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Why Europe Keeps Failing........ merged with "EU Seizes Cypriot Bank Accounts"

So, with about 25% of the vote counted we have this ...

         
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              ... the not at all unsurprising result that most Greeks would rather that hard works, thrifty, responsible Germans (and Finns and so on) should bail them out of their problem and (continue to) finance their spendthrift lifestyle.

This just proves that Alexander Pope was right (and so in the head of every government lottery corporation):

          Hope springs eternal in the human breast;
          Man never is, but always to be blessed:
          The soul, uneasy and confined from home,
          Rests and expatiates in a life to come.

                        – Alexander Pope, An Essay on Man
 
OK, this what the vote was all about ...

                  "Give me the money or I'll shoot"
         
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Elsewhere, the Financial Times says that with 90% of the vote counted and "No" winning decisively, "Greece’s eurozone future in doubt." The article goes on to say that "the result is also likely to plunge Greece deeper into turmoil as it tries to prevent the collapse of a financial system that is rapidly running out of cash ... [but] there was a scathing response from Berlin, which has refused to contemplate debt relief until Greece commits to and implements reforms. Sigmar Gabriel, deputy German chancellor, said Mr Tsipras had “torn down the last bridges on which Greece and Europe could have moved towards a compromise ... With the rejection of the rules of the euro zone ... negotiations about a programme worth billions are barely conceivable,” he told Tagesspiegel newspaper."

Interesting times  :nod:  as the old Chinese cure would have it.
 
Retired AF Guy said:
And may be some Colonels in the background getting ideas.

That could lead to a resolution of the Cyprus problem... the UN has dragged this long enough.
 
The headline writer in The Spectator gets it right ...

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Cheer up: the Greek crisis shows you were right all along. Whoever you are and whatever you think.
 
E.R. Campbell said:
So, with about 25% of the vote counted we have this ...

         
CJKz9h7W8AA7Hwv.png


              ... the not at all unsurprising result that most Greeks would rather that hard works, thrifty, responsible Germans (and Finns and so on) should bail them out of their problem and (continue to) finance their spendthrift lifestyle.

This just proves that Alexander Pope was right (and so in the head of every government lottery corporation):

          Hope springs eternal in the human breast;
          Man never is, but always to be blessed:
          The soul, uneasy and confined from home,
          Rests and expatiates in a life to come.

                        – Alexander Pope, An Essay on Man


In fairness to the Greek people, as David Parkins, drawing in the Globe and Mail, points out, the array of choices, for the Yes vs the No side was not exactly "sparkling:"

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Source: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/editorial-cartoons-for-july-2015/article25156364/
 
Europe's problem is their socialist ideology.At some point it becomes unsustainable as it requires more and more taxes.There is not an endless supply of money in these economies.While the US has been able to maintain debt payments our robust economy has the ability to grow,paying down the debt.
 
tomahawk6 said:
Europe's problem is their socialist ideology.At some point it becomes unsustainable as it requires more and more taxes.There is not an endless supply of money in these economies.While the US has been able to maintain debt payments our robust economy has the ability to grow,paying down the debt.


Actually, America and Germany, just for example, are amongst the most advanced welfare states in history and they are (well, California excepted) robust, growing economies, too. That's not ideological ... but you're right that the more statism (socialism, if you like) the less "robust" the economy can be. Statist economies (think e.g. France and Quebec) hamstring themselves by excessively protectionist 'industrial' or 'growth' policies (America is not immune to this) and, inevitably, reduce industrial flexibility and, therefore, the capacity to change and grow ~ see "creative destruction" and all that.

I think I'm a well known and 'principled' opponent of socialism, but I believe that statism, which can be married to capitalism, too, is the bigger threat: socialism will collapse because it, simply, doesn't work in the modern, global marketplace. Statism can be made to survive (in part because it is often popular) and that makes it more dangerous.
 
tomahawk6 said:
Europe's problem is their socialist ideology.At some point it becomes unsustainable as it requires more and more taxes.There is not an endless supply of money in these economies.While the US has been able to maintain debt payments our robust economy has the ability to grow,paying down the debt.

