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Surface Warfare Officer badge

Navy_Pete said:
Ugh, the coloured ranks comes up all the time, and I wish the idea would die in a fire. The Medical officers kept the red stripes at unification, but aside from the doc/dentist on the tanker, they aren't in the fleet, but at least it's a useful identifier for a medical type, similar to the red cross the medics wear.

There are only a few NTOs and LogOs on a ship, so really never was any confusion who was who when it mattered. It's also a small community, so generally you will know most people.

Instead of a single rank epaulet (that you can easily pass on to whoever when you get promoted) that would create four different epaulets for each rank . The SWO pins are stupid anyway, because there is never any real question if someone holds the qualification when it matters, but the coloured ranks to denote officer trades is equally stupid for the same reason.

If you want to go with industry standards, at least there is some similarity between trade badges and the colour codes most worksites use for different trades, but all the officers would be white helmets, regardless of occupation.

Really wish the badge and bow crowd would just sit the hell down with the shuffling of the deckchairs. If they are introducing new H&A for something that's overlooked, cool. If they are getting new functional equipment for wear, that's cool too, but it's ridiculous that I have a blue rain coat, modeled on the RN raincoat to be worn with either DEUs or work dress, that I'm not supposed to wear in DEUs if it's raining because some buttons and badge clowns think it's still the same yellow slicker.

The same people could be doing useful things, like contributing to review of the trade qualifications, updating training courses, etc. Failing that, they could just stand still and work on converting oxygen to carbon dioxide while staying out of everyone else's way.
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Pretty common on the merchant marine and CCG, purple is for engineers
 
TacticalTea said:
Allegedly Adm Baines' departure gift to the Navy.

I'll try to push Topshee to change the design 😅 (though I already poke him to eliminate the rank of ''Acting-sub-lieutenant'' every time we meet... my political capital reserves might be dry)
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How can a substantive rank have the word acting in it?

Also what if an Acting Sub-Lieutenat was acting as a Sub-Lieutenat? Or what if a Naval Cadet was acting a rank up, would they be an Acting Acting Sub-Lieutenat?

You boat people are weird.
 
Kilted said:
How can a substantive rank have the word acting in it?

Also what if an Acting Sub-Lieutenat was acting as a Sub-Lieutenat? Or what if a Naval Cadet was acting a rank up, would they be an Acting Acting Sub-Lieutenat?

You boat people are weird.
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To further confuse things, like how you're not supposed to say the "Navy" part of Lt(N) - e.g. "Lieutenant Bloggins", not "Lieutenant Navy Bloggins", you're not supposed to say the "Acting" part either.

So, "Sub-Lieutenant blahblahblah", not "Acting Sub-Lieutenant blahblahblah".

So @TacticalTea - what's your suggestion for replacing A/SLT? Ensign (like USN and RNZN)? Midshipman (which isn't really equivalent)? Something new?
 
Kilted said:
How can a substantive rank have the word acting in it?

Also what if an Acting Sub-Lieutenat was acting as a Sub-Lieutenat? Or what if a Naval Cadet was acting a rank up, would they be an Acting Acting Sub-Lieutenat?

You boat people are weird.
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Unification problem. Army, Airforce, Navy all had to align their ranks with each other for pay etc... its where A/SLt comes from. The Navy had to create a rank to match the 2Lt. But it actually started as an "acting" rank. For a while (up till about 2000 or so) you got backpay to SLt level for the entire time you were A/SLt. This also meant you were supposed to be called SLt not A/SLt on pipes or in conversation. That part has gone away though half the time as technically both are correct(ish).

And then there is the entire MCpl and MS gordian knot which I've never been able to untangle. Best I could understand was MCpl was an appointment and became a rank because the navy had MS. OR perhaps the navy had a MS appointment which became a rank and the army had to invent a rank to go in there. @Oldgateboatdriver I'm sure has explained this to us at some point.
 
dimsum said:
To further confuse things, like how you're not supposed to say the "Navy" part of Lt(N) - e.g. "Lieutenant Bloggins", not "Lieutenant Navy Bloggins", you're not supposed to say the "Acting" part either.

So, "Sub-Lieutenant blahblahblah", not "Acting Sub-Lieutenant blahblahblah".

So @TacticalTea - what's your suggestion for replacing A/SLT? Ensign (like USN and RNZN)? Midshipman (which isn't really equivalent)? Something new?
Click to expand...
The (N) was only to be used in written correspondence, but it has now morphed into being orated as well. I can somewhat understand saying you’re a “Lieutenant Navy” when with mud monkeys but it’s the height of redundancy when you’re in a group of a majority of RCN personnel. It’s becoming more and more common and I’d wish it would bloody well stop.

Back in the Middle Ages when I was failing to learn French at St Jean, we had a parade where the reviewing officer was CAPT Davey. The MC repeatedly called him “Captain Navy Davey”. After about the fifth time I wanted to yell, “We get it! He’s a naval Captain, now shut up!” But being a snotter I kept my mouth shut.
 
Last edited:
TacticalTea said:
Allegedly Adm Baines' departure gift to the Navy.

