Defending Canadian Arctic Sovereignty

[Good2Golf]

Won't they all be working from home? Can never be too careful. Covid may make a comeback.

Too true! Of course they’d have a Workplace 2.0 cubicle in Pearson, but yes…Tweeting comfortably from home…IAW the proceeds from their recent strike…

 

[rmc_wannabe]

OK.....

HERE, for the record, "is the post-meeting statement of the Nordic Council meeting in Iceland, just completed, where Canada was a guest."

Nordic-Canada Prime Ministers meeting 2023

www.government.is

Who did that?

A lot of the statement was worded as "The Prime Ministers of the Nordic Countries and Canada agree...." on many points... except, notably:

Furthermore, the Nordic Prime Ministers discussed Nordic defense cooperation, which is being adjusted to the new security situation, aiming to fully realize its potential. This includes strengthening defense capabilities and the enablement of allied operations in the Nordic region.

PMJT must have popped out to the loo when that part was being drafted

 

[Good2Golf]

I guess the CIA report was spot-on about Trudeau then, taking a hard pass on supporting NATO’s goals…

 

[daftandbarmy]

A lot of the statement was worded as "The Prime Ministers of the Nordic Countries and Canada agree...." on many points... except, notably:



PMJT must have popped out to the loo when that part was being drafted

Given the Russian threat up north a critically important part of Nordic defence involves the projection of Naval power... with all our spare ships I guess

 

[Skysix]

 

[Kirkhill]

I find it difficult to accept the rather rosy gloss the Norwegians seemed to be putting on their analysis.

To my way of thinking Svalbard is to the Arctic what Crimea is to the Black Sea, Gibraltar is to the Med and Denmark is to the Baltic. It is the Gate Guard. Longyearbyen is 600 km from the Greenland coast and 1400 km from Alert. It is 1800 km from Qaanaaq (Thule). And Greenland is less than 30 km from Ellesmere Island with Hans Island sitting in the middle. And we are talking about ice here and not open water. Dogsleds cover the Iditarod's 1600 km at an average pace of 12 km/h for 8 or 9 days. Helicopters and snowmobiles are going to cover that ground a lot faster.

 

[Blackadder1916]

I find it difficult to accept the rather rosy gloss the Norwegians seemed to be putting on their analysis.

To my way of thinking Svalbard is to the Arctic what Crimea is to the Black Sea, Gibraltar is to the Med and Denmark is to the Baltic. It is the Gate Guard. Longyearbyen is 600 km from the Greenland coast and 1400 km from Alert. It is 1800 km from Qaanaaq (Thule). And Greenland is less than 30 km from Ellesmere Island with Hans Island sitting in the middle. And we are talking about ice here and not open water. Dogsleds cover the Iditarod's 1600 km at an average pace of 12 km/h for 8 or 9 days. Helicopters and snowmobiles are going to cover that ground a lot faster.

Such would only apply if NATO the world was in a state of war and all previous agreements went out the window. It does have the significant characteristic of being a large chunk of rock out where no one else is and some may want to move past it. However, the importance of Crimea (specifically Sevastopol) and Gibraltar was not just their location but that they were protected, deep water ports that were ideal spots to place major naval bases; Denmark, well, that was an entire country that was stuck in the way of everything that wanted to leave the Baltic. Svalbard, on the other hand, would require a massive infrastructure upgrade (in violation of the 1920 treaty, of which by way of extension Canada is a party) to turn it into a military asset. Even during the Second World War, the military importance of Spitzbergen, while not insignificant, was mostly limited to being a weather station.

 

[Kirkhill]

General agreement but I'm afraid that I have rather lost faith in the power of the written word. To wit the more recent Budapest Memorandum of 1992. Or for that matter Spain deciding that its 1713 accord with the UK is up for reconsideration. Or Argentina and the Falklands.

As to Denmark, there is an argument to be made that a whole nation formed from the tribes that stuck themselves on the sand bars at the mouth of the Baltic precisely because they could benefit from controlling the local trade. The Dutch, Norwegians and Swedes have all thought it would be great if they owned it instead.

The hydrologic history of the Baltic, Jutland and Skane is fascinating. (Tangent Alert).



People have been living on that now you see it now you don't land for all of that time. Sealers and Reindeer Hunters occasionally inundated by tidal waves and volcanic ash from Iceland and suffering from earthquakes. Truly a land of Fire and Ice or Ragnarok.

For reference

Canada in the same time scale



Gobekli Tepe in Turkey was built 11,500 years ago and abandoned 10,000 years ago.

 

[Kirkhill]

Lots of good sledding there. Has been for best part of 30,000 years.

Dogsleds cover the Iditarod's 1600 km at an average pace of 12 km/h for 8 or 9 days.

Distance from North Pole to southern edge of the snow line about 5000 km. Call it 4 Iditarods or a month.

Satellite data shows the maximum amount of snow across the Northern Hemisphere

Satellites show snow coverage at lowest levels in 45 years - UPI.com

Snow cover in Earth's Northern Hemisphere is shrinking with the level last June the lowest since satellite observations began 45 years ago, researchers say.

www.upi.com

While it's thought that domesticated dogs and dog sledding played an important role in the lives of Arctic peoples for at least 15,000 years, some of the earliest archaeological evidence for sled dog use in the Arctic stems from a 9,500-year old site located on what is now Zhokhov Island in the East Siberian Sea.

Modern Day Sled Dogs Share A Common, Ancient Arctic Ancestor

Present-day sled dog breeds diverged from other dog lineages more than 9,500 years ago in Northeast Asia.

www.aaas.org

And they could carry their kayaks and umiaks with them on their sleds.

 

[KevinB]

Need analog nuclear arty up there incase all the GPS and SAC stuff goes down by 2150 or sooner. They could just walk in slowly.

What color is the sky in your world?

 

[medicineman]

What color is the sky in your world?

Likely the Kaleidosope from "Magic Carpet Ride"