I hate to burst people's bubbles, but the only reason the US is managing its debt is because the Treasury has been printing money in huge qualities and dumping it into the economy as fast as it could for the last ten years. So much so, in fact, that every time the Treasury hints that it may reduce the rate at which it is doing so, the market have a downturn.

This strategy is not available to anyone else but the US for two reasons: (1) Their currency is not the international reference; and (2) The IMF rules [enacted under the "guidance" of the US, who does not abide by them in any event] does not allow this practice for other countries in managing their debts.
 
Oldgateboatdriver said:
I hate to burst people's bubbles, but the only reason the US is managing its debt is because the Treasury has been printing money in huge qualities and dumping it into the economy as fast as it could for the last ten years. So much so, in fact, that every time the Treasury hints that it may reduce the rate at which it is doing so, the market have a downturn.

This strategy is not available to anyone else but the US for two reasons: (1) Their currency is not the international reference; and (2) The IMF rules [enacted under the "guidance" of the US, who does not abide by them in any event] does not allow this practice for other countries in managing their debts.


:goodpost:  Milpoints inbound ... I couldn't agree more!
 
The Greek crisis is about economics, but it is also about domestic, partisan politics, as this article, which is reproduced under the Fair Dealing provisions of the Copyright Act from The Economist, points out:

http://www.economist.com/news/europe/21657034-france-tries-overcome-hardening-german-resistance-further-negotiations-greece-nein-vs
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Europe's reaction to Greece
"Nein" vs "peut-être"
France tries to overcome hardening German resistance to further negotiations after Greek citizens vote "No"

Jul 6th 2015 | BERLIN AND PARIS | Europe


GREEK cities were filled Sunday night with cheering supporters of the victorious Oxi ("No") camp in the referendum on the bail-out terms demanded by the country's European creditors. Many believed they had launched an anti-austerity revolution that would soon sweep the rest of Europe. In the rest of Europe, such a revolution did not seem to be on the way. Across southern Europe and in France, where demonstrators had rallied in Paris to support the "No" vote (pictured), some sympathised with Greece's plea for solidarity; but others wondered why the Greeks feel entitled to special treatment. Meanwhile, in Germany and northern Europe, the "No" vote seemed only to have reinforced the conviction that Greece should be left to its fate. As Angela Merkel, Germany's chancellor, and François Hollande, France's president, prepared to meet Monday evening to discuss offering Greece one more chance, their countries were split by the divide.

         
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The referendum has hardened German public opinion against concessions to the Greeks, not only because of the outcome but because of the style in which the "No" side campaigned. One image was salient on German televisions screens: the posters printed by the “No” camp depicting Wolfgang Schäuble, the German finance minister, with the caption “He’s been sucking your blood.” To Germans, Mr Schäuble, confined to a wheelchair since a madman shot him in 1990, has been sucking nobody’s blood; rather, he has spent his entire career fighting for a stronger and more integrated Europe, while insisting on sound budgeting. Mr Schäuble’s popularity has soared at home even as Greeks have come to revile him as the embodiment of austerity.

Mr Schäuble's centre-right party, the Christian Democrats (CDU), broadly agrees that the Greek "No" represents a slap in the face. About a third of the party’s parliamentary group already opposed more bail-out money to Greece before the referendum. This group is now growing. “Under no circumstances,” Wolfgang Bosbach, a conservative member of the CDU, told the German press, “are there to be more concessions or another rescue programme.” Because the second bail-out has expired, any new help to Greece would have to come from the European Stability Mechanism, which means Germany’s Bundestag would first have to give chancellor Angela Merkel a mandate to begin negotiations.

Mrs Merkel could still get that mandate. She could draw on the votes of her centre-left coalition partners, the Social Democrats, and the opposition Greens and The Left, an ex-communist party that is allied with Syriza. But even some Social Democrats are growing restive. Sigmar Gabriel, the SPD's boss, said negotiations for a new programme are "hard to imagine." The public is also fed up. According to a poll taken on July 2nd (ie, before the referendum), 85% of Germans believe that the creditors should not have made additional concessions in recent weeks and 52% believe that Greece should exit the euro.

