Close Combat Vehicle: Canada to buy another AFV (& keeping LAV III & TLAV)

[LordOsborne]

I read up about the Puma on Wikipedia and a few other open-source defence sites, and it looks like the turret is designed to accomodate a Euromissile Spike-LR ATGM. I'm going along with what Infanteer said WRT the cannon, namely that we'd probably swap the 30mm for our 25mm. Would it be logical to assume we'd do the same with the ATGM armament; ie, use TOW-2 instead of Spike? If we did that, would it make our LAV-TOW obsolete? 

 

[Pencil Tech]

Wow, it seems just like yesterday everything was going to be wheeled.  :

 

[retiredgrunt45]

Wow, it seems just like yesterday everything was going to be wheeled.

Seems our experience in Afghanistan changed some minds.

Of course there is a use for each type, but a track is much more versatile but the con is it's more maintenace intensive to maintain a set of tracks opposed to a set of wheels.

I've driven both and I believe in the Superior versatility and mobility of a tracked AFV over a wheeled, even with the added maitenance there are still more advantages to using a track. I know you really can't compare the old Grizzly or cougar to the LAVIII, but the concept is still the same.

But at the moment it's still only a pipe dream, so i'll beleive it when I see it happen.

 

[Tow Tripod]

Lets just hope that the PUMA doesn't have the same track pad idea as the M113. In Croatia we would do 8 hours of maintenance for a 8 hour patrol. Lets have a change track pad afternoon/night!!! I do like the idea of a 30mm cannon.Make it big.Would anyone have any pictures of the inside of this vehicle??

TOW TRIPOD

 

[George Wallace]

Lets just hope that the PUMA doesn't have the same track pad idea as the M113.

Not a 'Track Guy' are ya.  The PUMA probably has the German Diehl Track, just like the M113 and Leopards.

Obviously you have never worked with the old American and British Track that had 'Drift Pins',  Now that track really sucked.  So don't complain.

 

[Rodahn]

Obviously you have never worked with the old American and British Track that had 'Drift Pins',  Now that track really sucked.  So don't complain.

Thanks for the memories George........

 

[LordOsborne]

Lets just hope that the PUMA doesn't have the same track pad idea as the M113. In Croatia we would do 8 hours of maintenance for a 8 hour patrol. Lets have a change track pad afternoon/night!!! I do like the idea of a 30mm cannon.Make it big.Would anyone have any pictures of the inside of this vehicle??
TOW TRIPOD

German-language picture info page on the Puma:

http://www.rommelkiste.de/Fahrzeuge/Puma/Puma.html

 

[Teddy Ruxpin]

Ya know, I'm "interested in" Angelina Jolie...doesn't mean she'll go out with me though...

Let's all say it together..."TLAV"...live it, learn it, love it...

 

[Haletown]

related . . . .  article on TLAV/IFV armaments.

http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk/WLIP.htm

 

[Nfld Sapper]

Lets just hope that the PUMA doesn't have the same track pad idea as the M113. In Croatia we would do 8 hours of maintenance for a 8 hour patrol. Lets have a change track pad afternoon/night!!! I do like the idea of a 30mm cannon.Make it big.Would anyone have any pictures of the inside of this vehicle??

TOW TRIPOD

IF we get them we would probably have the new inservice track installed (depending on the weight of the vehicle)

 

[vonGarvin]

Stats on the Schützenpanzer Puma
Gross weight:  41 tonnes
Length: 7.4 m
Width: 3.7 m
Height: 3.1 m
Engine: 800 Horses
Speed: 70kph (forward), 30 kph (reverse)
Crew: 3 (veh) 6 (GIBs)
Turret: unmanned, remote controlled, hunter killer capability (IMHO, "very nice" - in best Borat voice, naturally)
Main armament: Mk 30-2/ABM, 30mm
Ammo: 30 mm APFSDS-T, and KETF "Air burst" with time fuze
Secondary armament: MG 4, 5.56mm and 76.2 mm Grenade launchers
To me, it sounds as though it were designed with the Leo 2A6 in mind:
Leo:
Weight: 62.3 tonnes
Length: 7.7 m
Width: 3.7 m (sound familiar?  If not, look up)
Height: 3.0 m

