Well well well another CTS triumph

[BKells]

So, getting back to the first post... when is everyone expected to get it issued? Are TF3-08 pers considered priority?

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

TF 1-08 is priority.  Last direction I heard was Nov issue.

 

[geo]

Most bags for sale now are about 20% bigger
Bags are made of cordura not the rubber material and are alot stronger
Most people don't use the cargo shelf..no need
There is all kinds of pad systems out there
Most people prefer the valise on top from discussions I have had

Yeah, individuals have worked & developed the parts to make it a better ruck BUT, as indicated by some, the 64 pattern ruck wasn' 100% perfect.

The shelf was useful - carry a crate of ammo or a jerrycan with shelf VS without one & you'd become a "fan" of the shelf... just not that one.

 

[Strike]

Anyone have any photos of this new piece of wonder-kit?

 

[MG34]

You know you can take the internal frame out of a Kirafu EMR and make it a packboard 
   I wonder why "part" of the CF rejected the new ruck in favour of Kifaru's stuff...   

Yes I cannot imagine why they did that,seeing as how they were the first to get the new ruck....and rejected it

 

[Armymedic]

I wonder why "part" of the CF rejected the new ruck in favour of Kifaru's stuff...   

Kifaru and Lowe Alpine.

Perhaps they got tired of waiting?

 

[riggermade]

Yeah, individuals have worked & developed the parts to make it a better ruck BUT, as indicated by some, the 64 pattern ruck wasn' 100% perfect.

/quote]

Agreed but as this topic shows nobody will be totally satisfied regardless of what they get

 

[armyvern]

Or even because that internal frame was vastly identified by the troops on their most-wanted "wish list" like I said below??

Kind of like what happened with the boots ... they all wanted "vibram soles" as the number one thing for inclusion in their new boots ... they did get what they asked for ... just not exactly how they wanted it.  :-\

Reminds me of that saying about being careful what you wish for ...

 

[KevinB]

Ah yeah the Lowe -- I've got both and I think the Kifaru is better - but I see why some prefer the Lowe.

  The joke is is a unit can give Mel from Kifaru rough sizing for the guys (these are custom/semi custom setups) and bang 4 weeks later you get your stuff...

Now I know the size of the order is way different than the whole of the CF -- but say we could get  200 rucks a month from Kifaru (I would bet more but I am being catious).
 How many members of the CF are entitled to a ruck - field force only correct?

 If we started in 2002 when the 3VP battlegroup deployed to Afghanistan, I'm pretty sure a semi custom ruck could have been procured for all regular and reserve members who are entitled.

Call me crazy but perhaps adopting the US RFI method and having a unti Master Gunner/S7 (Force Mod) cell might be a bit more expediant - and we can post CTS back to the sharp end.

My method would have saved 5 years and the salaries for the CTS staff in 5 years  

 

[GregC]

Having deployed with C-Coy overseas (without the issued ruck, however), I was able to get a bit of a feel from it from other guys who had it in the platoon. Since I didn't personally hump it I'll limit myself to my 3 biggest observations:

1) This new ruck is pretty damn heavy empty, I haven't put it on a scale, but an empty 64 weighs next to nothing, and this weighed significantly more than that, I'd wager around 15-20lbs.

2) It's massive. That's all there is to it.

3) No capacity (as others have mentioned) for strapping down awkward loads. Thinning out a checkpoint we were each strapping on things like 60mm packs, mortars, SF kits, MG ammo, you name it, without a problem. I'm not so sure the ruck could handle this as easily or effectively.

I'll give the new ruck a chance (if it's issued to me), however I think it would have to be a pretty outstanding piece of kit for me to switch over, and from what I've seen and heard I (unfortunately) don't think it is.

 

[Matt_Fisher]

You know you can take the internal frame out of a Kirafu EMR and make it a packboard 
   I wonder why "part" of the CF rejected the new ruck in favour of Kifaru's stuff...   

I don't think that the Kifaru stuff was ever given a fair shake, outside of "Oh, XXXX unit is using them, but that's because they have very specific requirements for specific missions that the rest of the Army doesn't do...which is why we have XXXX unit.  If you like the equipment that XXXX is using, then you should go and try out for XXXX unit."

I've got a pdf file that goes through the development and early trials of the tac-vest, small pack, and rucksack system.  If anybody wants them, I'll gladly send it over.
Just PM me your email address, or email me at matt@cpgear.com

A big reason as to why pretty much any CADPAT Cordura nylon items weigh considerably more than commercial or other military's similar items, is due to the heavy duty urethane coating that's applied on the mil-spec material.  This coating adds considerable weight to the fabric. 

 

[riggermade]

I don't think that the Kifaru stuff was ever given a fair shake, outside of "Oh, XXXX unit is using them, but that's because they have very specific requirements for specific missions that the rest of the Army doesn't do...which is why we have XXXX unit.  If you like the equipment that XXXX is using, then you should go and try out for XXXX unit."

I've got a pdf file that goes through the development and early trials of the tac-vest, small pack, and rucksack system.  If anybody wants them, I'll gladly send it over.
Just PM me your email address.

A big reason as to why pretty much any CADPAT Cordura nylon items weigh considerably more than commercial or other military's similar items, is due to the heavy duty urethane coating that's applied on the mil-spec material.  This coating adds considerable weight to the fabric. 

Matt is right

I f you have a 64 pattern ruck in Cadpat it is heavier than a green one

 

[Nfld Sapper]

I don't think that the Kifaru stuff was ever given a fair shake, outside of "Oh, XXXX unit is using them, but that's because they have very specific requirements for specific missions that the rest of the Army doesn't do...which is why we have XXXX unit.  If you like the equipment that XXXX is using, then you should go and try out for XXXX unit."

I've got a pdf file that goes through the development and early trials of the tac-vest, small pack, and rucksack system.  If anybody wants them, I'll gladly send it over.
Just PM me your email address.

A big reason as to why pretty much any CADPAT Cordura nylon items weigh considerably more than commercial or other military's similar items, is due to the heavy duty urethane coating that's applied on the mil-spec material.  This coating adds considerable weight to the fabric. 

Hey Matt can I get a copy of said pdf?

 

[Matt_Fisher]

Hey Matt can I get a copy of said pdf?

PM me your email address.

 

[Nfld Sapper]

Done, check your inbox

 

[Matt_Fisher]

Kifaru and Lowe Alpine.

There was also a purchase of the Gregory/Bianchi UM-21 for DHTC back in the late 90's.  Apparently they hated it as much as USSOCOM did and have since gone in favour of Kifaru.

 

[COBRA-6]

Internal frames are comfy but how do they work with body armour? Has anyone tried the new ruck while wearing the issue vest and plates?

 

[genesis98]

Can we get some pics up in here?

 

[armyvern]

Can we get some pics up in here?

Try here:

CTS

 

[Kirkhill]

Though the Airborne used it... everyone else did too.  It wasn't a jump ruck - that moniker stuck when the wire frame ruck showed up and started to bend on impact & the Airborne "asked" for something more robust.

Old "problems"?
- the cargo bag was small
- the cargo bag wasn't all that solid - poor stitching
- the cargo shelf was flimsy / could get lost
- not much padding on the various straps
- weight (cargo bag) was at the bottom & light stuff (sleeping bag) was at the top

Plus: You could throw a full 5 gallon Jerry Can of water (50 lbs) on the frame in under 30 secs and continue with an Advance to Contact at Borden (ca 1981)

Minus: 3 washings and the Bag had more Irish Pennants than I had matches.

Beyond that I agree with Geo.