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Work Life in the CF

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Aaron97

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I have been looking at job reviews for the Canadian Armed Forces and have found some very good and bad reviews. This one struck me the most and I am wondering if anyone based on experience would agree with this users comment or go against it. I understand the military isn't
Wonderland where new recruits,nco's and officers all get along and the sun is always shining, however, I want to make sure if I do seek a career in the CF, I am able to pay my bills along with actually being motivated to go to work rather than depressed. I mean no disrespect to the CAF by asking this question but would like to ensure I am ready for the CAF as I begin my fitness test this Thursday. Thank you.

Review I found:
"I spent 12 years in the Canadian Forces and am a Afghanistan Combat Veteran diagnosed with PTSD.

I can only recommend this organization as a "stepping stone" career for 18 year old's to pad your resume on the way to a better real world job.

Contrary to what people believe, there are no benefits in the canadian military, you do not get free education like in the US GI Bill (unless you are medically released and life ruined). You pay full housing prices for your family to live in a run down 1950s house where ive had my foot go through the floor. God help you if your wife has an education/job as the Military does not care for your spouse or children no matter what they tell you. Your wife has a high paying job? Well too bad we will pull you half way across the country as we are too lazy to find someone else and your name was the first for the career mangler to draw out of the hat. Then you will be told she should just stay at home.

If I could do it over, I would have done a 3 year contract, deployed, and left the Army behind me.

The culture shows a complete lack of respect for lower ranks and often treats them like animals. You can expect to work 18-24 hour days on end as a norm as well as weekends with no overtime and you will not get those days back.

Workplace burnout is huge, and in the past 2 years I have had 5 co-workers in my unit alone commit suicide. Most of the personnel are kept in "survival mode" and either cope with drugs/alcohol, commit suicide, or come forward when you are near suicide for PTSD/Depression then get abandoned by your superiors that only care about their career, and not the military or their men.

The moment you become ill/injured, no matter what you have accomplished in the past or even over-seas doing your real job it will be forgotten and you will be betrayed at a moments notice.

The organization is opposed to anything that is not dictated verbatim and innovation or improvement is unheard of. Total lack of communication at all levels.

Promotion and advancement is not based upon merit but on word of mouth and the "buddy system". I was rated one of the highest performing leadership qualified/experienced Corporals in my unit, as well as being college educated (in my last year of a degree now as of writing this) and I was repeatedly passed over for promotion in favour of soldiers that played on the unit hockey team, had assault/DUI charges, and were buddies with their superiors or yes men.

On leadership, it is less leadership and more "loudership"/how you look vs how you perform.

The training is lackluster and never progresses beyond the bare minimum. In the combat arms you will spend endless hours staring at trees. Tactics only revolve around form a line and perform a frontal and never progress with a moving, thinking enemy force as that may make the officers look bad.

A huge attitude is "you are only as good as your last mistake". Making an error in training, even slight can be a career ender for a junior NCM/Officer. People that step up and make decisions can look forward to being unpopular, while the "grey men" that sit in the background and avoid any serious work or difficult positions where they may make mistakes and be held accountable are promoted.

On accountability there is very little of it. Most Senior NCM will avoid blame at all costs and cowardly designate scapegoats for their errors. Senior NCM's will commonly delegate all their duties to the lowest rank possible and sit in their office playing games or even go home for the day.

Administration is always screwed up and varies from minor things like not getting paid, to running out of fuel in an operational environment and having to borrow from the Americans.

I can only recommend this job as a career if you barely graduated grade 10, have no aspirations beyond doing the bare minumum, like to drink/do drugs (coke is really popular sadly), have a criminial history, and want to stay in a permanent "highschool" mentality."
 
Well i have to say that the person is bitter with the CF and left a negative review.  I have spent over twenty years in and disagree with several of the points, some of them are incorrect.

- He says you don't get free education like the US GI Bill, while we don't have the GI Bill you can get some reimbursement for your education.

- The full housing prices for 1950's houses, I am guessing he is talking about PMQs.  Well you don't have to live in PMQs and several bases now have new PMQs built.

-  Lack of respect for lower ranks and treats them as animals.  I have never seen this when I was a Pte/Cpl I was treated fairly and, as for working 18-24 hrs if I was working usually my supervisor was there also.

I am sure someone will make more comments but I would read more reviews and not just one bitter review.
 
I think this person is rather disgruntled and didn't have things go there way. I would say the majority of comments this person made are inaccurate. I'm sure you read very positive comments I would focus on those more than the negative.

