Army Communication & Information Systems Specialists (Sig Op, Lineman and LCIS Amalgamation)

[c_canuk]

It's not so much that, than it is a crippling lack of drive and ability to get things done at a certain rank level.

i.e. This has been ongoing since 2008. It took 6 years to get the paperwork submitted (potentially to be sent back again on review) and 8 to get back to where we started. It only took 6 years to fight WWII.

It's staggering, the level of inaction on what we'd been ensured was a high priority item. The CAF in general, Sigs in particular cannot properly project manage because of crippled leadership. They aren't alone though, Gun Control registry, Phoenix and SSC are other high profile projects that are a nightmare. It's a symptom of our current culture where virtue signalling, claimed effort, and buzz word regurgitation is all that matters, results don't. At least for some at the top end of the spectrum.

Don't rock the boat, be a team player, don't resist change, these are the current mantras used to shut up people who are problem solvers. They aren't wanted anymore. They bring people down and self esteem is considered the most important aspect of today's society. That good self esteem comes from accomplishment is ignored. Hence the ever rising levels of disenfranchisement and malaise of the younger generations.

but that's just my curmudgeonly rant for the day...

 

[BigDaddyFatback]

It's not so much that, than it is a crippling lack of drive and ability to get things done at a certain rank level.

i.e. This has been ongoing since 2008. It took 6 years to get the paperwork submitted (potentially to be sent back again on review) and 8 to get back to where we started. It only took 6 years to fight WWII.

It's staggering, the level of inaction on what we'd been ensured was a high priority item. The CAF in general, Sigs in particular cannot properly project manage because of crippled leadership. They aren't alone though, Gun Control registry, Phoenix and SSC are other high profile projects that are a nightmare. It's a symptom of our current culture where virtue signalling, claimed effort, and buzz word regurgitation is all that matters, results don't. At least for some at the top end of the spectrum.

Don't rock the boat, be a team player, don't resist change, these are the current mantras used to shut up people who are problem solvers. They aren't wanted anymore. They bring people down and self esteem is considered the most important aspect of today's society. That good self esteem comes from accomplishment is ignored. Hence the ever rising levels of disenfranchisement and malaise of the younger generations.

but that's just my curmudgeonly rant for the day...

I wish there was a like button I could click on this post. Well said. Pretty much sums up how I think the rest of the world operates in this day and age. Rant on!

 

[Drew Grey]

Been looking into this trade for awhile now and was wondering if there are any specialists on this site? Is it a interesting job? How do you like it?

 

[c_canuk]

At the Pte - MCpl Level, it's generally very interesting technical work, with lots of opportunity to deploy. Above that and you get mired in bureaucracy and start looking for the exit.

 

[PiperDown]

The latest update ( earlier this month) is that the CDS has rescinded of the decision to put former LCIS techs in the standard pay group.
No word on when spec pay will resume, or if there will be back pay ( back pay was in the request sent to the CDS just no clarification on the update sent ).

 

[ringo598]

Not sure if anyone outside of JSR has seen it either, but we had some people from Ottawa come and give us a brief.  Apparently there is a "problem" (Their words, there was even a problem paper already completed) with ACISS and the trade setup is being reviewed, they had lots of interesting slides on possible outcomes, such as IST & CST becoming one trade, or the trades being separate instead of sub-ocs and so on.  They have a + box on the GAL for people who want to submit comments to them which I completely forget but I'm sure can be found easily enough.

The Maj & MWO doing the brief advised they'd be going out to the other main signal units and doing the powerpoint presentation there as well.

As well, this was passed to me and its semi recent (May 2016) and is a somewhat interesting read about the official grievance about the pay review (Not sure if already posted but here you go):  http://mgerc-ceegm.gc.ca/rec/145-eng.html

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Bear in mind, there is no time line for the FA to decide on a grievance.  Hopefully this works out IAW the F & R.

 

[PiperDown]

Well folks,

It only took 5+ years, but the end is near !

