All things GPS (recommendations, tips, etc.) - merged

[RHFC_piper]

I'm sure just about every soldier here, regular or reserve, has used the issued pluggers (GPS) and knows just how useless they are.

Granted, there will be a few of you out there who will say that they are very usefull if you know how to use them, but a)Compared to civilian models, with easier usability, more clear and concise GUI's (graphic user interface), longer battery life, smaller size and comperable durability, the CF pluggers are junk... and b) I've never known any soldier, regular or reserve, who have been able to use pluggers properly, and this includes the JTF guys I've worked with.

This said, I'm looking to buy a civilian GPS unit for when I deploy on Op Archer, and I need some advice on models / makes. I'm sure there are a few of you out there who have had great success with Civi GPS units and may even have taken them on tour...

I've done a little research on the subject and I'm currently looking to buy a Garmin etrex Summit GPS (http://www.garmin.com/products/etrexsummit/index.jsp)..

If anyone has any other suggestions, they would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

 

[PPCLI MCpl]

All the Etrex are outstanding.  An alternative is the Garmin Geko 201.  It is smaller, cheaper and does everything a soldier could ask.  It's only drawback is that it operates on AAA batteries.

 

[RHFC_piper]

All the Etrex are outstanding.   An alternative is the Garmin Geko 201.   It is smaller, cheaper and does everything a soldier could ask.   It's only drawback is that it operates on AAA batteries.

Wow.. Fantastic... The Geko is tons better.

Cheaper and lighter... http://www.mec.ca/Products/product_detail.jsp;jsessionid=D7J6sYS11tyNR21FNnZGm27yQpVJnFp2wwnJL1xYBpvnRQbg7v6W!188688341?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524442501161&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374302696155&bmUID=1132185978286

The only negative differences are the batteries, which I could care less about, since my mp3 player and digi camera both work on AAA, and the battery life, which is a difference of 4 hours (12 insted of 16), but I don't think that matters so much.

Thanks PPCLI MCpl .

anyone else have any better suggestions?

 

[Kat Stevens]

It doesn't really matter if you're off to the sandbox, but the lower end Garmin units get crap signal under any kind of cover, ie tree canopy.  The Magellan units are similarly priced, get much better signal reception, and comparable bells and whistles.  They also "learn", where the Garmins rely on pricey software to get any real detail in their mapping units.  All this is just my opinion, but I've used both, and my Garmin is sitting in a drawer with the batteries out.

 

[PPCLI MCpl]

The main problem with AAA's is that they wear out faster and are difficult to obtain through the system.

 

[ZipperHead]

The Summit is quite good. A big part of the GPS is the software/applications you get for it. The maps are expensive, but worth it if you have a mapping GPS. I would highly recommend buying Oziexplorer (link: http://www.oziexplorer.com/ ). The beauty of this software is you can load in scanned maps (any map for that matter), calibrate it, and you are good to go in planning out routes, WP's, etc. It doesn't upload the map, however, to your GPS. You can also get a 3D add-on to it, and once you download the elevation data (found on gov't sites), you can create 3D maps. Pretty cool. Steep learning curve for both programs, but worth it. Anyone interested can PM me for assistance.

If you upgrade the basic version of Google Earth to Plus ($20 US per year), you can get GPS support, and that is one kick-ass program, if you've never used it (the free one that is - hesitant to commit $20 to try it out to find it may be no better than Oziexplorer for GPS support). If you have ever been to Gagetown (any area for that matter), zoom into the training area, change the vertical exagerration, tilt the map so you see the contours/elevations and do a fly-by of Bell Wood. The level of detail is unreal. You can actually see the bigger puddles of water.

BTW, I am very proficient at the PLGR, but that is from a lot of self-education, and teaching it a lot. It is difficult to learn, but keep in mind how old it is, and the MANY capabilities it has over a civvy GPS (crypto, interfacing with our equipment, ruggedness, etc). A good software program would do wonders to keep it current, but there are plans to field a new version in 2006 (IIRC). There are a few good training tools being produced to better educate pers on the use of the PLGR here at CTC, and if you have access to Documentum, they can be found there (if not right now, soon...... I am working in Trg Development for the Armour School and have seen the courseware, but not sure if it's "good to go" for consumption by the masses.... I can find out this week and advise when I'm sure).

If you get a GPS, it is something that you definitely have to "play" with to utilize it to it's max potential. Using it as a "you-are-here" device is OK, but you can do much more if you are willing to dive in and learn it. And spend money like a drunken sailor on the software that you need.....

Al

 

[GO!!!]

My Garmin Etrex has worked very well, and at 120$, no complaints.

 

[RHFC_piper]

The main problem with AAA's is that they wear out faster and are difficult to obtain through the system.

Well, according to the specs on both GPS units, the eTrex has a battery life (continuous use) of 16 hours and the Geko has 12 h... not that big a difference to me.
As for getting the batteries... Rechargable... I use them in my mp3 player and camera anyway.

