Edmonton International vs Namao

[Paul Gagnon]

I'm not sure if this is the right forum.

Seems to me that the current mission to Afghanistan adds even more emphasis to the foolishness of closing Griesbach, turning Namao into an Army base. Are the runways and hangars still there? How hard would it be to start using it as an Air Force base again? There's enough land to fill both roles and it sure would make transporting troops and equipment easier.

 

[Zoomie]

Check it out on google earth - the army has built buildings on the runway...

 

[exsemjingo]

I guess by using it as an air-force base, you mean flying army equipment out of Namao directly?  Griesbach occupies some prime real-estate right now.  The money the government makes by developing it is worth the cost of additional buildings at Namao.  Plus, at only 1 mile square, Griesbach could fit well inside Namao.
Even though they built on the runway, there is enough space at Namao that they didn't have to.  That is the real issue.

 

[D3V1L6]

The money required to reconstruct and maintain a new airforce base in Edmonton (Namao) is definately not worth it anyways.  We dont have enough troop/cargo lift capabilities or traffic to validate spending that kind of money on Namao.  Working out of YEG seem to be working just fine.

 

[Teddy Ruxpin]

The "Army" didn't build any buildings - DND did.  The Army was moved to Edmonton for purely political reasons by the Liberal government of the day.

The runway is long enough that the buildings on the north end aren't a major issue.  However - and it is a big "however" - the rest of the runway has had nothing in the way of maintenance for over 10 years.  The lighting system has been removed and there are no hangers (aside from 408 Sqn lines, of course).  This may change with the arrival of new helicopters, but even then the infrastructure won't be designed for use by heavy aircraft.  It would cost millions to bring up to a state where CC-130s could be landed in Namao.  YEG isn't the best solution, but as D3V1L6 indicates, it works.

Griesbach is done.  The land was sold years ago and new houses have gone up on much of the former base.  As it was, the infrastructure there was rotting - to the point where many of the old buildings were simply torn down.

 

[mover1]

NASA wasn't too impressed with it. According to urban legend the Namao AIrfield was an alternate for the space shuttle.

But why live in the past. You have two airports in the city, YEG and YED plus YOD is only a short hop north of there. 

 

[Paul Gagnon]

I'm not living in the past, just wondering out loud if the infrastructure was still in place. Regardless of the civilian airports in Edmonton I think  that there is still a need for an Air Force base in Edmonton but is there the political will or the money?.  Most of the base closures in the '90's were purely political ( I have a theory too but don't want to look like Mel Gibson )  and every time I drive past one of them it brings all sorts of memories back and is kind of depressing to see that they are gone, even the ones I had never gotten too when I was in.

 

[TCBF]

If you are wondering why a 14,500 foot B-52 capable runway - funded by the US taxpayers - was closed so hard they built buildings on it, you might want to ask why.  There was more than enough room in the three or so sections of land to the south to build a brigade barracks, but that would leave the runway in useable condition.  A runway which would provide much closer service to Edmonton than EIA (Edmonton Intl) does in Nisku.  EIA may have seen  a business case threat, and may have ensured that, if the former RCAF Namao was ever turned over to Canada Lands like Griesbach Barracks was, that the runway would not pose an economically viable threat.

Strategic loss?  Sure, but the Yanks have closed dozens of B-52 bases since the 60s.

Did the last Air Force commander of CFB Edmonton really become a bigwig at EIA after he retired?  I think that is a totally unfounded rumour.

 

[exsemjingo]

I'm not living in the past,

C'mon, Edmontonians love to do that.  Santa Rosa road, anyone?  How 'bout that railway bridge between 107th street and 121st on Yellowhead that goes nowhere?  There is nothing better than knowing about that kind of stuff.

every time I drive past one of them it brings all sorts of memories back and is kind of depressing to see that they are gone, even the ones I had never gotten too when I was in.

I like what they've done with Greisbach.  There is a statue now, interpretive displays, and roads with military names.
Much better than a collection of derelict old buildings.  Good for the Cf's image too.

 

[Paul Gagnon]

C'mon, Edmontonians love to do that.  Santa Rosa road, anyone?  How 'bout that railway bridge between 107th street and 121st on Yellowhead that goes nowhere?  There is nothing better than knowing about that kind of stuff.I like what they've done with Greisbach.  There is a statue now, interpretive displays, and roads with military names.
Much better than a collection of derelict old buildings.  Good for the Cf's image too.

I've only lived here for two years so I  don't know if I qualify.   There were a lot of crappy old buildings at Griesbach but there were other bases that were (fairly) modern and still ended up being closed,  Chilliwack for example. I don't know if people might think I'm a kook but I sometimes get the feeling that the bases in the heart of the cities were closed to get the military out of the view of the public. Out of sight out of mind. Once the public doesn't care anymore it makes it easier to cut and cut and cut.

