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US Navy issuing Flame Resistant Coverall Uniform

Isn't the dress of the day generally dictated by the Commanding Officer in their standing orders? Whether or not you wear NCDs or DEUs really shouldn't be your choice like 95% of the time.
You guys get Standing Orders?
 
There is a performance incentive for issuing everyone coveralls. An institution that cares about performance would take that in to consideration.
I might have said 'an institution that cares about safety would take that in to consideration'.

As a former MSEO who has also worked at construction and oil & gas sites, personal protective equipment and clothing (PPE&C) is the baseline for what is to be worn on a site. At oil & gas facilities, fireproof coveralls are required in all work areas. Work areas that are, in my opinion, not substantially different than a ship's engine room. An additional feature of the coveralls typically worn in industry is the reflective striping. Easier to find others in the dark or in an emergency.

PPE&C worn in industry typically includes safety boots, gloves, hard hats, high-visibility vests, eye protection and hearing protection. Failure to wear the correct PPE&C at all times is taken seriously: people have been fired on the spot for such things.

I would suggest the Navy is lagging far behind industry in specifying PPE&C appropriate for the hazards and demanding compliance with PPE&C regulations.
 
I might have said 'an institution that cares about safety would take that in to consideration'.

As a former MSEO who has also worked at construction and oil & gas sites, personal protective equipment and clothing (PPE&C) is the baseline for what is to be worn on a site. At oil & gas facilities, fireproof coveralls are required in all work areas. Work areas that are, in my opinion, not substantially different than a ship's engine room. An additional feature of the coveralls typically worn in industry is the reflective striping. Easier to find others in the dark or in an emergency.

PPE&C worn in industry typically includes safety boots, gloves, hard hats, high-visibility vests, eye protection and hearing protection. Failure to wear the correct PPE&C at all times is taken seriously: people have been fired on the spot for such things.

I would suggest the Navy is lagging far behind industry in specifying PPE&C appropriate for the hazards and demanding compliance with PPE&C regulations.
Completely agree with this. We use a demerit system in my current line of work (freight rail) for safety violations of which there are a plethora of rules and regulations that must be adhered to.

The Company issues appropriate safety gear and expects we wear it IAW direction given in our Safety Rulebook. Failure to comply will eventually result in dismissal and it's something the management takes very seriously and actively enforces.

The specific company I work for also treats safety as a performance metric.
 
Here at Carling it’s N3’s for officers (RCN) and I’m seeing more MS and below in N3 as well. I find it beyond stupid to wear operational dress in an office environment and I refuse to wear NCD’s even if it is allowed on Friday’s.
Back in the day onboard ships officers were in salt and peppers at all times alongside and we only changed into combats once we sailed.

We should only have 2 uniforms. 1 for work and one for parade/ceremonial. And the only variations on these should be climate conditions driven.
 
Yes, even though it's a small fire, the first person rushing in probably shouldn't be wearing wool/poly pants, nylon socks, cotton (or poly) shirt, and an NCD jacket.

AFAIK officers aren't in S&P onboard ship anymore - depending on the fleet, they haven't been in...a decade? 15 years? I don't recall off hand.
Ha ha! Haven’t you noticed that I’m an older gentleman and have been around the horn a bit? You should have seen the looks of horror I got from the youngsters when I walked onboard HMCS Ottawa wearing TWLs when she was alongside for an extended period. They thought I’d instantly combust once I crossed the brow!
The fire bit? Didn’t you know that once you tucked your pant legs into your socks you were invincible?
 
I would suggest the Navy is lagging far behind industry in specifying PPE&C appropriate for the hazards and demanding compliance with PPE&C regulations.
That there wasn’t compulsory hearing protection for entering engine and boiler rooms is a reason for all the VAC Hearing claims today. Which I should get onto to submitting today.
 
