts, then you ought to talk to KevinB and a few others who are connected to the business and understand the skit. And by "parts" I don't mean immature bravado. I mean folks who have actually faced fear and performed despite the loaf in their trousers.....
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I would say that the one Canadian company safe to deploy with is an outfit called "Globe Risk" out of Toronto.
The owner, Alan Bell, is the real McCoy and can be depended on to put you in a good group of guys over there...If...you measure up to his rather demanding standard for BG in that area. I'm not sure if he has an organization over there or if he is merely placing guys in the M.East. either way he is connected in the area.
Slim
The owner, Alan Bell, is the real McCoy and can be depended on to put you in a good group of guys over there...If...you measure up to his rather demanding standard for BG in that area. I'm not sure if he has an organization over there or if he is merely placing guys in the M.East. either way he is connected in the area.
Slim
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It's the same thing that the RCMP faces. It's called "The Brain Drain". For many people in the CF, there is a need to put to use the skills that they have been trained for. A good example is our ERT Teams. I am in Prince George, and while our ERT Team is heavy on training, they are very light on calls. That's why we have a big turnover rate with the local Team. Many of the transfers are guys wanting to go to a place where they will get more operational deployment.
I don't know what the right answer is. I think if they want to go, let them. If it's not money, something else may have lured these people away in any event. You want a person to stay for the right reasons (patriotism, brotherhood, etc..), ot because he/she is able to make more money somewhere else.
That ends my two cents....
I don't know what the right answer is. I think if they want to go, let them. If it's not money, something else may have lured these people away in any event. You want a person to stay for the right reasons (patriotism, brotherhood, etc..), ot because he/she is able to make more money somewhere else.
That ends my two cents....
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Mark C said:
I think Mark C had identified the key point here. As good as reservists do considering their relative circumstances, I would not feel comfortable being thrown into a maelstrom with the level of training the CF reserve system is able to provide. Remember, the professional PMC's usually hire experienced SNCO's and Officers (meaning long service in leadership positions), guys with SOC unit background and/or real operational backgrounds.
If a company is putting out casting calls on public forums for guys with DP2A (support weapons) and a good mix of Class A and Class B experience, I'd avoid it like the plague. As tough as a guy may think he is for doing BIQ in Wainwright (trust me, I was there at one point and thought I could take on the world), the business end in places like Iraq is far over the abilities of a part-time soldier.
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My understanding Glode Risk was UK based...
Regardless, for example; Triple Canopy is the ONLY - touch wood - close protection, training and threat management org in Iraq that has yet to lose a contractor - why? They hire Tier 1 pers - have demanding training, have USSOC assets that assist them, do realistic site surveys, equip teams VERY effectively. They also have lower skill sets TierII SOF and LE troops to do other jobs.
Blackwater, Custer Battles and other orgs are fairly convervative on who they hire as well.
Simple problem is that ONE specific entity that is NOT very detailed on who they hire and what jobs they take (and there are some un-realistic security gigs out there...) is amasing the largets percentage casualities.
Now $982 USD is a lot per day - but unless I know that I have a SF medic on the team and a 160th SOAR bird that will do under fire extraction of wounded principle and/or protective assets - there is not a lot of faith that you will be able to spend it.
Similarily while in Afghan I ran into an old acquaitance who had spent a period in an African jail - simply for he was in the wrong spot at the wrong time and his company crumbled and the gov't locked up the white mercenaries until their families ponied up a lot of cash to free them...
Now for those who are not SOAC grads and want to help their resumes - Blackwater, Triple C and many others offer Exec Protec courses down in the US that can help Infanteers get some skill sets to get them off the cannon fodder list and into a higher group where there can be more sure of their surroundings... Do you really want to work for a unit that issues AK's has nto standard weapons testing etc? However even prior to some of those course they will want you to have some formal pistol and carbine courses (i.e. outside the CF box trg)
IIRC The Shooting Edge in Calgary also hosts the Globe Risk courses.