 

[Nfld Sapper]

Stats on the Schützenpanzer Puma
Gross weight:  41 tonnes
Length: 7.4 m
Width: 3.7 m
Height: 3.1 m
Engine: 800 Horses
Speed: 70kph (forward), 30 kph (reverse)
Crew: 3 (veh) 6 (GIBs)
Turret: unmanned, remote controlled, hunter killer capability (IMHO, "very nice" - in best Borat voice, naturally)
Main armament: Mk 30-2/ABM, 30mm
Ammo: 30 mm APFSDS-T, and KETF "Air burst" with time fuze
Secondary armament: MG 4, 5.56mm and 76.2 mm Grenade launchers
To me, it sounds as though it were designed with the Leo 2A6 in mind:
Leo:
Weight: 62.3 tonnes
Length: 7.7 m
Width: 3.7 m (sound familiar?  If not, look up)
Height: 3.0 m

Hmm.... seems the new inservice track can hold the weight of a Puma

 

[ironduke57]

Stats on the Schützenpanzer Puma
...
Width: 3.7 m
...
To me, it sounds as though it were designed with the Leo 2A6 in mind:
Leo:
...
Width: 3.7 m (sound familiar?  If not, look up)
...

Not really. Both where designed to be transportable by train in there basic version without problem. (That the don´t get stuck in Tunnels or hinder another train on neighboring tracks.)

Regards,
ironduke57

 

[vonGarvin]

Not really. Both where designed to be transportable by train in there basic version without problem. (That the don´t get stuck in Tunnels or hinder another train on neighboring tracks.)

Regards,
ironduke57

Well, that is my point exactly.  When we were acquiring the Leo 2A6, I was invovled in a staff discussion about modifying existing hangers (which were designed for the Leo C1).  When I told my tanker friends that they were virtually the same width, I was almost laughed out of the room, until the armour corps Major said "Yeah, you're right.  It's all about the trains, right?"  I simply nodded.  Even though my detractors suggested that part of the 20-some tonne mass difference would account for a much wider tank, I simply pointed out that the Leo 2A6 was probably a bit longer, and the turret was certainly MUCH larger than that on the Leo 1, thus accounting for the majority of the mass difference.

I wonder if the tracks are the same width, thus making mine breaching a bit simpler?

 

[McG]

Hmm.... seems the new inservice track can hold the weight of a Puma

Which track are you thinking of?  The only new track that I am aware of is the TLAV and MTVL rubber tracks (and last I heard only the TLAV track was deployed).

Not really. Both where designed to be transportable by train in there basic version without problem. (That the don´t get stuck in Tunnels or hinder another train on neighboring tracks.)

There's a standard NATO template that goes with that too.

 

[McG]

I wonder if the tracks are the same width, thus making mine breaching a bit simpler?

No.  That's why there is the mine plough extension mini-project.

 

[ironduke57]

... "Yeah, you're right.  It's all about the trains, right?"  I simply nodded.  ...

Bit OT: The funny thing is that normal (western) railway width goes back to the roman chariot´s and so it´s basicly the width of two horse ass´s.  ;D

SCNR,
ironduke57

 

[vonGarvin]

Bit OT: The funny thing is that normal (western) railway width goes back to the roman chariot´s and so it´s basicly the width of two horse ass´s.  ;D

SCNR,
ironduke57

That is common for most new technologies.  They go with what they know!  LOL
Now, about the Puma.....

Puma is german for cougar, no? ;D

 

[ironduke57]

Yes.

Regards,
ironduke57

edit: Fascinating how much attention this topic got.

 

[Edward Campbell]

Bit OT: The funny thing is that normal (western) railway width goes back to the roman chariot´s and so it´s basicly the width of two horse ass´s.  ;D

SCNR,
ironduke57

I know, and waaaaaay back when I served with both of them.