Challenger/"VIP" Jet/CF Chopper Use (CDS, others) [merged]

[Edward Campbell]

James Cudmore from the CBC had a great, factually correct report early yesterday morning about the whole situation- so there is good reporting going on.

Maybe James Cudmore, who comes here, now and again, under his own name, to ask a question, is in the 0.5% to which alluded above.

 

[OldSolduer]

On the other hand, this has distracted everyone from a Parliamentary Secretary having an affair with a foreign intelligence agent, so from certain perspectives, it's all good.

Oh how true is that!! 

It seems financial "prudence" has taken the place of national security.

 

[The Bread Guy]

James Cudmore from the CBC had a great, factually correct report early yesterday morning about the whole situation- so there is good reporting going on.

Good to see - let's hope his editorial bosses run the story into the lead position in the newscast.  Or maybe even on the web page.

 

[cupper]

Why would you even mention that and possibly sidetrack this thread? If you're that interested, start another topic in the appropriate forum.
Milnet.ca Staff

The point is that the whole issue is cutting back on spending, and that the petty nickel and dime-ing about the legitimacy of the CDS's travel expenses, then we find out that there doesn't seem to be the same calling into question about the taxpayer picking up the tab for passports for the PM's family. Yes I can see the PM's cost being paid for, but other members of the family should be paid for by the PM.

The CDS cancels vacation plans and loses the money he shelled out so he can stay behind and perform a duty most Canadians would say was expected as part of the job description of as the military head of the CF. Yet he's expected to pay for the cost of alternate travel arrangements.

It's all about all pigs being equal, but some pigs are more equal than others.

 

[ModlrMike]

...stay behind and perform a duty most Canadians would say was expected... wouldn't have the courage to...

Fixed that for you.

 

[Edward Campbell]

Here, according to the Globe and Mail is what PM Harper had to say today, during Question Period:

'On the current controversy surrounding Gen. Natynczyk, NDP defence critic Jack Harris asked why the general had been allowed to take flights worth more than $1-million in the nearly four years he had headed the military – many of them on Challenger jets reserved for government VIPs.

Mr. Harper, who met with Gen. Natynczyk on Monday, said the military chief understands the rules for taking government jets “and is certainly prepared to live according to those rules. The Chief of the Defence Staff does fly very frequently on government business, but obviously where there are alternatives, we will look into that usage.”'

It's not exactly a stonewall defence.

 

[Old Sweat]

However it does allow the CDS to pay the commercial rate back to the government, and then claim his lost flight. Or something else comes up and the media ride off braying into the sunset.

At least it's not the King Hussein defence.

 

[aesop081]

Smells like 1993.........

 

[Remius]

It's a half *ss defense at best.  He's done better with his own incompetent ministers who have done far worse.  I realise the press is looking for a story.  But I don't know who I'm more pissed at.  the media, the people swallowing it or the PM's weak defense of him.  this man deserves better than this.

 

[cupper]

It's telling that CBC is doing a better job at coming to the defense of the CDS than the PM is.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2011/09/19/pol-challenger-natynczyk.html

Then again, Harper has never been known as a eloquent speaker. Maybe something got lost in translation between brain and mouth.

(But I don't think so)

 

[Zoomie]

... about the taxpayer picking up the tab for passports for the PM's family. Yes I can see the PM's cost being paid for, but other members of the family should be paid for by the PM.

Just to help keep this topic on the rails - I'll help squash this right now.  Diplomatic passports are paid for by the Crown - for all members of the family.  My entire family has green passports - of the new E-passport style - paid for by the Crown.  We are not expected to purchase official passports.

 

[ModlrMike]

So after spending the weekend putting the knife in his back, the press is now trying to take it out?  :facepalm:

 

[Good2Golf]

So after spending the weekend putting the knife in his back, the press is now trying to take it out?  :facepalm:

In fairness to the CBC (in particular James Cudmore's rather balanced reporting) , it was CTV that was leading the charge, primarily guided by the duo of Kevin Newman and Craig Oliver.

Regars
G2G

 

[cupper]

Just to help keep this topic on the rails - I'll help squash this right now.  Diplomatic passports are paid for by the Crown - for all members of the family.  My entire family has green passports - of the new E-passport style - paid for by the Crown.  We are not expected to purchase official passports.

My bad.

 

[GAP]

both Liberals....(in answer to G2G's comment)

 

[Remius]

And yet the liberal defense critic is the one defending him. Dogs are meowing cats are barking...

 

[Edward Campbell]

And yet the liberal defense critic is the one defending him. Dogs are meowing cats are barking...

See my comments from a couple of days ago:

I think we need to realize that Challenger use/cost is always an issue and a good story. Gen Natynczyk is a well known public figure - better known that many (most?) cabinet ministers. Mix a well known guy, with a reliable 'news' story, add a good solid dose of "gotcha journalism", and then add just a pinch of anti-military bias and you have the Good Grey Globe's story.

It's just "gotcha" journalism ... maybe with a hint from one of Gen Natynczyk's enemies (and he certainly has some, I would imagine). Journalists don't care about public money, they don't care about public duty, they just care about getting ahead in their own little, incestuous hothouses.

 

[Good2Golf]

And yet the liberal defense critic is the one defending him. Dogs are meowing cats are barking...

Yes, John McKay actually appeared the voice of reason with his comment noted in James Cudmore's CBC piece:

"If the plane is sitting on the ground, nothing's happening with the plane. It’s still a cost to the taxpayer and the irony of the whole thing is that if he in fact books a commercial flight, it’s actually adding to the cost to the taxpayer," McKay said...

Regards
G2G

 

[ballz]

So according to the 2,630/hr figure, that $1 million dollars just became $263,000... over 3 years... so $87,667/year....

Even if it what he did WAS costing the taxpayers *extra* money by doing it this way, $87,667 a year for PROFESSIONAL purposes is pennies.... actually about 25 pennies per Canadian citizen... :boring:

 

[Retired AF Guy]

It's just "gotcha" journalism ... maybe with a hint from one of Gen Natynczyk's enemies (and he certainly has some, I would imagine). Journalists don't care about public money, they don't care about public duty, they just care about getting ahead in their own little, incestuous hothouses.

So true. People forget that media organizations are just another business and with an eye on the profit margin. The goal is to outsell the competition by selling as many newspapers/getting air time, etc, as they can. So, if a journalist reporter comes up with a  hot story that sells, more money in the coffer, the shareholders are happy, the reporter gets a bunch of attaboys, maybe a bonus and hopefully down the road a promotion . That is the bottom line.