Regardless, for example; Triple Canopy is the ONLY - touch wood - close protection, training and threat management org in Iraq that has yet to lose a contractor - why? They hire Tier 1 pers - have demanding training, have USSOC assets that assist them, do realistic site surveys, equip teams VERY effectively. They also have lower skill sets TierII SOF and LE troops to do other jobs.
Blackwater, Custer Battles and other orgs are fairly convervative on who they hire as well.
Simple problem is that ONE specific entity that is NOT very detailed on who they hire and what jobs they take (and there are some un-realistic security gigs out there...) is amasing the largets percentage casualities.
Now $982 USD is a lot per day - but unless I know that I have a SF medic on the team and a 160th SOAR bird that will do under fire extraction of wounded principle and/or protective assets - there is not a lot of faith that you will be able to spend it.
Similarily while in Afghan I ran into an old acquaitance who had spent a period in an African jail - simply for he was in the wrong spot at the wrong time and his company crumbled and the gov't locked up the white mercenaries until their families ponied up a lot of cash to free them...
Now for those who are not SOAC grads and want to help their resumes - Blackwater, Triple C and many others offer Exec Protec courses down in the US that can help Infanteers get some skill sets to get them off the cannon fodder list and into a higher group where there can be more sure of their surroundings... Do you really want to work for a unit that issues AK's has nto standard weapons testing etc? However even prior to some of those course they will want you to have some formal pistol and carbine courses (i.e. outside the CF box trg)
IIRC The Shooting Edge in Calgary also hosts the Globe Risk courses.
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Gunsite has a good rep here in the Southwest, for firearms courses - in case you want to advance your education in a warmer climate ;D
www.gunsite.com
We also have a real good custom ammo shop here - have actually seen some Canadians mentioned in their endorsements..
Arizona Ammunition
www.gunsite.com
We also have a real good custom ammo shop here - have actually seen some Canadians mentioned in their endorsements..
Arizona Ammunition
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I'm writing this from Iraq. I manage a security contract.
The $1,000 a day man is largely hype. PSC wages have come down and in my opinion they will drop further. There are lots of people with lots of actual experience in country to chose from and clients have got smarter. Many firms have realized that a good ex infantryman can do a fine job and that they don't need to pay SOF guys a premium.
A PSD team member should expect to make about $ 120,000 USD for a year's contract. It's good money but there is considerable risk involved. The money is fine but probably not if you must give up a pension to get it. You also usually only get paid only if you work so in the lvery ong run you may not make as much as if you stayed in the army.
The jobs tend to be boring with brief interludes of intense readiness, confusion and sometimes drama. PSDs are guaranteed to get shot at at some point.
The PSCs vary in quality and business acumen. Many run by ex SOF operators have been incompetent, corrupt and /or criminal. Some are cowboys and some professionally run. My advice is stay away from US firms. Most PSCs are run on military lines but the only discipline tool available is dismissal and some organizations have been plagued with problems.
With all this said I wonder why a JTF 2 member would leave to come here. Perhaps things aren't as satisfying there as one would think. It could be the grass is just greener. I'll soon see as we have a few of the lads recently joined up.
The $1,000 a day man is largely hype. PSC wages have come down and in my opinion they will drop further. There are lots of people with lots of actual experience in country to chose from and clients have got smarter. Many firms have realized that a good ex infantryman can do a fine job and that they don't need to pay SOF guys a premium.
A PSD team member should expect to make about $ 120,000 USD for a year's contract. It's good money but there is considerable risk involved. The money is fine but probably not if you must give up a pension to get it. You also usually only get paid only if you work so in the lvery ong run you may not make as much as if you stayed in the army.
The jobs tend to be boring with brief interludes of intense readiness, confusion and sometimes drama. PSDs are guaranteed to get shot at at some point.
The PSCs vary in quality and business acumen. Many run by ex SOF operators have been incompetent, corrupt and /or criminal. Some are cowboys and some professionally run. My advice is stay away from US firms. Most PSCs are run on military lines but the only discipline tool available is dismissal and some organizations have been plagued with problems.
With all this said I wonder why a JTF 2 member would leave to come here. Perhaps things aren't as satisfying there as one would think. It could be the grass is just greener. I'll soon see as we have a few of the lads recently joined up.