The Magellan units are similarly priced, get much better signal reception, and comparable bells and whistles.  They also "learn", where the Garmins rely on pricey software to get any real detail in their mapping units.  All this is just my opinion, but I've used both, and my Garmin is sitting in a drawer with the batteries out.

I've looked at Magellan and haven't found a model I like (bells and whistles) that isn't out of my price range. (up to $300 / preferably $200).

Can you suggest a model?

and have you ever used a Magellan on deployment / Ex / rugged conditions?  if so, how did it compare to the Garmins?

The Summit is quite good. A big part of the GPS is the software/applications you get for it. The maps are expensive, but worth it if you have a mapping GPS. I would highly recommend buying Oziexplorer (link: http://www.oziexplorer.com/ ). The beauty of this software is you can load in scanned maps (any map for that matter), calibrate it, and you are good to go in planning out routes, WP's, etc. It doesn't upload the map, however, to your GPS.

Is there software that does load maps on to GPS... for a reasonable price?

btw.  Thanks for all the other info.


... Now there's going to be 3 more replys... bugger....

must... absorb... more......   info....

 

[Kat Stevens]

http://www.magellangps.com/en/products/product.asp?PRODID=90

give that try, a little steep, but when you consider that my E trex legend, out of the box is nowhere near the unit this one is.  I have both, by the way. For 200 bills, I'm afraid you're not going to get everything you want.

 

[RHFC_piper]

http://www.magellangps.com/en/products/product.asp?PRODID=90

give that try, a little steep, but when you consider that my E trex legend, out of the box is nowhere near the unit this one is.   I have both, by the way. For 200 bills, I'm afraid you're not going to get everything you want.

For the most part, this has all the same features the Garmins have... but its more expensive...

This one gets better reception? how is it better?

 

[ZipperHead]

I did a quick Google search, and this is what I came up with: http://gpsinformation.net/usermaps.htm

The short answer is: no.

In the future, maybe. But I think that the big names (Garmin, Magellan) realize there is a lot of money to be had, so they will probably keep it proprietary so that you have to keep coming back to them for all the accesories.

Here is a link I found in my search for some of the links I list below: http://www.keenpeople.com/index.php?option=articles&task=viewarticle&artid=4&Itemid=3 I hope you have a lot of time on your hands if you try this method  ;D

Keep in mind, even with the maps, the detail isn't stellar on the GPS itself (due to resolution, limited memory capacity (for the moment) of most GPS, though some have expandable memory, etc). A big part of what you need the GPS for drives what "bells and whistles" you need. Face it: you will probably have a topo map with you anyway, so do you need that level of detail in the GPS? Probably not. If you splurge on software, do all your route planning on a computer, upload the WP's and routes into the GPS that way (far easier than entering them manually, BTW), and then use the GPS as it is usually used: "you-are-here", time to go x minutes, speed y km/h, direction z mils/degrees, etc. You can change the screens (what is displayed) fairly easy to your own liking, and there are "hacks" for some different set-ups out there (use at your own risk). One thing that I don't recommend getting as an extra (unless you really, really, really want it) is the digital compass feature (which works while the GPS is stationary, as opposed to calculating your direction from positional updates while on the move). While it seems good in theory, in practice it is nowhere as accurate as one would like (off by a minimum of 50mils, up to 200+ mils). Unless I'm totally out of 'er, I've never got the compass to be very accurate (yes, I calibrated it). If you want an accurate bearing, use a "normal" compass (which you should have as a backup anyways, as batteries always die, but the magnetic north pole will always be there.....).

Watch out for the high cost of accesories (Wal-mart has the best prices on the little stuff, like cables, cases, mounting brackets, etc). Try these sites for Canadian prices on kit: http://www.gpscity.ca/ http://www.canadagps.com/ http://www.gpsmart.ca/

Anyway, hope that helps, and for god's sake, make sure you buy/use a lanyard. I lost my first GPS because I didn't secure it to my vehicle, and I have heard of more than a few guys losing their expensive "toys". I know of a guy who found one in Kosovo, so someone's loss was his gain....

Al

 

[Kat Stevens]

It can't locate the signal from the satelites when under any kind of overhead cover, I know, I've got one.  In front of me right now I have an older Magellan Meridian GPS, and a Garmin E-Trex legend, both turned on.  The Magellan knows exactly where I am, the Garmin is having a brain embolism.  The Meridian will accept a memory card, the Garmin will not.  In order to get the garmin to do what the Magellan does out of the box, I need to spend an additional 200-300 bills for all the Garmin software... Your call...Hope this helps

Edited to add:  GPS City is a veritable Ali Baba's cave of GPS info...

 

[RHFC_piper]

It can't locate the signal from the satelites when under any kind of overhead cover, I know, I've got one.   In front of me right now I have an older Magellan Meridian GPS, and a Garmin E-Trex legend, both turned on.   The Magellan knows exactly where I am, the Garmin is having a brain embolism.   The Meridian will accept a memory card, the Garmin will not.   In order to get the garmin to do what the Magellan does out of the box, I need to spend an additional 200-300 bills for all the Garmin software... Your call...Hope this helps

Edited to add:   GPS City is a veritable Ali Baba's cave of GPS info...