France's citizens are more divided over Greece, but what is certain is that the crisis has reinvigorated French diplomacy. Up to now Europe's approach to Greece has been dominated by the Germans, but over the past week the French have asserted themselves. When Mr Hollande meets Mrs Merkel on Monday evening at the Elysée Palace in Paris, he will try to act as compromise-broker between Athens and Berlin. His government has made it clear that France wants to resume talks with Mr Tsipras in a last-ditch effort to keep Greece in the euro.

Even as the referendum was still underway, Emmanuel Macron, the French economy minister, spelled out France’s position. “Whatever the result,” he declared, negotiations should start again. In particularly strong terms, Mr Macron urged fellow Europeans to avoid “a Versailles Treaty of the euro zone”, referring to the punitive peace treaty after the first world war which imposed harsh terms on Germany and facilitated the rise of Nazism. The French take seriously the risk that an ejected Greece might fall into chronic instability, or under the influence of unsavoury foreign powers, or both. This weekend, Jean-Claude Trichet, former governor of the ECB, told Le Monde, a French newspaper, that “the real risk of a Greek exit is geopolitical”.

But Mr Hollande’s concern is also partly domestic. The French economy is emerging from three years of near-zero growth, and its public finances are beginning to look less strained. But public debt has reached over 97% of GDP. France can ill afford heavier debt-servicing costs, should it come under pressure in the bond markets. Elected in 2012 on a promise to end austerity in Europe, Mr Hollande is keen to show the French political left that he has not abandoned his word altogether. His own Socialist Party is home to a vocal minority of Tsipras sympathisers. Arnaud Montebourg, formerly Mr Hollande’s industry minister, for instance, tweeted a “tribute to the Greek people” after they voted No. Even further to the left, Jean-Luc Mélenchon, leader of the Left Front, organised a rally in Paris on Sunday night to celebrate.

The French political establishment is more equivocal. On Monday morning Alain Juppé, a former prime minister, laid out on his blog the case for a Greek “exit, without drama” from the euro. And Nicolas Sarkozy, former president and leader of the opposition Republican party, has cautioned against negotiations at any price. On the far right, Marine Le Pen’s National Front is positively cheering for Grexit, in order to boost her case that the euro is a project to “brainwash” the people of Europe.

Mr Hollande seems set on finding a way to keep Greece in. A natural consensus-seeker, he has struggled so far to find a proper role for himself in the Grexit crisis. French trust was rudely shaken by Mr Tsipras’s snap decision to hold a referendum, but the French still hope that there is space for a compromise. As for Mrs Merkel, domestic resistance does not rule out her opting for a new bail-out. She has long been criticised for her “politics of small steps”—an incremental style of crisis management that many blame for the emergence of Syriza in the first place—but her restraint in responding to the referendum suggests that she is still open to all scenarios. Throughout the history of the EU, periodic displays of Franco-German solidarity have been needed to keep the project from disintegrating. Now Mr Hollande is hoping that a compromise between Berlin and Paris can bring Europe and Greece back to the negotiating table and avert disaster.


I remain convinced that there is a HUGE "trust" (belief, credit (credo), confidence) issue that divides Europe: Germans, and the Dutch and Finns (and non Euro members, even non EU members) and other Scandinavians place a high value on "credit" and, generally, demand fiscal prudence from their governments. Others ~ Greece, Portugal, Spain, Italy and, yes, France ~ believe that "credit" is overrated and governments can, on behlaf of the "people" fiddle the system and fudge the numbers to provide popular policies. I think this "gap" may be what dooms the Euro as currently constituted.
 
Why doesn't Germany surprise them all and leave the Euro, resurrecting the Deutschmark, and letting the EU flounder?  Then, with weakened economies, they'll all come back like a bowling ball tossed into the gutter...
 
Oldgateboatdriver said:
I hate to burst people's bubbles, but the only reason the US is managing its debt is because the Treasury has been printing money in huge qualities and dumping it into the economy as fast as it could for the last ten years. So much so, in fact, that every time the Treasury hints that it may reduce the rate at which it is doing so, the market have a downturn.