** Sent on behalf of Col Sullivan **

CDS Order 050/16 directs that the decision to assign ACISS in its entirety to the Standard Pay Group be rescinded and former LCIS Tech is to be allocated to the Spec 1 Pay Group.  As this is a rescindment of the original decision it in essence has the effect of nullifying the decision, in effect making it as if the decision had not been made.  Therefore the effective date of the pay group assignment is 1 Oct 2011.  This direction only addresses the issue of those former LCIS Techs who essentially had a pay freeze implemented as of 1 Oct 2011.  It does not address the pay evaluation of the current ACISS occupation. The work on the revised pay evaluation process continues inside DPPD.  The formal pay evaluation of the ACISS occupation in its entirety remains linked to the completion of this work.

Director Pay Policy Development (DPPD) advises that the pay adjustments are projected to be complete by the last pay period of January 2017.

This is great news for our soldiers who are former LCIS Techs.

Please disseminate within your areas of responsibility as necessary and appropriate.

**end**

 

[PuckChaser]

Glad it worked out in favour of the technicians. Will have to find another button to grind their gears with now.

 

[RedMan]

Glad it finally got sorted out for those who were QL5 LCIS! About damn time! Co-worker (who falls under this) just told me about this.

I assume this does NOT apply to any who were LCIS, had POET, but got sucked into CST before they were able to do QL5 LCIS by Oct 1 2011 (they had to do ACISS DP2.1, like myself)....?

So the MCPL and above CSTs who were QL5 LCIS are going to be VERY happy......

....but you still have an awful lot of people who joined as LCIS, and got screwed over in every way possible. All the worker bee techs are going to be even more pissed now.


Hopefully, it won't take too long to at least give THEM a final answer, so they can "plan for THEIR future".

Even on the blue side, things move at a slow pace....it's only taken 1.5 years since I OT'd to ATIS for me to get on QL3      Still don't regret my decision.

Congrats on the big pay day guys!

 

[c_canuk]

"Hopefully, it won't take too long to at least give THEM a final answer, so they can "plan for THEIR future"."

Don't count on it; I was at a town hall/study meeting a few weeks ago.

Apparently they can't describe to DPPD what we do based on sub trade yet, and are waiting to figure out what to do with CISTM before resubmitting.

Basic delineations and descriptions of AORs between the trades was presented as a 5 year problem.

This won't be resolved until an outsider forces them to do it. There are too many politics at the deciding level. If an outsider forces the issue I assume it will be DPPD getting sick of waiting and just listing us all as standard pay group.

 

[mapledonutmouth]

Hey guys,

So I have been digging through the forums for anything related to cyber security, and to my disappointment most of them were just filter matches and none of them really in-depth about job opportunities. Onto my question; are there any cyber security related positions in the CF?

I have some IT certifications that focus on cyber security, which I talked about in this thread. I've applied to become an ACISS. It would be great if I could become an IST, even better if I could be placed in some sort of security related position. From doing some searching, I haven't discovered any specific cyber security related positions. Also, from what I understand, the CAF wasn't exactly the most "up-to-date" when it comes to technology until a few years ago.

I'm also aware that the RMC hosts a sort of CTF/Cyber Challenge every year. But do ISTs receive some sort of standard security related training? If they don't, then are the troops that participate self-taught? Or is it possible to dive into a cyber security field once you're an IST?

Also in the thread I listed above, there was a comment about the creation of Cyber Division. Does this mean that cyber security is going to become a "thing"? It's probably always existed, but it sounds like it's become such an elite position.

TL;DR I applied to become an ACISS. I have security-related certifications. I'm wondering how cyber-security works in the Forces.

 

[PuckChaser]

Anything involved in how our cyber defenses work would be classified. There is plans moving forward to create a cyber warfare unit, and perhaps a trade, but its no where close to being approved.

Cyber will become a "thing", sometime between now and 20 years from now. Signallers are the pers typically tasked with the defense of DND networks.

Be prepared to wait a while, and keep yourself up to date on skillsets until the trade/unit/group is formed.

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

Why not go for the big leagues?

https://www.cse-cst.gc.ca/en/careers-carrieres

 

[mapledonutmouth]

Why not go for the big leagues?

https://www.cse-cst.gc.ca/en/careers-carrieres

It would be great, but I'm still fresh out of high school and I don't have the education or experience to jump straight into the big leagues.I was just wondering if the opportunity was there because I have some IT certifications that are focused on security.

