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UNAUTHORIZED DISPOSAL OF COMBAT UNIFORMS AND EQUIPMENT

Hey guys,

I did read in the DND news web site last summer that a supply tech (Edmonton) has given trywalls full of cadpat items to an Army Surplus by mistake.
Those trywall were supposed to go to destruction and were mistakably given away. They said that the DND try to get back the stuff, but in some case it was too late.
The guy already had them sold to other Army surplus for a very good price. I had too laugh about it. (Even if it is not funny). Shit Happen.

As for investigation about CADPAT on E-Bay, i know that CFNIS has a team that just take care of that for the last 2 years. So this is not new news for DND.
 
well..... is this all that much different from my being able to purchase Combat clothing from the local surplus store in 1970 at the height of the October crisis - while there were armed troops patroling the streets of Montreal?

Until such time as the CF choses to forbid Crown Assets disposal (or whatever their name is these days) from unloading the worn out kit to the highest bidder.... you'll always find kit in the stores.
 
geo said:
Until such time as the CF choses to forbid Crown Assets disposal (or whatever their name is these days) from unloading the worn out kit to the highest bidder.... you'll always find kit in the stores.

We gotta pay for helicopters somehow.

Certain stuff is modified before it's sold (file cabinets, for example).  Shredding CADPAT for use as hunting scrim is a good plan.  Selling intact shirts/pants etc. is not.
 
hey, we do enough painting on our bases that we can easily go thru all of the scrap material as paint rags.....
otherwise, chop it up, roll it up & smoke em if you have em ;)
 
Squadron CO said:
I guess the owner somehow forgot to return the vest when he released....
More than likely he filed a Miscellaneous Loss report stating that it had been "Lost or Stolen," accepted responsibility, his supervisor had to sign off at the very least because it is a CTS item that incorporates the cadpat material. He probably also agreed to re-imburse the Crown the full dollar value of the item, and did so ensuring that his MLR did not have to travel any further up his CoC for investigation. What's paying full dollar value to the CF for it when you know you're gonna get 8 or 9 hundred bucks U.S. for it on E-Bay?

Bottom line is the guy's a thief who lied (while serving) on offical government paperwork and I hope he/she swings for it.

Even if this was erroneously removed from his charge (or wasn't on it at all) by the Supply Section...the following applies:

Further, IAW regulations it is every CF members duty and responsibility to report any items paid for by the Crown that they have in their personal posession but are not on their charge. IAW regulations it is the members responsibility to report these items to Clothing Stores so that they may be put onto the member's charge. It is considered theft of Crown Assets to keep an item which is not next-to-skin or not authorized for retention upon release just because it's not on your charge. 

There's an awful lot of soldiers serving out there who certainly aren't reporting what they have surplus either, which is still considered theft.

So for those to whom this applies...next time you go to clothing and they say you have one each of XX on your charge (or none) but you know you actually have XX qty sitting at home in your basement... are you going to do the right thing??

As long as the items are on your charge you'll have no problems. But if perchance the MPs go through your house/shack etc and it isn't on your charge (or you don't have a receipt from a surplus store showing you bought one there)...then you've got worries my friends.
 
A lot of this stuff gets into the surplus system directly from the manufacturers. When they are contracted to make 1,000 Cadpat widgets and find themselves with an overrun of 50-100, or when their delivery of 50 pieces is refused because it doesn't meet Quality Assurance standards, these companies will sell them to anyone to recoup something for their time and material.
 
Servicepub said:
A lot of this stuff gets into the surplus system directly from the manufacturers. When they are contracted to make 1,000 Cadpat widgets and find themselves with an overrun of 50-100, or when their delivery of 50 pieces is refused because it doesn't meet Quality Assurance standards, these companies will sell them to anyone to recoup something for their time and material.

How dare you interrupt our witch hunt.  :rage:  I know perfectly well a second key to the clothing stores in Gagetown had been fashioned from a block of soap, and we were about to prove it using the principles of geometric logic.  A quart of strawberries is nothing to sneeze at either.

And for God's sake, tuck your shirt flap in!
 
Michael Dorosh said:
How dare you interrupt our witch hunt.   :rage:  I know perfectly well a second key to the clothing stores in Gagetown had been fashioned from a block of soap, and we were about to prove it using the principles of geometric logic.  A quart of strawberries is nothing to sneeze at either.
And for God's sake, tuck your shirt flap in!
Geez Michael thanks for the heads up..I'll have to change my locks tomorrow!!  :)

A lot of this stuff gets into the surplus system directly from the manufacturers. When they are contracted to make 1,000 Cadpat widgets and find themselves with an overrun of 50-100, or when their delivery of 50 pieces is refused because it doesn't meet Quality Assurance standards, these companies will sell them to anyone to recoup something for their time and material.