This strategy is not available to anyone else but the US for two reasons: (1) Their currency is not the international reference; and (2) The IMF rules [enacted under the "guidance" of the US, who does not abide by them in any event] does not allow this practice for other countries in managing their debts.

Fair enough, but if my grandmother had wheels, she would be a bus.
My point- Greece is not the U.S. Fair or unfair, people the world over, value and trust the U.S. Dollar, even after the extent to which it has been manipulated.
 
One interpretation of the outcome of the Greek referendum is that the socialists of the Europe and the world have found a new cause celebre and are rapidly coalescing around a new authoritarian model - read that as neo-Communism.  Meanwhile the aristocratic elites, the champagne socialists that constitute the remainder of the EU supporters, and the strongest ideologues, are reverting to their own corporatist authoritarian model - read that as neo-Fascism.

And in the middle of this mess are a few "classical liberals" and poor David Cameron, wandering around, like Diogenes and his lamp in search of an honest man, trying to find somebody to renegotiate the terms of his deal.

Cameron is being advised to have his referendum early (2016 instead of 2017). 

Currently he is being offered nothing substantive.  Merely promises of future considerations. 

The referendum, if held will mean absolutely nothing.  And everything.  Just like the Greek one. 

The Euros will accept it if it gives the answer they are looking for.  If it doesn't they will declare it illegitimate. 

Meanwhile the Brits will accept it regardless.  They will be perturbed if the Euros reject it.  They may even be spurred to a Unilateral Declaration of Independence (Thank you Ian Smith).  But it is unlikely they will go to war with Europe.

That is unlike the Continent where the authoritarian left and the authoritarian right are only to ready to get at each others' throats - and Vlad only too happy to help.

If Cameron waits until 2017 for his referendum he may well have nothing left to negotiate.  The EU could have come apart at the seams by then.

Janet Daley, Sunday Telegraph 
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/greece/11718083/Greece-referendum-syriza-tsipras-eurozone-crisis-euro.html
 
I don't always agree with Prof Joseph E Stiglitz, but he is a great economist and his views deserve attention. He offers his (as usual) critical perspective of the Greek crisis in this article which is reproduced under the fair Dealing provisions of the Copyright Act from The World Post:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/joseph-e-stiglitz/argentina-greece-default_b_7697838.html
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Argentina Shows Greece There May Be Life After Default

Joseph E. Stiglitz
Professor at Columbia University and a Nobel Laureate in Economics

Martin Guzman
Postdoctoral Research Fellow Columbia University

Updated: 07/01/2015

When, five years ago, Greece's crisis began, Europe extended a helping hand. But it was far different from the kind of help that one would have wanted, far different from what one might have expected if there was even a bit of humanity, of European solidarity.

The initial proposals had Germany and other "rescuers" actually making a profit out of Greece's distress, charging a far, far higher interest rate than their cost of capital. Worse, they imposed conditions on Greece -- changes in its macro- and micro-policies -- that would have to be made in return for the money.

Such conditionality was a standard part of the lending practices of the IMF and the World Bank. Typically, when they imposed these conditions, they had little knowledge of the real workings of the economy; and frequently, there was more than a little politics in the demands. There was sometimes an element of neo-colonialism: the old White Europeans once again telling their former colonies what to do. More often than not, the policies didn't work as they were supposed to. There were huge discrepancies between what the Western experts expected and what actually happened.

Somehow, one expected something better of Greece's Eurozone "partner." But the demands were every bit as intrusive, and the policies and models were every bit as flawed. The disparity between what the Troika thought would happen and what has emerged has been striking -- and not because Greece didn't do what it was supposed to, but because it did, and the models were very, very flawed.

At last, after years of blackmailing Greece and demanding ever more austerity that led to a catastrophic economic depression, the Troika has finally pushed the country into the brink of default.

