AESOp ( MOC 081)

[Sub_Guy]

I will try to answer a few questions.

6) When it comes to who is ground crew, and who is air crew, how is that decided? Is that merit and seniority, or just a rotation?

This is accomplished with a simple measurement, those who are "short changed" are relgated to the ground crew, and those "gifted" personnel are sent to the air.    AES Op's are always considered Aircrew, there are a few postings where you could be chained to a desk, but these usually happen later in your career, you can expect your first posting to be to an operational sqn.

As for preference, you can ask for a particular airframe, but like all other trades in the CF, you are sent where you are needed.

Opportunities to deploy are abundant, I know around here (407 Sqn), there is always something going on.  There always seems to be an aircraft away doing something.

Average work day consists of  training, there is always something to read, learn, and teach.  This trade is not for lazy individuals who lack drive.

Negatives of the trade, I can't really think of any.  (Greenwood comes to mind though....)

 

[aesop081]

how much is accommodated?

None.

4) Are there opportunities to deploy outside of Canada on Operations, 

I didnt spend allot of time in Canada during my time on Sqn. Dolphin_Hunter can attest to that !!

6) When it comes to who is ground crew, and who is air crew, how is that decided?

I don't understand what you are talking about !

 

[Sub_Guy]

I didnt spend allot of time in Canada during my time on Sqn. Dolphin_Hunter can attest to that !!

We worked together?

 

[aesop081]

We worked together?

You didn't notice because i was never there  ;D

 

[Duke878]

Ive read on afew threads regarding AES Ops, saying "too bad you got selected for MH" Whats the problem with MH vs LRP? is it the less desired side of the trade?

Also with the new Cyclones coming out (soon-ish), will there be more opportunites for new guys DE or transfering into the trade to get those qualifications?

According to the CF recruiting video, the AES Ops interviewed say that you will be dually trained  on both platforms. This true? Can someone check out the video and HONESTLY tell me what is misleading or inaccurate about it? 

Many thanks!

 

[aesop081]

is it the less desired side of the trade?

No. Just some good natured trash talk thats all.

Also with the new Cyclones coming out (soon-ish), will there be more opportunites for new guys DE or transfering into the trade to get those qualifications?

There is nothing to increase. You get qualified Cyclone if posted to a unit that flies Cyclone. Thats it.

According to the CF recruiting video, the AES Ops interviewed say that you will be dually trained  on both platforms. This true?

Some guys do LRP and MH, some guys do only LRP or MH. Thats only a factor of where the postings and career progression falls. Also, there is more to the trade than just LRP and MH thus there are other avenues of career progression. You will certainly not fly both MH and LRP at the same time. If you are flying, its either the CP-140 or the CH-124/148...........you will not be qualified on both at the same time and jump back and forth from one day to the next. You may end up flying both during a career but you could olso fly only one and branch out in other areas of the trade.

 

[Duke878]

Just to clarify, a newly qual'd AES Op would be posted on the West Coast or East Coast for the first postings or so, correct? The Operators from the recruiting video ustve been instructors at the school.. right?

Also, how long are postings and what are secondary tasks or jobs for an AES Op?

Thanks again for answering my many questions. Esp CDN Aviator

 

[aesop081]

Just to clarify, a newly qual'd AES Op would be posted on the West Coast or East Coast for the first postings or so, correct?

Typically, new graduates have posted to either coasts. Most into flying jobs but a few went to ground tours initially as the trade grew (this is not ideal but the jobs need to be done and are important). Few stayed at the school to serve as instructor.

Also, how long are postings

Around 3-4 years but it varies greatly these days.

and what are secondary tasks or jobs for an AES Op?

This varies from unit to unit.

 

[NavyIntO]

Quick Question: Exactly how mathematical is being an AESOp when compared to an ACSO? I'm not the strongest in the majority of mathematics (Trigonometry is my strong-point).

 

[Duke878]

For postings, you said they are 3-4 years in length. Does that mean every time you get a new posting, you have to move around?

For a spouse with a career (teacher) is there any assistance from MFRC in helping to get a job or employment in her field?

For new guys entering an operational wing, what's the soonest you could expect to be deployed?

Thanks for the info again!

 

[aesop081]

For postings, you said they are 3-4 years in length. Does that mean every time you get a new posting, you have to move around?

Depends where you end up. It could be 3-4 years them off to a new base or, just a change of unit on the same base every few years. If you in Greenwood for example, you can spend years just going from one unit to the other.

That being said, moving around the country every 3-4 years is a reality.

For a spouse with a career (teacher) is there any assistance from MFRC in helping to get a job or employment in her field?

Not much, if any.

what's the soonest you could expect to be deployed?

Could be right away, could be any time. Theres no answer to that.

 

[Duke878]

I know you're pretty much at the whim of the air force and you go where you are needed, but is there a way to stay in one place at a time for more than 4 years? Like im sure the wing doesn't do a whole change of crews every four years.  I mean, the Air Force doesn't move you from one end of the country to the other every 4 years do they?

Also, are you able to deny deployments? I know some love it but you can't be deployed allll the rime, right?