 

[exsemjingo]

Good point.  When's the last time we've had a public parade down mainstreet, other than on Remembrance day?  We may be fighting all over the world, but the real enemy of the Canadian way of life is the apathy and ignorance of it's citizens.

 

[aesop081]

I've only lived here for two years so I  don't know if I qualify.   There were a lot of crappy old buildings at Griesbach but there were other bases that were (fairly) modern and still ended up being closed,  Chilliwack for example. I don't know if people might think I'm a kook but I sometimes get the feeling that the bases in the heart of the cities were closed to get the military out of the view of the public. Out of sight out of mind. Once the public doesn't care anymore it makes it easier to cut and cut and cut.

The base in Greisbach was decrepit. I know , i lived on it.  Just about everything was falling apart and going to waste.  The land was worth a fortune for developement in a major city.  The best thing that could happen to CFB Edmonton was to get rid of Greisbach.  Infrastructure money could be used to support Namao instead. Closing Chilliwack was a crying shame, i am atached for the restof my life to that place but with today's budgets, was it realy neccessary to keep and maintain all that for 1 regiment and 2 schools ? When they closed the Kapyong barracks in Winnipeg, was that some consipracy or just moving an army unit to and army base where it would have the training areas it needed ? ( i know its not a popular move) !7 Wing is still the in the city after all.

 

[Kat Stevens]

The base in Greisbach was decrepit. I know , i lived on it.  Just about everything was falling apart and going to waste.  The land was worth a fortune for developement in a major city.  The best thing that could happen to CFB Edmonton was to get rid of Greisbach.  Infrastructure money could be used to support Namao instead. Closing Chilliwack was a crying shame, i am atached for the restof my life to that place but with today's budgets, was it realy neccessary to keep and maintain all that for 1 regiment and 2 schools ? When they closed the Kapyong barracks in Winnipeg, was that some consipracy or just moving an army unit to and army base where it would have the training areas it needed ? ( i know its not a popular move) !7 Wing is still the in the city after all.

CFB Chilliwack was closed for one reason only:  Because the residents of the Fraser Valley had the unmitigated gaul to NOT vote Liberal in the previous federal election. Full stop.

 

[aesop081]

CFB Chilliwack was closed for one reason only:  Because the residents of the Fraser Valley had the unmitigated gaul to NOT vote Liberal in the previous federal election. Full stop.

Kat, i know, i know......

 

[Paul Gagnon]

The base in Greisbach was decrepit. I know , i lived on it.  Just about everything was falling apart and going to waste.  The land was worth a fortune for developement in a major city.  The best thing that could happen to CFB Edmonton was to get rid of Greisbach.  Infrastructure money could be used to support Namao instead. Closing Chilliwack was a crying shame, i am atached for the restof my life to that place but with today's budgets, was it realy neccessary to keep and maintain all that for 1 regiment and 2 schools ? When they closed the Kapyong barracks in Winnipeg, was that some consipracy or just moving an army unit to and army base where it would have the training areas it needed ? ( i know its not a popular move) !7 Wing is still the in the city after all.

Yeah Griesbach needed to go or have a major cash infusion. How much money did DND get for that land, the traditional $1?
Being a Vancouver based reservist I spent a lot of time at Chilliwack. It was very important for all of the units in the Lower Mainland as a training area and even though we were 100 km away it was our base too, in fact Jericho (which is now just a shell) was officially considered a detachment of Chilliwack. The training areas are (mostly) still there but all of the support system is gone, the RCMP have taken over some of the buildings and there is some sort of high school there too.  I was in Nova Scotia last year and drove through Cornwallis. It was my fisrt time visiting there. I was shocked to see that it's become mostly an industrial park with nary a monument to all of the thousands of recruits that went through there. It was depressing.

 

[exsemjingo]

How much money did DND get for that land, the traditional $1?

There is a government of Canada logo on the ads for new houses, so it looks like someone in government is making money on it.
Is it the DND?  That could take some research to find out.

 

[aesop081]

There is a government of Canada logo on the ads for new houses, so it looks like someone in government is making money on it.
Is it the DND?  That could take some research to find out.

Canada Lands Corporation

 

[exsemjingo]

Canada Lands Corporation sells the land, but who keeps the profit?  If the crown corporation formed to sell crown land keeps all the money, then it may as well be sold for a dollar only.

 

[aesop081]

Canada Lands Corporation sells the land, but who keeps the profit?  If the crown corporation formed to sell crown land keeps all the money, then it may as well be sold for a dollar only.

I would think it gets lost in general revenue