The situation has some important similarities with Argentina's 2001 default -- and some differences as well. In both countries, recessions turned into depressions as a consequence of austerity policies -- making the debt even more unsustainable. In both cases, the policies were demanded as a condition for assistance. Both countries had rigid currency arrangements that gave them no possibility for running expansionary monetary policies during the recession. In both countries, the IMF got it wrong, providing alarmingly flawed forecasts of the consequences of the imposed policies. Unemployment and poverty soared, and GDP plummeted. Indeed, there is even a striking similarity in the magnitude of the fall in GDP and the increase in the unemployment rate.

In Argentina, youth unemployment in particular skyrocketed and stayed high for several years. The lack of opportunities destroyed motivations and was an immense waste of the talent of millions of young people. With youth unemployment at about 50 percent in Greece, a similar saga is going on.

Defaults are difficult. But even more so is austerity. The good news for Greece is that, as Argentina showed, there may be life after debt and default.

The saga that led to the Greek default reminds us time and again of important lessons for the management of sovereign debt crises that we should have learned from earlier such events. The first one is that there is no improvement in the capacity of debt repayment without economic recovery. At the same time, there is no economic recovery without a restoration of debt sustainability.

Both in Argentina and Greece, restoring debt sustainability required a deep sovereign debt restructuring. In both cases, finalizing a "good" debt restructuring, a timely and sufficiently deep restructuring conducive to economic recovery with access to international credit markets, has proven to be quixotic. This is not due to any fault on the part of the countries, but to deficiencies in the frameworks in which negotiations were carried on.

In both cases, creditor institutions pretended that sustainability could be regained through "structural adjustments." Under intense pressure, the programs that were foisted on them were accepted and implemented -- but they obviously didn't work. Exchanging "bailout" funds -- funds that were mostly used to repay the very same creditors that were providing them -- for adjustments (and promises of even bigger adjustments) spiraled into economies that got ever weaker. In the case of Argentina, after years of suffering, the people went into the streets.

In both cases, runs on the banking system ended up with a partial freezing of bank deposits, which in the case of Argentina, triggered a full-fledged banking crisis and a subsequent conversion of deposits denominated in a foreign currency into domestic currency that led to a restructuring of domestic liabilities -- at a high cost for small domestic savers. In Greece, the consequences still remain to be seen.

Debt contracts are voluntary exchanges between creditors and debtors. They are done in a context of uncertainty: when the debtor promises to repay a certain amount in the future, everyone understands that the promise is contingent on the debtor's capacity for repayment. There is risk involved -- the reason that creditors demand a larger compensation (higher interest rates) than if they were lending under no risk.

Debt restructurings are a necessary part of the lender-borrower relationship. They have occurred hundreds of times, and they will continue occurring. The way in which they are resolved determines the size of the losses. Bad management of debt crises, such as demanding austerity policies during recessions -- in spite of theory and empirical evidence showing that austerity in recessions only makes recessions deeper -- inevitably leads to larger losses and more suffering.

Those who get saved by the bailouts (as the German and French banks in the case of Greece) usually give moral hazard as the reason to avoid debt restructuring. They claim that it would create perverse incentives; other debtors would be more inclined to "abuse" borrowing by not repaying. But the moral hazard argument is a fairy tale. Both Argentina and Greece had already paid a very high price for their debt problems by the time of default. No country in the world would be happy to follow the same road.

Greece's experience also teaches us what should not be done in a debt restructuring. The country "restructured" its debt in 2012, but it did it wrong. It was not only insufficiently deep for economic recovery, but it also led to a change in the composition of debt -- from private creditors to official creditors -- making further restructurings more difficult.

To some extent, Greece faces a more complex situation than Argentina did in 2001. Argentina's default was accompanied by a large currency devaluation that made the country more competitive and that, together with the debt restructuring, provided the conditions for a sustained economic recovery. In the case of Greece, default and Grexit would require the re-implementation of a domestic currency. It's not the same to devalue an existing currency than to create a new currency in the midst of a crisis. This additional layer of uncertainty has enhanced the Troika's capacity for pressuring Tsipras's government.

When debt is unsustainable, there needs to be a fresh start. This is a basic, well-recognized principle. So far, the Troika is depriving Greece from this possibility. And there can't be a fresh start with austerity.