I'll try to push Topshee to change the design 😅 (though I already poke him to eliminate the rank of ''Acting-sub-lieutenant'' every time we meet... my political capital reserves might be dry)
Click to expand...
You are correct sir. There were many attempts on the 3rd Deck of Building 7 at Carling to kill the idea, but all attempts were rebuffed by the meat sack in the corner office.
 
Kilted said:
How can a substantive rank have the word acting in it?

Also what if an Acting Sub-Lieutenat was acting as a Sub-Lieutenat? Or what if a Naval Cadet was acting a rank up, would they be an Acting Acting Sub-Lieutenat?

You boat people are weird.
Click to expand...
Huh? You wear a dress.
 
FSTO said:
The (N) was only to be used in written correspondence, but it has now morphed into being orated as well. I can somewhat understand saying you’re a “Lieutenant Navy” when with mud monkeys but it’s the height of redundancy when you’re in a group of a majority of RCN personnel. It’s becoming more and more common and I’d wish it would bloody well stop.

Back in the Middle Ages when I was failing to learn French at St Jean, we had a parade where the reviewing officer was CAPT Davey. The MC repeatedly called him “Captain Navy Davey”. After about the fifth time I wanted to yell, “We get it! He’s a naval Captain, now shut up!” But being a snottier I kept my mouth shut.
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Eureka! That's it. 'Snotty' becomes the rank, and the position ;)
 
Underway said:
And then there is the entire MCpl and MS gordian knot which I've never been able to untangle. Best I could understand was MCpl was an appointment and became a rank because the navy had MS. OR perhaps the navy had a MS appointment which became a rank and the army had to invent a rank to go in there. @Oldgateboatdriver I'm sure has explained this to us at some point.
Click to expand...

The MCpl/MS rank/appointed is a Hellyer abomination.


Canadian Armed Forces ranks and insignia - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

RCN 1.0 went

CPO1
CPO2
*PO1 - This was brought in during the 60s to align with RCAF and CA ranks.
PO2
LS
AB
OS

With chevrons used to denote TI.

Then we have this lovely rank badge that lasted a short time:


mug4ia1psnm71.jpg
 
Halifax Tar said:
The MCpl/MS rank/appointed is a Hellyer abomination.


Canadian Armed Forces ranks and insignia - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

RCN 1.0 went

CPO1
CPO2
*PO1 - This was brought in during the 60s to align with RCAF and CA ranks.
PO2
LS
AB
OS

With chevrons used to denote TI.

Then we have this lovely rank badge that lasted a short time:


View attachment 71867
Click to expand...

Cartoon Network GIF by CNLA
 
Kilted said:
How can a substantive rank have the word acting in it?

Also what if an Acting Sub-Lieutenat was acting as a Sub-Lieutenat? Or what if a Naval Cadet was acting a rank up, would they be an Acting Acting Sub-Lieutenat?

You boat people are weird.
Click to expand...
You got it. In our defence, it's another monstrosity spawned by unification, as @Underway eloquently explained.
dimsum said:
To further confuse things, like how you're not supposed to say the "Navy" part of Lt(N) - e.g. "Lieutenant Bloggins", not "Lieutenant Navy Bloggins", you're not supposed to say the "Acting" part either.

So, "Sub-Lieutenant blahblahblah", not "Acting Sub-Lieutenant blahblahblah".

So @TacticalTea - what's your suggestion for replacing A/SLT? Ensign (like USN and RNZN)? Midshipman (which isn't really equivalent)? Something new?
Click to expand...
Yes, Ensign seems like the obvious choice.

It's already in use in the French version of our ranks, as "Enseigne 2e classe". I'd actually favour standardization of the ranks in both languages with Enseigne/Ensign and Sub-Lieutenant/Sous-Lieutenant.

A few years ago I wanted midshipman to replace Naval Cadet, but now that we've done away with Seaman, it's a non-starter.
 
TacticalTea said:
Allegedly Adm Baines' departure gift to the Navy.

I'll try to push Topshee to change the design 😅 (though I already poke him to eliminate the rank of ''Acting-sub-lieutenant'' every time we meet... my political capital reserves might be dry)
Click to expand...
How can a substantive rank have the word acting in it?

Also what if an Acting Sub-Lieutenat was acting as a Sub-Lieutenat? Or what if a Naval Cadet was acting a rank up, would they be an Acting Acting Sub-Lieutenat?

You boat people are weird.
TacticalTea said:
You got it. In our defence, it's another monstrosity spawned by unification, as @Underway eloquently explained.

Yes, Ensign seems like the obvious choice.

It's already in use in the French version of our ranks, as "Enseigne 2e classe". I'd actually favour standardization of the ranks in both languages with Enseigne/Ensign and Sub-Lieutenant/Sous-Lieutenant.

A few years ago I wanted midshipman to replace Naval Cadet, but now that we've done away with Seaman, it's a non-starter.
Click to expand...
They never updated the NDA, just wait for the government to change for the Navy to revert back.
 
Kilted said:
You boat people are weird.

They never updated the NDA, just wait for the government to change for the Navy to revert back.
Click to expand...
Doesn't require NDA amendment. Requires a designation of rank IAW the NDA by the Governor in Council. You know, the process Art McDonald ignored.
 
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