And the only variations on these should be climate conditions driven.
and situations where wearing personal protective equipment and clothing is deemed essential for the safety of the worker (flight crews onboard aircraft, ships staff working in engine rooms, aircraft maintainers working in hangars, vehicle technicians working in repair shops, etc.).
 
and situations where wearing personal protective equipment and clothing is deemed essential for the safety of the worker (flight crews onboard aircraft, ships staff working in engine rooms, aircraft maintainers working in hangars, vehicle technicians working in repair shops, etc.).

Its called an implied task. And it fell under work dress. But thank you for expanding.
 
Coveralls are great, they look way better than that ugly bus driver outfit the Navy calls a uniform.

They are also way quicker to get in to at emergency, rescue and action stations than the layered uniform with buttons.

I guarantee you that if you put a person with coveralls beside a person with a regular uniform and time them jumping out of their rack for an alarm, the person with coveralls will be quicker every time. Not just by a couple of seconds either, I'm talking like by a minute. It's enough that it's statistically significant.

There is a performance incentive for issuing everyone coveralls. An institution that cares about performance would take that in to consideration.

This is the RCN we are talking about though so I won't hold my breath.
There is a reason that the aircrew were first in section base 3 for emergency stations, every single time…
 
If during an emergency people are worried about doing up buttons on the NCD shirt, that's a training issue. The jacket itself is two layers, so combined with a t shirt, and NCD shirt is more than enough protection. The difference in time between putting on coveralls, and pants, shirt(unbuttoned), and jacket is tiny. The lines at the ladders/hatches are more of a time killer.

Coveralls definitely have their place, but they are not the panacea for shipboard dress that people like to pretend they are. I have never had a pair of coveralls that fit me for length. A two-piece system allows for me to wear my 70 length pants, and my 73 length shirts/jackets comfortably, and I'm 100% certain I'm not the only person who has this issue.

We should only have 2 uniforms. 1 for work and one for parade/ceremonial. And the only variations on these should be climate conditions driven.

While I'm a bit of a buttons and bows guy myself, I have come around to this thinking as well.
 
While I'm a bit of a buttons and bows guy myself, I have come around to this thinking as well.

I consider myself one as well. I would like to see the RCN return to a more pre-unification NCM rank insignia. I think our tunics should have 8 buttons. I think our medals should be mounted high on the jacket not above the pocket.

I also think the only time for salt and peppers or my tunic, ect ect, is on a parade or other public duties. Work, be it in an office or ship or warehouse or machine shop, should be a simple comfortable uniform that properly displays rank, name and trade, for ease of identification.

One thing I have noticed since I have been wearing CADPAT everyday is how much more interaction the public wants to have with me. I get thanks and conversation every time I go get lunch or stop at the grocery store on the way home. It never happened in Naval uniforms.
 
If you go with off the shelf FR coveralls, they actually can get a lot of customization so you can do it with one piece what we do with two pieces well enough; we just suck at sizing clothes (despite having every single person's measurements on file). I'm tall and gangly and was able to find a pair of comfortable coveralls no problem, and I think they went by a combination of inseam, size, and a tall option, with a cinch around the waist. Between coveralls and boots with zippers it's way faster to jump into than the old setup, no question.

The 'two layers' of the new NCD jacket is BS though, and no way the new one performs as well as the old setup (tshirt, blue shirt, black jacket) in a flash exposure. The baggy air pockets and actual layers between the different items provided a huge amount of protection, so it was really just your face and hands that were exposed. Still waiting to see what the actual tests showed, but not sure if any was done to compare them against the old NCDs.
 
If you go with off the shelf FR coveralls, they actually can get a lot of customization so you can do it with one piece what we do with two pieces well enough; we just suck at sizing clothes (despite having every single person's measurements on file). I'm tall and gangly and was able to find a pair of comfortable coveralls no problem, and I think they went by a combination of inseam, size, and a tall option, with a cinch around the waist. Between coveralls and boots with zippers it's way faster to jump into than the old setup, no question.