This Sunday, Greek citizens will debate two alternatives: austerity and depression without end, or the possibility of deciding their own destiny in a context of huge uncertainty. None of the options are nice. Both could lead to even worse social disruptions. But while with one of them there is some hope, with the other there is not.


One point where I do agree, unreservedly, with prof Stiglitz is that:

          When debt is unsustainable, there needs to be a fresh start. This is a basic, well-recognized principle.

Greece's debt is unsustainabl;e. It doesn't matter what the Troika does (short of colonizing Greece and starting all over again). Greece cannot pay it's current debts ... ever. Adding new debts will not make things better ... it's Dennis Healy's first law of holes again:

                                                           
denis-healey-it-is-a-good-thing-to-follow-the-first-law-of-holes-if.jpg


The only sane course is to restructure Greece's debts ... which means that almost everyone, including the USA and Japan, but, especially, French and German banks ...

                   
150127131739-greek-debt-chart-780x439.jpg


                        ... will have to take BIG "haircuts".

Greece is, for all intents and purposes, bankrupt. The ECB, the IMF and Germany, above all, need to accept that and move, soon, to save whatever they can.
 
While the common sense position would be to do massive write offs or haircuts, taxpayers in Germany and other EU nations will not take kindly to being forced to "bail in" insolvent banks, which is one of the driving forces behind the various creditor nation positions.

OTOH, the Greek "NO" vote is not a principled declaration against debt slavery, it is the tantrum of a two year old being told there will be no more cake and ice cream.

Perhaps the most pressing issue is the fact there are no Greek politicians either in place or on the horizon who are willing to roll up their sleeves and do the actual hard work needed to rebuild the Greek economy. None are likely to appear either, given the voters have seemingly embraced magical thinking as a response the the crisis (a story a week or so ago told of a 60 year old Greek pensioner wondering "how it was possible" that he could no longer withdraw money from the ATM, and "how did this happen with no warning?" Evidently he was living under a rock for the last few years). The bankers responsible for lending money to the Greeks despite the almost certain knowledge that what they were doing was like lending money to a crack addict also deserve severe censure, if not long jail terms, but that isn't going to happen either....
 
So, according to a report in the Globe and Mail, the Greeks came back to the table, today, as promised, without the promised proposals to save the country from fiscal failure. "Tomorrow," said Prime Minister Tsipras, "Mañana is good enough for me."

One wonders what, if anything, is going through the Greek prime minister's mind ... maybe he just knows that he's phuqued no matter what he proposes, and me plans to just ...

                           
lie-back-think-of-england-magnet.jpg
 
Latest is that Greece has 5 days to come back with proposals, and a final decision by the EU reps will come by Sunday.

Europe gives Greece 5 days to avoid bankruptcy

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/with-greeces-fate-on-the-line-european-leaders-to-gather-for-critical-summit/2015/07/07/ca99ab8a-242d-11e5-b621-b55e495e9b78_story.html

ATHENS — An emergency summit of European leaders called to salvage Greece’s financial rescue broke up acrimoniously late Tuesday, with officials saying the country now has just five days to avoid bankruptcy.

Following a day of talks in Brussels aimed at finding a way out of months of bitter deadlock, European leaders were scathing in their assessments of Greece’s proposals, calling them inadequate and demanding that the Greek government return with a detailed plan by Friday morning. The leaders of all 28 European Union members will then meet on Sunday in what officials said would be the final chance to save Greece from economic oblivion.

E.U. leaders expressed anger that Greek officials offered only oral proposals, rather than presenting a detailed written plan to address concerns about the country’s debt crisis.

“The stark reality is that we only have five days to find the ultimate agreement,” said a visibly irritated European Council President Donald Tusk, the former prime minister of Poland. “Until now I have avoided talking about deadlines. But tonight I have to say it loud and clear — the final deadline ends this week.”

Standing at his side at E.U. headquarters in Brussels, European Commission President Jean-Claude Juncker of Luxembourg pounded the lectern as he announced that Europe has detailed plans for Greece’s exit from the euro zone — known as “Grexit” — and for delivering humanitarian aid to Athens.