They shouldn't be. Our suppliers are expressly forbidden as part of the contract to get rid of any excess or overruns of CTAT/ITAR items in their contracts as part of the DPA (Defense Production Act). Supplier's of a CTAT/ITAR item have gone through the security process and are also subject to CTAT/ITAR regulations. As these suppliers are indeed manufacturing a controlled good for the CF, they are subject to the DPA. They are still allowed to sell any over-runs or surplus of an uncontrolled item but not any item which is subject to CTAT/ITAR Regulations (that would include the clothing items now for sale on E-Bay):

CTAT:
http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/admfincs/subjects/daod/3003/1_e.asp

For Defense Suppliers:

"Under the Defence Production Act it is an offence for a person who is not registered under that Act to knowingly examine, possess or transfer a controlled good. The registration requirements do not apply to a person who occupies a position in the federal public service or a federal Crown Corporation, or is employed by Her Majesty in right of a province, who acts in good faith in the course of their duties and employment."

For those of us who do occupy posns in the DND or the CF:

"Policy Statement
DND and the CF are committed to demonstrating responsiveness to, and responsibility for, all laws and regulations in respect of controlled goods.

Requirements
DND and the CF must:

ensure that all controlled goods are identified and afforded the necessary level of protection to prevent their unauthorized examination, possession or transfer;

ensure that DND employees and CF members exercise due diligence and permit access to controlled goods only by persons so authorized under the Defence Production Act and the Controlled Goods Regulations; and provide for reporting and investigation if the security of a controlled good is compromised in any way.

Authority
Authority Table The following table identifies the authorities responsible for implementing the policy.

The Vice Chief of the Defence Staff (VCDS)
has the authority to direct that the management of controlled goods be included in business plans.

ADM(Mat)
approve and administer policy for controlled goods."
 
I just wanted to clarify a few comments made by CEL... firstly he is confusing ITAR/CTAT and Demil codes with CF regulations and Supply procedures, CF QR&Os state that all CADPAT uniforms are to be destroyed, the ALM 007 Supply Manual expands on this directive and provides specific instructions on how CADPAT items are to be shredded/destroyed before being declared surplus (the only thing surplus dealers are supposed to end up with are CADPAT rags). ITAR/CTAT and demil codes are primarily a means to appease the Americains when it comes to shipping/disposal of what they consider shared sensitive material.These are mainly comprised of weapons system, communications, and sensor components. And yes some CADPAT items are actually cataloged as CTAT. However regardless of CTAT/ITAR designation and which Demil code is used, under CF Law all CADPAT is to be destroyed, and any items which aren't , whether intentional or through negligence and/or ignorance. This material is now leaving the CF through illegal means. In case anyone is wondering I am a Supply Tech currently serving in the CF and I am well aware of the regulations and directives I am referring to. For any members out there who are not aware there is currently a nationwide investigation being conducted in regards to actual issue CADPAT items being sold on the Internet and through surplus dealers.
 
Surely there is law preventing civis from wearing military uniforms in public.  I am speaking about the full regalia that is meant to convince someone that the person wearing the uniform is agenuine regular enlisted person, then that person should be made to answer to criminal charges.  Today's world events justify this as a reasonable limitation on civil liberties.  Civies just gotta use their heads.
 
bboyintown said:
Surely there is law preventing civis from wearing military uniforms in public.  I am speaking about the full regalia that is meant to convince someone that the person wearing the uniform is agenuine regular enlisted person, then that person should be made to answer to criminal charges.  Today's world events justify this as a reasonable limitation on civil liberties.  Civies just gotta use their heads.

There IS a law against it.  See my post #6 on the previous page.
 
Well EBay is still selling CADPAT on their site.

Seems that DND and the NIS isn't going after them too fast.    ::)

Regards
 
Franko said:
Well EBay is still selling CADPAT on their site.

Seems that DND and the NIS isn't going after them too fast.    ::)

Regards

http://cgi.ebay.com/Canadian-Army-Cadpat-Shirt-Genuine-Issue-Size-6744_W0QQitemZ6614933099QQcategoryZ104023QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Like this? Hmmm. Lots of kosher commercial stuff on there, but this shirt is troublesome.
 
You would think that the press taking an issue like this...

EBay would have been contacted by DND and that legal consequences would be taken if this wasn't addressed.

Regards
 
I don't get this. ebat will shut down any auction at the slightest accusation so I can't figure why that would be on there.
 
I KNOW WHY THE DND IS UNAWARE OF CADPAT ON EBAY!!!

The DWAN computers have E-bay blocked, along with hotmail and a few others! The MPs could not investigate because the jimmies police them too well!

The irony.....
 
LOL! Still all it takes is one email to ebay questionong the legitimacy of an auction and they'll pull stuff; it doesn't even have to come from DND or the copyright holder/whatever.

 
GO!!! said:
I KNOW WHY THE DND IS UNAWARE OF CADPAT ON EBAY!!!

The DWAN computers have E-bay blocked, along with hotmail and a few others! The MPs could not investigate because the jimmies police them too well!

The irony.....

They only blocked ebay about a year or so ago. Too bad, it was quite convenient for getting pictures of regimental stuff for various purposes. Ah well.

And as pointed out, anyone can put a complaint into ebay, if you can find your way through the annoying form-filling process for about 20 minutes.
 
Interesting, because that shirt has been for sale several times.  Obviously, someone has a few of these lying around.  Interesting to note that the tac vest that was for sale last week was removed from auction by the seller on the 15th.
 
Maybe they dont SEEM to care because most of the stuff there is fake...and they know what is what.
 
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