Okay... there's a selling point. 

Well now I have a lot to consider.  Thanks for all the info, everyone.

 

[Jarnhamar]

I have the The Magellan Meridian GPS and it's great.
My GPS seemed to be a lot faster at finding it's position than guys using the garmin. The "WAAS Compatibility" thing seems to make it very fast and accurate. I know some GPS has it and some don't. A garmin GPS that didn't took 3 times as long to "find us"

I think it's the higher end of the Magellan series. Lots of little functions on it and with the street map softwhere it's great when your lost or even trying to find an actual address. Hell it had some of the black tracks in petawawa and range roads on it.

Disadvantages I find with it,
-Size. It's kinda big, I wouldn't mind finding a smaller GPS. This one has way more functions than i actually need.
-No topigraphical maps. This model doesn't have the ability to accept topigraphical maps.   Honestly I'm not sure how important this really is in a GPS but i figure it should still be a handy function and I'd like to get a GPS that accepts topo maps.

For those two reasons i've been looking at the garmin legend. The legend has WAAS i believe, it's smaller and it accepts topo maps as far as i know. It's also cheaper than many of the merdians.   My mistake was deffinatly getting wrapped around "more expensive is better" & all the bells and whistles.

One last disadvantage of my GPS is that because it's a little older, the PC cable used to recieve your mapping softwhere is old. It's not a USB port but one of the older ones. I need to boot up my old desk top to connect the cable. I'm sure newer ones all have USB connectors though.

Hey, wanna buy a Magellan Meridian?    ;D

Edit:
Just rereading some posts.
The point about not operating under cover is a good one. Also having topo on a GPS probably isn't the end all be all of requirements since you should have a map with you.
Does the legend have a built in compass like the meridian?

 

[dw_1984]

I recently bought an Etrex Summit and it works fairly well...haven't really done any field stuff w/ it though.

WAAS - IIRC, all of the Etrex line have WAAS now.  Before the non-mapping units (original, summit, venture) did not have WAAS.  All non-mapping units were upgraded last year to have multiple tracks, more waypoints and WAAS (might be more but I don't recall).  Check the software version number and Garmin website for more details.

Compass - All GPS units have some sort of quasi-compass but only works when travelling (measuring bearing from one point to another).  These will not work like a traditional compass in a stationary way.  Certain GPSs have a true compass.  In the Etrex line, the Summit, Vista and VistaC are the only ones w/ a real compass.

USB - The newer colour Etrex (VistaC, LegendC) have USB connectivitiy.

 

[ZipperHead]

Ref the compass: there is one Magellan GPS with a very good digital/electronic compass built in (don't remember the model). It gives you the ability to plot/shoot/gain a bearing with the GPS in pretty any position, whereas the other models make it so the GPS has to be pretty much level (horizontal) to get an accurate bearing. It's the way that the antenna is designed, IIRC.

I used to figure out a bearing (rough....very rough) with the PLGR when carrying it by extending it away from me as far as I could and then reading the bearing given (as the PLGR computes the bearing by direction change, so it isn't really a compass, more of a calculator). It was a quick and dirty way to get going in the right direction: it beat walking 20 - 30 metres, or around in circles, like I have seen many people do.

Regarding the USB connectivity, I discovered the hard way that most new laptops don't have serial ports (d'oh!!), but a serial-USB adapter can be had for $30-35 at Radio Shack (I know it changed names, but can't recall the new name). The Source????

Al

 

[Big Foot]

Allan, it is The Source now. I dunno what it is but the name change seems to have brought better service. Maybe it's just my imagination.

 

[ZipperHead]

As long as they stop their policy of hiring only pimply faced, unshaven basement dwellers, wearing the cheapest polyster shirts available. Man, talk about a true stereotype.....

Al

 

[dw_1984]

Ref the compass: there is one Magellan GPS with a very good digital/electronic compass built in (don't remember the model). It gives you the ability to plot/shoot/gain a bearing with the GPS in pretty any position, whereas the other models make it so the GPS has to be pretty much level (horizontal) to get an accurate bearing. It's the way that the antenna is designed, IIRC.

Most GPS compasses are 2-axis compasses.  You must hold them horizontal.  The one that you can hold in any position is a 3 axis compass.  I believe you are talking about the Magellan eXplorist 600. http://www.magellangps.com/en/products/product.asp?PRODID=1073

 

[Gayson]

Radio Shack in Canada is called the source now.

Circuit City bought Radio Shack Canada, but kept the Radio Shack name for a while.

The US Radio Shack sued Circuit City (I suppose they bought the stores but not the name) so they renamed it to the source.

The Source was the name of the flier/magazine Radio Shack Canada used to mail out.

I own the Magellan Meridian.  It's awesome.

It floats, its green and brown (NOT BRIGHT YELLOW!).

I have it set to display 6 finger MGRS (can go up to 10) on the 2 datums CF maps use simultaneously.