“I’m strongly against Grexit,” he said. “But I can’t prevent it if the Greek government is not doing what we expect the Greek government to do.”

Greek Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras had a starkly different account of the meeting, saying it was “positive” and that he had outlined proposals for a “socially just and economically viable agreement.”

The wildly different accounts suggested how difficult it will be to reach a deal in time to pull Greece back from the edge of an abyss that both sides have said for months they are desperate to avoid.

E.U. officials informed the Greek delegation that the Sunday summit would be held to approve a plan to aid Greece as long as creditors are satisfied with Greek reform commitments.

“The ball is in Greece’s court, Italian Prime Minister Matteo Renzi told reporters after the meeting. “Next Sunday, the final meeting will take place on Greece.”

The comments came after Greece’s failure to present a formal proposal appeared to deal a setback to attempts at salvaging the country’s financial rescue before its banks run out of cash.

The surprise twist further complicated Greece’s last-ditch effort to renew the flow of European funds and keep the country from slipping deeper into financial chaos, which could lead to an exit from the common currency.

Greece’s government had been widely expected to present a new plan to finance ministers at the Brussels summit, held just days after a Sunday referendum in which Greek voters emphatically rejected Europe’s latest bailout proposal. One of the key elements in that plan was deeper cuts to state pensions.

But instead of a formal blueprint, Greece’s new finance minister, Euclid Tsakalotos, spoke from hand-written notes about his country’s intentions to rein in costs and prop up its creaky fiscal underpinnings.

Jeroen Dijsselbloem, president of euro zone finance ministers, said it was “too early to say” whether the Greek plans were substantive enough to reopen talks.

“In the eyes of the euro group, the problems in Greece do really need credible reforms,” he said. “And, therefore, we need to hear from the Greek government whether they have such reforms in mind.”

Now, the euro group must wait until Wednesday when finance ministers will convene again via conference call. Tsipras, the Greek prime minister, also is due to address the European Parliament on Wednesday morning.

“Time is very short, and more so as we go on,” Dijsselbloem said

After several hours of closed-doors talks Tuesday, the finance ministers emerged to report disappointment at the lack of progress even as Greek banks struggle just to keep their ATMs stocked with the bare minimum of cash.

No specific details of Tsakalotos’s presentation were made public. But a photo gave a clue of the tone. Tsakalotos held notes, written on hotel stationery, which included the words “no triumphalism” — an apparent reminder not to gloat after the Sunday vote.

The impasse has the potential to toss Greece from the group of nations sharing the euro, but several top European leaders have pledged to seek every avenue to keep Greece in the common currency and avoid the potential of further cracks in the euro zone.

The Greek leader Tsipras — who called the plebiscite in a gambit to seek leverage in the talks — must now find a way to show Germany and other creditors that he has a credible path to rein in costs and one day repay the massive loans.

“It’s not a matter of weeks any more,” said German Chancellor Angela Merkel on arrival in Brussels for a dinner meeting on the Greek crisis. “It’s a matter of days.”

Tsipras, who will also attend the evening session, huddled in advance with Merkel, French President Francois Hollande and European Commission President Jean-Claude Juncker. It was not clear what officials hoped to achieve at the meeting, which had not been previously announced.

Earlier, a Greek government spokesman said Tsipras spoke by phone with President Obama, who has urged European leaders to try to keep Greece in the euro zone.

The pressure on Greece intensified after the European Central Bank decided Monday not to expand its life support for Greek financial institutions, raising the prospect that they could be out of money by Wednesday absent an ECB reversal. That alone could force Greece off the euro, the common currency of 19 of the European Union’s 28 member states.

Ahead of Tuesday’s meetings, French Prime Minister Manuel Valls said his country would not “take the risk to let Greece exit the euro zone.”

But other countries, notably Germany, have taken a harder line, with officials saying that Greece must get serious with its proposals to avoid being tossed out of the currency club. The Slovak finance minister, Peter Kazmir, called the prospect of debt relief — a critical Greek demand — “absolutely impossible.”

The delay in receiving a written plan from Greece left some European leaders openly frustrated.