 

[mapledonutmouth]

Anything involved in how our cyber defenses work would be classified. There is plans moving forward to create a cyber warfare unit, and perhaps a trade, but its no where close to being approved.

Cyber will become a "thing", sometime between now and 20 years from now. Signallers are the pers typically tasked with the defense of DND networks.

Be prepared to wait a while, and keep yourself up to date on skillsets until the trade/unit/group is formed.

I understand that cyber defense is probably a well-kept secret for all of its topics, but is there a possibility you could progress from an IST and move towards a security related position? I'm not talking about becoming the next big hacker - anything related, whether it be auditing, pen-testing, developing, etc.

 

[George Wallace]

It would be great, but I'm still fresh out of high school and I don't have the education or experience to jump straight into the big leagues.I was just wondering if the opportunity was there because I have some IT certifications that are focused on security.

OK  ???

First step in any "security related job" is suspicious mind.  You have listed a fairly long list of credentials and now you claim to be fresh out of High School. 

Something does not pass the smell test.

 

[mapledonutmouth]

OK  ???

First step in any "security related job" is suspicious mind.  You have listed a fairly long list of credentials and now you claim to be fresh out of High School. 

Something does not pass the smell test.

What do you mean "fairly long list" of credentials? All I have are 2 entry level IT certifications I did during the summer, and I am working on completing a more advanced one right now. Even in my other thread, I stated that I have only the certifications with no job experience. And now that you mention it, I don't think "fresh" was a good word to describe my status. It's going to be about a year since I graduated.

 

[LCISALCpl]

I was somewhat in your position 15 years ago when I joined as an LCIS tech with just a high school diploma. Now I am an ACISS-IST with a strong background in networking/cyber security.

I'll try to be as open as possible with you here. You will need to be very patient if you choose to join the CAF as ACISS right now. The kind of work you are looking for is usually only offered to members starting at the rank of Cpl (which may take you between 3-4 years to get to). There is also no guarentee that you will get to make a seamless transition from ACISS Core to ACISS-IST (though this process is getting better). Expect to do a fair bit of training/gruntwork and very little cyber during this time.

Assuming you can put up with all that. There is a Cyber trade that just got approved last year. I have very little information on this but I can guess that it will only accept OTs (occupation transfer) from the ACISS-IST, ATIS, Navv Comm, and Comms Rsch trades to start out. They would most likely be working out of the Canadian Forces Network Operations Centre which google can tell you more about that I can.

So your best bet to become a Cyber security guy with the CAF is to have a 5 year plan involving some mixture of what was described above and have the patience to see if the stars align for you.

Alternatively you could go work for CSE but there is a strong chance they would require you to have a University Degree or equivalent experience before applying. So you are looking at 5 or so years either way .

Good luck!

 

[mapledonutmouth]

I was somewhat in your position 15 years ago when I joined as an LCIS tech with just a high school diploma. Now I am an ACISS-IST with a strong background in networking/cyber security.

I'll try to be as open as possible with you here. You will need to be very patient if you choose to join the CAF as ACISS right now. The kind of work you are looking for is usually only offered to members starting at the rank of Cpl (which may take you between 3-4 years to get to). There is also no guarentee that you will get to make a seamless transition from ACISS Core to ACISS-IST (though this process is getting better). Expect to do a fair bit of training/gruntwork and very little cyber during this time.

Assuming you can put up with all that. There is a Cyber trade that just got approved last year. I have very little information on this but I can guess that it will only accept OTs (occupation transfer) from the ACISS-IST, ATIS, Navv Comm, and Comms Rsch trades to start out. They would most likely be working out of the Canadian Forces Network Operations Centre which google can tell you more about that I can.

So your best bet to become a Cyber security guy with the CAF is to have a 5 year plan involving some mixture of what was described above and have the patience to see if the stars align for you.

Alternatively you could go work for CSE but there is a strong chance they would require you to have a University Degree or equivalent experience before applying. So you are looking at 5 or so years either way .

Good luck!

Yeah, I now understand that I'll need to spend some time inside to get an opportunity for a security position. I'm not joining solely to become a cyber security guy though, I was just looking for any ways to improve a transition to one. But for most people who make it into a security role, did they do any sort of training outside the Forces?