I'm also an injured soldier that has been released and has found many issues with the system overall I would still recommend the military if it interests you. Any organization has its issues so the military is no different. The military has come a long way in how it treats its injured soldiers from a decade ago so the good news is they are always trying to fix and improve things.

Good luck.
 
Take all those opinions, add them all together, and divide by the number of opinions.  :nod:

Does the military have its faults?  Yes.  It does not hold the monopoly on faults, however.  I always remind myself, every time I'm laughing at a Dilbert cartoon and wondering how he so perfectly captured how messed up the military was, that he never served a day in the military....and yet his cartoons resonate greatly.  You know why?  Because all organizations that grow to be pretty big, not matter industry, government, etc... start to take on similar organizational characteristics...warts and all.

If the idea of serving your country and challenging yourself is appealing, then you won't be disappointed in the end.  Will you have challenges?  Yes.  Will there be days you wonder what the heck you were thinking to join?  Yes.  Will there be people you work with whom you'd rather not work with?  Yes.  Will there be people you'll train and work with whom you'll keep as friends long after you hang up the uniform?  Yes.  Only you can make that choice, in the end.  Just make sure you do so in a fully informed manner, which includes asking the questions you did.

All the best.

G2G
 
Aaron97 said:
"I spent 12 years in the Canadian Forces and am a Afghanistan Combat Veteran diagnosed with PTSD.

I've spent 36 years in the CAF, am an Afghanistan and Bosnia vet with PTSD as well and my experiences have been the total opposite.

Contrary to what people believe, there are no benefits in the canadian military, you do not get free education like in the US GI Bill (unless you are medically released and life ruined). You pay full housing prices for your family to live in a run down 1950s house where ive had my foot go through the floor. God help you if your wife has an education/job as the Military does not care for your spouse or children no matter what they tell you. Your wife has a high paying job? Well too bad we will pull you half way across the country as we are too lazy to find someone else and your name was the first for the career mangler to draw out of the hat. Then you will be told she should just stay at home.

So far I've had both a college diploma and a bachelors degree paid for using the various benefits so I dispute the individual's claim there are no education benefits available.  If someone doesn't want to rent a PMQ then they are more then free to rent or buy on the economy if they want.  The CAF is under no obligation, either to the member or the Canadian tax payer, to provide free or discounted housing.  There was a time when our pay was much worse and the inexpensive housing was offered however in this day and age there is no requirement.  With respect to postings and families, I have no sympathy sine the requirement to be posted is well known and, as with any other career, the member has the ability to make a decision on their professional future at any time. 

The culture shows a complete lack of respect for lower ranks and often treats them like animals. You can expect to work 18-24 hour days on end as a norm as well as weekends with no overtime and you will not get those days back.

Workplace burnout is huge, and in the past 2 years I have had 5 co-workers in my unit alone commit suicide. Most of the personnel are kept in "survival mode" and either cope with drugs/alcohol, commit suicide, or come forward when you are near suicide for PTSD/Depression then get abandoned by your superiors that only care about their career, and not the military or their men.

There is a lot to go on with in regards to these statements but all I can say is that it's never been my experience in my career.  Attitudes towards PTSD and depression have been steadily improving and those who require them have access to many more services and supports then anyone outside the CAF.  I know as I have a daughter with mental health issues and its a constant struggle to get even the most basics of supports and services for her.

Promotion and advancement is not based upon merit but on word of mouth and the "buddy system". I was rated one of the highest performing leadership qualified/experienced Corporals in my unit, as well as being college educated (in my last year of a degree now as of writing this) and I was repeatedly passed over for promotion in favour of soldiers that played on the unit hockey team, had assault/DUI charges, and were buddies with their superiors or yes men.

There are issues with any promotion system in any career choice were persons are promoted on merit.  There is no perfect system.  That having been said I think our system is pretty good and getting better as time goes on.  The person who posted these comments initially is ticked he/she was passed over for promotion after doing all the things they mentioned but I'm sure they got the credit they deserved within the performance portion of their PER.  Now, the potential portion is another matter but given their outlook on things I'd hazard a guess they displayed low potential for the next rank. 

As for the remainder of their comments....see the previous paragraph and consider his/her comments as further proof of why I think they were not promoted. 

The CAF is not a job for everyone.  Its not a career for even more people but for many its a positive experience that can either last for the duration of their military career or set them up for civilian employment with a wealth of experience and positive memories. 
 
This subject has also been covered ad nauseum. There's already plenty here on this subject. Please try using the search function and a little bit of looking around at the other forums before posting, already asked and answered, questions.

If I find time, I'll post a link and merge this thread with the other.

Don't wait on me though. I'm a busy guy.

---STAFF---
 
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