Do you know anyone that used to be in the trade for 5-10 years, released, and have done something similar civy side?

Thanks for your info and patience!

 

[aesop081]

  I mean, the Air Force doesn't move you from one end of the country to the other every 4 years do they?

....and everything in between. Like i told you, in some places (like Greenwood and Shearwater) it is easier to stay longer as there are more units you can get moved around to. In Comox and Victoria, the places are limited so you have to move to other bases for career progression.

Also, are you able to deny deployments?

WTF ???

If you get posted to Sea Kings and refuse to sail on deployment, you career will be short. If you go to Aurora's and refuse to deploy, your career will be short.

Do you know anyone that used to be in the trade for 5-10 years, released, and have done something similar civy side?

Most that have moved on to similar civilian employment had much more time in the trade than that.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

I know you're pretty much at the whim of the air force and you go where you are needed, but is there a way to stay in one place at a time for more than 4 years? Like im sure the wing doesn't do a whole change of crews every four years.  I mean, the Air Force doesn't move you from one end of the country to the other every 4 years do they?

You're subunit is a Sqn, not a Wing.

I'll give you a few examples to add to what CdnAviator has said twice.  Hopefully they help you understand.

I know of a few folks that were posted to 443 Sqn (Victoria, BC) after Wings grad in Winnipeg, and then went on OTU at 406 Sqn (Shearwater NS) in 2009/2010, who then returned to Vic after OTU.  Last summer  they were posted from Victoria BC to 406 in Shearwater NS.  Yep, clear across the country.  And that was less than 3 years.  So you can see that some folks:

- went away to Wpg (6 months), then posted to Victoria BC
- sent to NS for course (6+months)
- back to Vic, into a Sqn position (that means on a HelAirDet and sailing when the ship does)
- then posted back to NS, in a relatively short timeframe.

Thats alot of time away from home, as your family doesn't follow you around until after you finished Winnipeg, and if you are posted West Coast, well you end up 6+months East Coast for your operational trg (no they don't get to go with you).  Then you go back West and could be deployed, well when they tell you that you are going.

Like Cdn Aviator said, it could depend alot on your initial posting.  The Operational Trg Sqn's are both located in NS (Shearwater for Maritime Helicopter, Greenwood for Long Range Patrol).  Each of those locations also have operational Sqn's, so it is possible if you are posted to Shearwater or Greenwood that you could go from an operational Sqn to a Trg Sqn for your "2nd posting".  In that situation, you wouldn't have a geographical move involved with the posting.  But there is no guaruntee you would get that, you could find yourself headed West for 2nd posting, or Winnipeg, Ottawa, etc.

I know of one person who was posted from BC to NS, and while on the first part of the road move from BC, got a call and was told his posting was changed to a 3rd location, and he stopped 'somewhere in between the 2'.

Don't bet on anything for certain, other than you WILL be posted and moving at some point.

 

[aesop081]

After my wings course i was posted to one base, moved there and 6 months later was posted again, to the opposite end of the country. i managed 6 years at that posting but the word "posting" had been coming up for the last 3 and didn't happen for a few operational and a few personal reasons. I will be in my current billet for 3 years and expect to move again after that time.

 

[Duke878]

^^^

Firstly I appreciate alot the info you and Cdn Aviator has given me. If I CT'd to this trade in the RCAF, I'm just trying to look at all aspects of this career choice. Pros, cons and everything in between. One of the biggest thing I'm trying to consider in this decision is the affect on my partner, her career and a possible family.  How does one manage?

As an army reservist, the biggest reg force exposure I have is my reg force counterparts. If they play their cards right, 85% of their career is at their regiment/battalion in the same city/location. So moving around alot is quite the opposite to what my impression would be.

In regards to deployments, I'm currently Finishing up My first and don't really want to deploy for half of my military career. But I guess it would be the nature of the beast. Don't get me wrong, I like deployments and it's one of the most important jobs in the CF. I'm just trying to think of the affect on my possible future family.

Thanks

 

[aesop081]

2011 saw me do the Following :

OP CARIBBE
A northern patrol
OP MOBILE
EX PANAMAX
OP CARIBBE.......again

That was all before posting season.

I was the only one qualified available so.............just imagine what would have happened if i had refused to go.

OP MOBILE......i was on the high readiness crew. We got zero notice to move. There was no saying " well...that doesn't work for me".

If you have an issue with being gone frequently, you're better off in some other trade.

 

[Zoomie]

I will be in my current billet for 3 years and expect to move again after that time.

Yup - that coincides nicely with the <move> to the former Nortel campus...

 

[aesop081]

Yup - that coincides nicely with the <move> to the former Nortel campus...

Nice try.

 

[Zoomie]

If you have an issue with being gone frequently, you're better off in some other trade.

The same can be said for most trades in the RCAF.  We move every 3-4 years and can expect no-notice deployments to appear overnight.

There are a lucky few who have remained sheltered in places such as Winnipeg, Greenwood, Halifax and Trenton.  They're the ones who complain the loudest when they are faced with the reality that the rest of us experience every 3-4 years.  A similar thing is happening right now in Ottawa with CANSOFCOM being told to get ready to move south - they're whining the loudest.