“The Greek government is always ‘mañana,’’’ said Lithuanian President Dalia Grybauskaite.

Belgium’s prime minister, Charles Michel, put Tsipras on notice that time is running out.

“If there’s nothing on the table and there continues to be nothing on the table, that means Tsipras is not able to honor the demand of the Greek people to stay in the euro zone,” Michel said.

Other euro-zone countries with shaky finances, such as Spain and Portugal, are watching to see whether Europe backs down from its tough economic demands in the face of domestic rebellions. That would spark new pressures in those nations. And if Greece is kicked off the euro, the ensuing turmoil might inspire efforts in other nations to quit the currency club.

European stock exchanges were again down sharply on the Greek uncertainty. Wall Street also pointed lower.

Although Tsipras won a resounding mandate Sunday from Greek voters to reject Europe’s bailout demands, it remained far from clear Tuesday whether he could convert that victory into a win at the negotiating table.

The ECB left unspecified the timing of the extension of its $98 billion credit line, but it increased the pressure on Greek banks by raising the amount of assets that the banks need to muster as collateral to qualify for the emergency assistance.

The dwindling cash is sucking the life out of businesses such as coffee shops and taxis as anxious Greeks economize amid fears for the future. Greek leaders also banned transfers of money abroad, meaning that very little can be imported.

The rising shortages may speed a deal, some analysts said.

Another factor could be the departure Monday of Yanis Varoufakis as finance minister. His hectoring and combative style during his less than six months in office appeared to anger Greece’s European partners.

Named as his replacement was a mild-mannered Oxford-trained economist, Tsakalotos. He has headed Greece’s negotiating team since April. Tsakalotos vowed Monday to deliver relief to Greeks, who have suffered from five years of economic pain rivaling the Great Depression.

“People who are poor, middle-aged, unemployed — they said that they trust their government to find a viable solution,” he said after being sworn into office.
 
I was listening to an interesting interview with Larry Summers on NPR while driving to / through New York City this afternoon.

Couple of points stood out.

First, Both sides have dug in and are being idealistic in their stances. Germany wants nothing short of full acquiescence by Greece for full austerity measures. Greece wants to write off debt to the point where they can put their economy in a growth position, without the pain it is incurring now. Summers felt that both sides need to back away from ideology and take a more pragmatic stance in order to come to the best outcome for all.

Second, the IMF vastly underestimated the problem at hand when the bailouts began 5 years ago, and their numbers essentially had no basis in reality. Summers compared it to the crap ass job the investment rating agencies did during the mortgage debacle that lead to the collapse of the US economy in 2007. He also felt that the IMF needs to take a haircut because of this, even though they are the senior creditor, and are first in line for payments.

Third, Greece is taking in more in loans to make payments than they are paying out, which is completely unsustainable. The economy is basically dried up and there really isn't anything that can be done to save Greece from total economic collapse. The effect of the austerity measures has essentially ensured the results we are seeing now. It would be the same as if all of a sudden the total production output of California, Florida, Texas and New York dropped to zero.

In another NPR interview I heard, it was pointed out that there is an irony here when you look at the bailout of the German economy  in 1952. Greece supported that bailout. But the comparison is limited, as a portion of that debt written off was not of Germany's making, essentially the effects of reparations and economic limitations emplaced under the Treaty of Versailles at the end of WWI. This is the point that Summers made when he felt that both sides need to be pragmatic. Everyone involved in the German bailout took a pragmatic view, as the effects of a German collapse would have continent wide consequences. The Greek economy would not have same effect long term, as it is only a small portion of the European economy overall. 
 
That's all well and good, but what possible "plan" can Prime Minister Tsipras offer, other than default?

The debt is, simply, unmanageable and adding to it, through further bailouts, is just sending good money after bad.

Greece needs to default ... declare bankruptcy ... offer 1¢ on the $ and start again.

I'm not sure Greece can stay in the Euro ... but, in the long term, I'm not sure that Portugal, Spain, Italy and France can, either.

Greece is enroute to being a third world economy; but, hell's bells, it's been headed that way since 1944.
 
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