The 'two layers' of the new NCD jacket is BS though, and no way the new one performs as well as the old setup (tshirt, blue shirt, black jacket) in a flash exposure. The baggy air pockets and actual layers between the different items provided a huge amount of protection, so it was really just your face and hands that were exposed. Still waiting to see what the actual tests showed, but not sure if any was done to compare them against the old NCDs.
I was referencing the "old" NCDs, as they are all that I have experience with, and what I am currently issued. The summer weight sea boots are the best boots the CAF has ever issued to me, they are comfortable, light, breathable, and actually come in a size that fits.

I have zero doubt that coveralls can be made that fit everyone, but I know how the CAF works, so know the CAF will never get the sizing right. I'll take a few extra seconds getting dressed, over daily misery in a set of coveralls that don't fit.
 
I consider myself one as well. I would like to see the RCN return to a more pre-unification NCM rank insignia. I think our tunics should have 8 buttons. I think our medals should be mounted high on the jacket not above the pocket.

I also think the only time for salt and peppers or my tunic, ect ect, is on a parade or other public duties. Work, be it in an office or ship or warehouse or machine shop, should be a simple comfortable uniform that properly displays rank, name and trade, for ease of identification.

One thing I have noticed since I have been wearing CADPAT everyday is how much more interaction the public wants to have with me. I get thanks and conversation every time I go get lunch or stop at the grocery store on the way home. It never happened in Naval uniforms.

I put in a request to the dress committee for getting dress pants with a "flexible waist" because no matter how fit you are your belly expands and contracts throughout the day. Anyway it went nowhere.

Maybe a UCR?

The CADPAT thing? Army is the first thing that comes to mind when civilians see it. I know that you hate it but the ONLY thing that screams Navy to the general public is Square Rig or Cracker Jack. All the NAVY/MARINE, anchors, HMCS stuff stuck on our NCD's and hats doesn't hide the impression to Hussain public that you are some sort of plumber.

It is what it is.
 
For at sea work, why not commercial coveralls with reflective tape? Just need epaulettes.

Similar to this ScanRally Reflect Women

1011.01_A_03.jpg
 
The CADPAT thing? Army is the first thing that comes to mind when civilians see it. I know that you hate it but the ONLY thing that screams Navy to the general public is Square Rig or Cracker Jack. All the NAVY/MARINE, anchors, HMCS stuff stuck on our NCD's and hats doesn't hide the impression to Hussain public that you are some sort of plumber.

It is what it is.

You're probably right, I hated admitting that ;) . I am hoping our switch to the new NCDs will add something... And perhaps going back to berets for in and out dress or conducting business outside of DND establishments.
 
You're probably right, I hated admitting that ;) . I am hoping our switch to the new NCDs will add something... And perhaps going back to berets for in and out dress or conducting business outside of DND establishments.
I hope the RCN ditches the useless beret entirely. Either stick to a practical hat or drop hats as a requirement outside of parades.

Not one person outside of the CAF thinks a beret looks "professional".

The biggest "problem" the average civilian has with spotting a sailor on the street is that we don't wear camouflage uniforms. Airhumans, and soldiers get recognized more often entirely because the camouflage looks more "military" to the average civilian.
 
For at sea work, why not commercial coveralls with reflective tape? Just need epaulettes.

Similar to this ScanRally Reflect Women
First responder ones already have epaulette options as well, and I'm sure there are others with the same option.

Name tapes are great for the uniforms getting laundered together, but otherwise we don't need to overthink it too much IMO. For the techs anyway, it would be good to have some coveralls for wear as actual coveralls while doing maintenance, even if the rest of the RCN doesn't want it. Not uncommon for some of them to occasionally be down to the last clean uniform when they are only entitled to 3 (unless deployed) and you have a few spills/clogs etc that they get called to sort out. The folks in the laundry are normally pretty good about it, but if you have to bin a set of uniforms due to something like a fuel spill can be hit or miss if there are any spares onboard in their size to replace it.

High Level Rescue Coverall - Safety Source Fire
 
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